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Communion denied

Discussion in 'The OT' started by Redster, Aug 20, 2004.

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  1. Redster

    Redster Godfather/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    "An 8-year-old girl who suffers from a rare digestive disorder and cannot eat wheat has had her first Holy Communion declared invalid because the wafer contained no wheat."

    Link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5762478/

    From the article, I understand that they are trying to resolve this.
     
  2. Danny R

    Danny R Goblin the Pug DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Don't catholics believe in transubstantiation? I guess God doesn't have the power to actually change rice. :nono2:
     
  3. HappyGoLucky

    HappyGoLucky Banned User

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    As I've said many times before, nobody can ever acuse religionists of being logical. :D
     
  4. Pete K.

    Pete K. Icon

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    This is nuts. The church should make an exception, period.
     
  5. koji68

    koji68 Icon

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    Hummm!! What would Jesus do? He'd probably exclude a sick 8 year old. Yeah that sounds about right.

    The Catholic Church (read Bishops and up here) have lost touch with what their mission is. Going out of their way to say that the First Communion of a sick person is not valid is wrong and anti-chistian. Just because the host didn't have gluten???

    Priests setting rules that oppress the people... Where did I read this before?
     
  6. Geronimo

    Geronimo Native American Potentate DBSTalk Gold Club

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    I am not going to say that I agree with this because I do not. But an intolerance to wheat/gluten can actually make one ineligible for the priesthood.

    Again Ia m not ina ccord with this but I am not surprised as it is a long standing policy.
     
  7. Neil Derryberry

    Neil Derryberry Hall Of Fame

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    Careful now... the church hasn't lost touch, but the local church/bishop there might have.

    I know a guy that I used to attend mass with that had a gluten allergy.. he bought his own gluten-free communion hosts and he would let the priest saying mass know that he was there.. the host he could consume would be placed on the paten with the large host for the mass, and both he and the priest knew the deal.. my friend just stood in line for the priest instead of a different minister of communion.

    However.. you don't have to receive in both species to "recieve communion", or as it is properly called, eucharist. One species (body or blood) is fine and perfectly valid.
     
  8. Geronimo

    Geronimo Native American Potentate DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Many communities do not offer sacramental wine to children. So that solution may not be appropriate. I think it is great that your friend found a priest willing to accomodate him but I have heard other stories---involving adults----like this one and the article more or less goes along with this.

    While we don't hear about thsi often it is not unheard of and the church has dealt with the issue in the past.

    here si a link to church policy. It sis supposed to be somewhat more tolerant now than in the past. http://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodid=369&p_catid=37&sid=91hH9H0-o0DE5kb-23104486571.14
     
  9. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Hall Of Fame

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    Wait a minute - the eucharist includes blood?

    Does that mean that Catholics are vampires? :eek2: :rolleyes:
     
  10. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Body and Blood of Christ - Cannibalism too! :)

    This transubstantitation tenet one of the major atrributes that differentiates Catholicism from even the protestant sects closest to it (like Lutheranism). It seems unfair for people who havfe the allergy, but gluten is a necessary ingredient for the transformation into the body of Christ. The eucharist is NOT symbolic, it is an actual transformation and occurs at a specific point in the Mass. Likewise, if the eucharist is not totally consumed, it must be properly stored in the tabernancle. In older times, if the host was droppped on the floor or altar rail, that piece would be cut out and destroyed.
     
  11. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Hall Of Fame

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    Mmmmm. Makes me want some more Mike Soup. :D
     
  12. Bogy

    Bogy Hall Of Fame

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    I've used Pepsi and cookies. But for me Communion IS symbolic.
     
  13. pjmrt

    pjmrt Hall Of Fame

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    Well, actually He'd probably heal her and she'd eat anything with no problem - that's what he did with everyone else.

    But I agree - the catholic church seems overly focused on ritual rules (and faulty reading of the scriptures) and also over emphasize communion.
     
  14. BuckeyeChris

    BuckeyeChris Icon/Supporter

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    It must be fashionable to bash Catholics, as that's how I interpret some of the ignorant posts by some. Kudos, however, to Rich who was dead on with his explanation.

    If I were the girl's father, I would tell her that the church's rules on wheat in communion bread are not meant to exclude her because of her disease; they are part of long held beliefs and traditions that Catholics revere and venerate. I would tell her that she could take wine as part of communion, the blood of Christ, which is a wonderful and miraculous sacrament. A little bit of communion wine for children is not going to harm her one bit (many European children, for example, drink wine safely as part of their meals). I would also let her know that there are other wonderful sacraments that await her like marriage, which is perhaps the most wonderful and rewarding of them all.
     
  15. zman977

    zman977 Godfather

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    An argument to tradition is a false argument. Just because something has been done for a long time does not make it right and it is no reason to discriminate against someone for having a digestive problem. If she cannot have wheat than an alternative shoule be provided. it would be the Christian thing to do.
     
  16. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    I think the point to be made here is that it is not a "tradition". It is a fundamental belief of the Catholic Church. It is a belief that Christ is not present unless the bread has gluten. Catholics believe that the bread turns into the body of Christ. Without gluten, there is no transformation. The girl is not being denied communion. The Catholic church is only clarifying what the essential ingredients are for transubstantiation to occur.
     
  17. invaliduser88

    invaliduser88 Welcome to Torchwood DBSTalk Gold Club

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    The Spanish Inquisition
     
  18. Paladin

    Paladin Banned User

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    Not being Catholic, I really can't understand this ideal. Nothing in the Bible mentions that the bread has the have gluten. Nor does the Bible mention that the bread turns to Christ's body or wine turns to blood. Communion is a representation of Christ's body and the person becoming one with Christ. I have taken communion hundreds of times and I have never gotten the impression that the bread turns to flesh or the wine turns to blood. We use a rice wafer and grape juice. Is my salvation in jepordy because I didn't follow some tradition the Catholic church made up off the top of their heads? Absolutely not, but probably for other reasons. :lol:
     
  19. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    If you want to be, or call yourself, a Catholic, then you have to abide by church dogma. This is the reason I am no longer a Catholic, I wasn't tortured because I left that sect. Comparing this incident with the Spanish Inquisition is just plain silly.
     
  20. HappyGoLucky

    HappyGoLucky Banned User

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    In a way it is a valid comparison for it simply illustrates how unrealistic and vacuous many religions, especially the Catholic version, is in their adherence to dogma versus logic and reason. The Inquisition was an extreme instance of this example, of course, with the withholding of communion being relatively benign. But an example of the same mindset nonetheless.
     
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