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Comcast Announces More the 1,000 HD Choices

Discussion in 'Tech Talk - Gadgets, Gizmos and Technology' started by garys, Nov 14, 2008.

  1. Nov 16, 2008 #41 of 125
    Jack White

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    It's still not as deceptive as Dish Claiming to have Bluray Quality Picture and Sound on Turbo HD. Bluray has 40Mbps Headroom For Demanding Video Content, 7.1 channel DTS HD and Dolby Tru HD sound as well as LOSSLESS AUDIO Capabilities.
     
  2. Nov 16, 2008 #42 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    You have a valid point...

    In addition.....even Swanni has now gotten on the Comcrap deception bandwagon:

    http://www.tvpredictions.com/comcast111308.htm
     
  3. Nov 16, 2008 #43 of 125
    jpl

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    What?! You mean Comcast dares to promote the benefits of THEIR service by talking about how much HD VOD they have? The monsters! And DirecTV promotes itself by including PPV in their channel line-ups? Have they no shame!? Next you'll be telling me that Dish actually promotes how good their hardware is.

    Come on... if you like your service provider, who gives a rip what the other guys are selling? But they're being dishonest! Welcome to advertizing. But some people are going to get taken in by it! Yeah, again, welcome to the world of advertizing. Besides, what one person looks for is different from what the next person is looking for. If I like renting alot of HD movies, and I don't care about things like NFL ST, then guess what? Comcast would be the better choice for me. That's what everyone seems to be missing - yes, all services have their pros and they all have their cons. Which is the 'best service'? It depends on what you're looking for.

    It's like saying 'what's the best car?' While there are some measures that you can compare against, the 'best car' for me depends on what I'm looking for. If I'm looking for flat-out acceleration, then a Corvette may be my 'best car'. If I'm looking to haul my family of 6, then a mini-van may be my 'best car'.

    Do I think some of the ads get silly? Yeah, I do. Comcast has been running ads in this area where they're doing 'interventions'. Going to DirecTV customers homes (these aren't made up - they literally go into a DirecTV customer's home), and show them the difference in HD offerings between DirecTV and Comcast.
     
  4. Nov 17, 2008 #44 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

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    Me thinks you missed the point - its plain wrong to compare apples and refrigerators (even though Comcast is knowingly trying to do just that). :eek2: :D
     
  5. Nov 17, 2008 #45 of 125
    jpl

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    No, I got the point, but I don't think it's a real great one, to be honest. Again, if I'm big on renting HD movies, then wouldn't Comcast really have more HD content than DirecTV? From my perspective, yeah, it would. I guess I have trouble understanding why it's bad for Comcast to advertize how much HD VOD content they have - that's their big selling point. They've spent alot on developing and growing HD VOD. Besides, as someone else pointed out, if I can get 100 HD VOD movie titles through my cable service, how is that any different than DirecTV counting their HD PPV feeds as channels? Aren't they effectively the same thing? Yes, they are.

    While I think what Comcast is doing is a tad dishonest, I also think counting full PPV channels in your HD channel line-up is a tad dishonest too. I just think that people tend to take these things personally - that was the point of my post. Why do I care how, e.g., Dish advertizes their stuff? Do I have Dish? Nope. Am I considering Dish? Nope. Am I happy with my provider? Yeah - very. So... do I care that Comcast is running those commercials? No. In fact, I take it as a positive sign. When you go after your competition like that, it's because your competition is taking a bite out of your numbers. The reason Comcast is doing this is because other providers (DirecTV and FiOS, e.g.) are taking big bites out of them.

    Like I said, welcome to the wonderful world of advertizing.
     
  6. Nov 17, 2008 #46 of 125
    Steve Mehs

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    That right there goes to show you how much you know about the subject. Dish Network, DirecTV and cable receive channels from the programming providers using huge Cband dishes at either the cable headend or a DBS providers uplink facility or a direct fiber link in some cases. DirecTV is a middleman just like Comcast. You receive nothing direct. Whether I watch Fox News on DirecTV or Time Warner it all originates from the same place, so don't try to pull that crap on me.

    And comparing broadcast satellite technology using C band to DBS mini dishes is laughable. It's like me saying Guess how your satellite dish is connected to your IRD, that's right with a CABLE. So you maybe don't know it, but the channels you have at home come through a dish (well LNB actually) and are distributed to your outlets with a CABLE.

    Nor would I want it. I see my Bills on TV every week. I'd rather pay $400 for a few Bills tickets then get raped by DirecTV.

    Like when someone gets DirecTV and for the first time sits down to enjoy 130 HD channels only to find out a good portion of them are DNS locals they don't qualify for, blacked out RSNs and a bunch of PPV channels. Do you inform and educate the potential DirecTV customers about that as well?
     
  7. Nov 17, 2008 #47 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

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    Then you apparently accept the premise that intentionally misleading uneducated people with deceptive marketing spin is a perfectly acceptable practice.

    OK I understand.
     
  8. Nov 17, 2008 #48 of 125
    Steve Mehs

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    Again, show me an advertisement that is 100% honest, not misleading, no lying by omission, no misrepresentation. Comcast is no better nor worse than DirecTV. You just hate cable so you've single the industry out and your looking at it with an extremely biased view. Where's your complaint about Arby's, since the roast beef sandwiches they show on TV are nowhere near as big as the squished thing you actually get. Every company has a deceptive marketing spin.
     
  9. Nov 17, 2008 #49 of 125
    Alan Gordon

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    For the record, I disagree with DirecTV's counting of PPV and HD-DNS channels (even though I receive a couple of the HD-DNS channels). I also disagree with Dish Network's counting of part-time RSNs.

    That being said, Comcast would be wise to brag about the amount of VOD choices they have in HD... all in real time (compared to DirecTV or Dish) as that's actually impressive (and superior)... because while I don't agree with DirecTV and Dish Network counting some of the channels they do, at least it's still channels.

    ~Alan
     
  10. Nov 17, 2008 #50 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

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    Uh....if you look at the REAL DirecTV HD Channel list, you can clearly see that your representation is totally and plain wrong. Most are National HD Channels. Blackouts are very rare (I've had 1 in the past year), and PPV HD channels makes up a limited fraction of the overall list.

    But then.....that's just more of the same old Cable KoolAid Propaganda. :rolleyes:

    Read em and weep...

    A&E HD
    ABC HD (East)
    ABC HD (West)
    ABC Family HD
    Altitude HD*
    Animal Planet HD
    Big Ten Network HD
    Biography Channel HD
    Bravo HD
    Cartoon Network
    CBS HD (East)
    CBS HD (West)
    Cinemax HD East
    Cinemax HD West
    CMT HD
    CNBC HD+
    CNN HD
    CSN Bay Area HD*
    CSN Chicago HD
    CSN Mid-Atlantic HD
    CSN New England HD
    CSTV HD
    Discovery Channel HD
    Disney Channel HD
    ESPN HD
    ESPN2 HD
    ESPNews HD
    Food Network HD
    Fox Business Network HD
    Fox HD (East)
    Fox HD (West)
    Fox News Channel HD
    FSN Arizona HD
    FSN Cincinnati HD*
    FSN Detroit HD
    FSN Florida HD*
    FSN Midwest HD
    FSN North HD
    FSN Northwest HD
    FSN Ohio*
    FSN Pittsburgh HD
    FSN Prime Ticket HD
    FSN Rocky Mountain HD
    FSN South HD
    FSN Southwest HD
    FSN West HD
    Fuel TV HD
    FX HD
    HBO HD East
    HBO HD West
    HD Theater
    HDNet
    HDNet Movies
    HGTV-HD
    History Channel HD
    MASN HD*
    MGM HD
    Palladia HD
    MSG HD
    MSG PLUS HD
    MTV HD
    National Geographic HD
    NBA.TV HD
    NBC HD (East)
    NBC HD (West)
    NESN HD
    NFL Network HD
    NHL Network HD
    Nick HD
    Planet Green HD
    Sci-Fi Channel HD
    Science Channel HD
    Showtime HD
    Showtime Extreme HD
    Showtime Showcase HD
    Showtime West HD
    Showtime 2 HD
    Smithsonian Channel HD
    SNY HD
    Speed Channel HD
    Spike HD
    SportSouth HD
    SportsTime Ohio HD*
    Starz Comedy HD
    Starz Edge HD
    Starz HD East
    Starz HD West
    Starz Kids & Family HD
    Sun Sports HD
    TBS in HD
    Tennis Channel HD
    The 101 Network HD
    The Movie Channel HD
    The Weather Channel HD
    TLC HD
    TNT HD
    Toon Disney HD
    Universal HD
    USA Network HD
    VERSUS HD/GOLF CHANNEL HD
    VH1 HD
    YES HD
    Pay Per View channels (28+)
    Plus, an ever-growing library of On-Demand movies & shows
     
  11. Nov 17, 2008 #51 of 125
    jpl

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    No, of course not. Don't tell me that you can't possibly tell the difference between 'spin' and outright deception. I guess maybe that's why the courts get involved in these things. Do I think they all play fast and loose with some of these terms? Yeah. DirecTV isn't innocent with this either. For example, part of their channel line-up includes distant nationals - both east and west coast versions - for a total of 8. How many DirecTV customers even qualify for those channels? I'll bet it's a real small number.

    When someone claims they have the best service, aren't they spinning? Yeah, they are. When Comcast claims they have more fiber than Verizon, isn't that spinning? Yeah. Is it true? I'm sure it is.

    I guess I'm not sure why everyone gets so bent out of shape over these ads. It's like you guys take it personally - like Comcast is targeting you.

    Final, to answer the question of 'content' you have to ask what Comcast means by that. I mean, it's not exactly like they hide this stuff. If you have any doubts over what their HD channel line-up is, just go to their website. I mean at some point the consumer has to take SOME responsibility for their purchasing decisions. No, I don't believe you allow for outright deception, but when it comes to subjective measures (and yes, 'most HD content' is one of those measures) I think you set a real dangerous precendent if you clamp down on that kind of advertizing.
     
  12. Nov 17, 2008 #52 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

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    I guess some of us don't feel there is a difference.
     
  13. Nov 17, 2008 #53 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    I guess some of us don't feel there is a difference, other than the motivation.
    Actually, I laugh at Comcast almost everyday, even when they DO target my mailbox on almost a daily basis here.
     
  14. Nov 17, 2008 #54 of 125
    Renard

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  15. Nov 17, 2008 #55 of 125
    jpl

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    Did you even read the article? There's nothing deceptive in there at all. They talk about their HD 'choices' - as in 'titles'. Hell, they even go further - they talk about HD VOD choices. They even go to the length of breaking out some of the numbers. Look, I'm no fan of Comcast either, but come on - there's nothing deceptive about the article. I guess I'm having a hard time understanding the outrage.
     
  16. Nov 17, 2008 #56 of 125
    hdtvfan0001

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    I read their press release, saw the commericals several times now, AND saw the marketing piece here now 3 times in the mail. Article no.

    Phoney as a 3 dollar bill.

    As for outrage...Naaaaah.....its more like a huge laugh at Comcast. :D
     
  17. Nov 17, 2008 #57 of 125
    jpl

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    Ugh... not this one again. Ok, let's take this from the top. Not all cable operators compress their signals. Verizon doesn't. They get their video feeds and pass them as they are - the ONLY exception to this is when they have to pass along a channel broadcast in mpeg-4 (since fios is all mpeg-2 they have to repackage the channel feed). This notion that cable is more limited than DBS in terms of bandwidth is just a fallacy. Verizon uses QAM just like standard cable. They just went through an expansion, to use the full 870 MHz spectrum on their TV feed. What does that give them?

    Well, it gives them 135 QAM channels to play with (FiOS is also all digital). How many channels can they carry, without additional compression, in that type of set-up? Alot. How many? Well, each QAM can carry data at a rate of ~40Mbps - fast enough to carry 2 HD channels without additional compression, or 8 - 9 SD digital channels. Verizon committed to carrying 150 HD channels with this configuration. Let's say they do that - let's say they reserve the space to carry 150 HD channels. Do the math - that takes up 75 QAMs. Ok, that leaves 60 for SD... and how many SD digital channels can you carry on 60 QAMs? Again, do the math - at 8 - 9 channels per QAM, that comes out to somewhere between 480 and 540 SD digital channels on top of those 150 HD. All without additional compression. Name for me a DBS service that can hit that.

    And that's not all - QAM can go further. Many cable systems are working on rolling out DOCSIS 3.0, which allows for a substantially higher data transfer rate. Some are opting to go with 1GHz service. And some are starting to move to mpeg-4, giving them even more room.

    This notion that all cable is over-compressed because they're out of room is utter nonsense. Verizon, just today, rolled out 17 new HD, and 8 new SD, channels in my area, bringing my HD total to 104 - and that doesn't include PPV, VOD, or even the premium sports stuff. And there are at least another 8 - 9 coming within the next couple weeks.
     
  18. Nov 17, 2008 #58 of 125
    Steve Mehs

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    No, others know the subject, you just don't. And you continue to prove that.
    Where did I say that? You're the one that said that and I quote "Eliminate the cable and you recieve the channels directly from the sats with a Dish, hence the name Directv" and I said "DirecTV is a middleman just like Comcast. You receive nothing direct. Whether I watch Fox News on DirecTV or Time Warner it all originates from the same place" same place being Fox News' uplink. You're the one under the impression your getting a direct feed, not me.
    Um every time I'm on the I490 I pass by the back of Time Warner of Rochester's local headend. It's a dish and antenna farm with tons of c band dishes. Some channels are fiber fed, I know WXXI PBS in Rochester had a direct fiber link to TW. And a lot of cable companies are HFC, a good portion of Time Warner's cable network is fiber.

    And I said that, and DirecTV and Dish do the samething, only instead of passing it through a fiber or coax cable it's beamed back up to a satellite. DirecTV is a middleman just like Comcast. You receive nothing direct. Whether I watch Fox News on DirecTV or Time Warner it all originates from the same place,

    With SDV there really is no lack of bandwidth at the moment hense why many TW divisions are adding HD channels left and right now that a good portion of them have upgraded. And there is no bitrate starvation. An SDV channel looks just as good as a QAM channel on my system. And as for noise, digital is not subjected to noise like analog. We have digital simulcast, my line up has been 100% digital for over two years now with an exception of one of the community access channels. I could live next door from the cable headend and get the same picture quality.

    Last time I had analog cable was 1998. made the switch to Dish, then DirecTV, then back to TW when they started digital simulcasting

    I've never seen analog cband, but from what I understand, and what people have said, it beats the hell out of digital satellite. No compression.
     
  19. Nov 17, 2008 #59 of 125
    Steve Mehs

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    So, whats your point? Yes I know the DirecTV HD line up, nothing to weep about as I have a good portion of them, a good portion are RSNs that would be blacked out for anything important, I, like millions of others don't qualify for DNS. And a handful of other are in my future. So you're telling me on all the RSNs you don't get blacked out for pro sports. Nice try. Drink some more DirecTV KoolAid why donchya!

    - 58 New HD titles On Demand, plus older movies

    Not to mention, ESPN U HD, Travel Channel HD, Hallmark Movie Channel HD, LMN HD, Outdoor Channel HD and Crime & Investigation HD gets add tomorrow.

    So what am I supposed to weep about again?
     
  20. Nov 18, 2008 #60 of 125
    jpl

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    Just out of curiosity, if for no other reason, is TWC running SDV for you guys? Like I said, just curious - I have a feeling that's where the industry as a whole is headed, and was curious as to how your system implemented it (e.g. I take it that TW wasn't stupid enough to require a separate coax for each channel feed - that they carry all the channels that you're selecting over the same coax). Is it mixed with QAM at all? I just find this stuff interesting (yeah, I'm a geek with this stuff).
     

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