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Confused about SWM. Have two DVRs and cannot run a 2nd line to either one.

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Installation/MDU Discussion' started by ccualumni, Jan 27, 2009.

  1. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    I just got HDTV installed in my house with DirecTV. I have had Directv for a few years. It is great and all that...

    I tried researching this, but did not have much luck and was hoping someone here would have some information or a link for me.

    I looked at some diagrams and it is not clear if they attach at the dish or inside the house,.

    They upgraded my dish, but the installer said that because of the house (finished basement and an attic - not sure why the attoc matters), they could not run a 2nd line to the dvrs.

    We have a total of 6 boxes hooked up for satellite. The guy had to run an extra line to the house and when he saw he had to do that, he did not seem too happy.

    I have two DVRs, one is HD and the other is not HD. They are both dual tuner, but neither have a 2nd line running to it. (I do not have the model numbers, but can get them if that matters).

    I heard that you can get a SWM switch (??) to attach to the line so that you only need one line to the TV to be able to use it with both tuners.

    1. How do I know which SWM switch I need and will it work on an HDTV DVR and one that is just a DVR?
    2. Will I need one switch per DVR?
    3. Does it attach to the DVR or does it go out by the antenna?
    4. I assume eBay is the cheapest place to get them.
    5. Are they all about the same or is a certain brand better than the other?
    6. Is this easy to install or will I have to get someone to do it? I am mechanically inclined, but just not too sure about this.
    7. It looks like I need more than just the switch. What all is needed?

    I know that is a ton of questions, but I would appreciate any help at all.

    Thanks
     
  2. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    You can run a total of eight tuners off of SWM-8 module or off of a SWM LNB. The beauty of SWM is that it allows you to run two tuners in a DVR with a single line. I used the SWM-8 module application for my setup. That meant taking the four lines from the Slimline into the SWM-8 and then a single line from there to a SWM splitter. In my case, since I only had a total of 5 tuners, I used a 4-way SWM splitter running one line to each of my two DVR (total of 4 tuners) and one HD receiver (1 tuner). Neat, easy to do and I didn't have to mess with my dish which is in a difficult location to get to. Once I bought and received the equipment from an eBay seller it took me all of 15 minutes to install and another 20-30 to bring the receivers back on line. All basic SWM products, either the SWM-8 or SWM LNB, are DirecTV equipment. Splitters can be from a number of different suppliers. Personally I used a DirecTV approved Holland 4-way splitter. Take a look at this guide from DirecTV, it will answer many of your questions: http://forums.directv.com/pe/Reposi...96641/SWM - Integrated LNB-ModuleTraining.pdf
     
  3. evan_s

    evan_s Hall Of Fame

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    Mar 3, 2008
    Really only 2 different Swms available. A SWM8 is a multi-switch that hooks up just like a normal multiswitch. A SWM-lnb replaces the existing LNB on your dish and provides SWM.
    No. A SWM8 or SWM lnb can run a max of 8 tuners with DVRs being 2 tuners.
    Depending on which you get it will either replace the LNB or go someplace where you can run all 4 wires from the dish into the SWM8.
    It can be the cheapest. www.Solidsignal.com and www.weakknees.com are popular online retailers.
    I know the LNBs have different mfgs but they all have the same specs and should be equivalent. Likely you won't know the MFG when you order.
    It's can be relatively easy but it depends on your existing setup and wiring.
    once again it depends on your current setup. The most likely thing you may need is either some additional cabling or some splitters.

    The first and most important thing to do is to check the model number on your SD DVR and all your receivers to make sure they will work with a SWM.
     
  4. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

    829
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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    Might add you can look at page 21 of the guide I attached in my previous posting to see if your receivers are listed. If all your receivers are listed then a SWM LNB would work for all. If not then the SWM LNB would not work for all but the SWM-8 module/switch would as it has extra outputs to feed signal to non-SWM receivers in addition to being able to feed up to 8 tuners on the SWM side.
     
  5. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    Thank you very much for the information.

    I have a few questions, but will wait until I read that guide to post them.

    Thanks again.
     
  6. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

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    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    With two DVR's (at 2 tuners each) plus four additional receivers (1 tuner each), you are up to a total of 8 tuners. An 8 channel SWM LNB or external SWM multiswitch can support 8 tuners, but your specific mix of models could be an issue. The D12, R16, R22, H2x series and HR2x series can use SWM. The D10, D11, and R15 cannot, nor can any models older than those.

    So, if all of your receivers and DVRs are SWM capable, then the easiest and simplest installation is to replace the LNB assembly in your slimline dish with an SWM LNB. Run one coax to someplace indoors where you can put the power inserter, then wire from there to all of your receivers.

    If you have receivers that are not SWM capable, then you can use a combination of an SWM8 and a WB68 wired in parallel. Feed the DVRs with the SWM and feed the rest of the receivers from the WB68 (this assumes both DVRs are SWM capable).
     
  7. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

    829
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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    My only concern or reservation about going the SWM LNB route is the lack of flexibility to support more than 8 tuners. At least with the SWM-8 module/switch you can add another SWM-8 or more to feed more than 8 tuners. But no doubt the SWM LNB is the quickest and least expensive approach.
     
  8. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    I was finally able to check my system and my HD DvR has SWM on it.

    It also has a filter on the back of it, which is labeled as a b-band converter. I guess that is for HDTV (??).

    My other DVR, does not have SWM on it and I guess it would have to have a 2nd line ran to it.

    I do not see why I could not run a line from the attic or something like to it.

    The problem is that outside, it seems like all of the connections are being used for the box out there.

    The box outside is:
    Zinwell
    Wide-Band 6X8 Multi-SW
    Part# WB68

    Since I have 6 boxed hooked up to it, is it possible to get a 2nd lline to my other DVR?

    I am getting the LNB to be able to watch shows on the HD equipment.


    I just thought of another question.

    I just got my first picture in pocture TV. DO I need a 2nd source to be able to watch PIP? I have a HD box on it, but it is not DVR. WOuld it b able to pick up a 2nd signal?

    Thanks. All of this is new to me and I am obviously lost.
     
  9. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

    829
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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    Hmmm.....you have a DVR labeled with SWM on input #1 and a BBC on it. Are you getting HD on that receiver now? If so it sounds like you've already got the right dish. If not then I'm not sure why the BBC is in place and if it's doing any good. Secondly, if you go with a SWM LNB and your other DVR is truly not SWM capable then it just became a doorstop. Legacy receivers will not work with a SWM LNB, only with a SWM-8 module which, again assuming you might already have a Slimline 5LNB dish, could replace the Zinwell or be hooked up in parallel with the Zinwell.
     
  10. evan_s

    evan_s Hall Of Fame

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    SWm on the back of the HD DVR just means it supports swm which is expected since all current HD Dvrs support SWM.
    The BBC is something needed by most HD boxes when they aren't using a SWM. Won't get into the details because it isn't really relevant here.
    What model DVR is this?
    This is your existing multiswitch. It takes the 4 inputs from the dish and gives you 8 outputs so you should have 2 available outputs.
    You are not going to want to get the SWM LNB. It can't be used with the multi-switch you have and doesn't support any legacy receivers so you if have any receivers that aren't SWM compatible you won't be able to use them anymore. A SWM8 could be used in combination with or in place of your existing Zinwell WB68 and could support 8 SWM devices and 3 legacy devices or 11 legacy devices when used in combination with the Zinwell.
    The HD DVR's can only output 1 thing at a time. It does output the same thing all all the ports but to use your TVs PiP you'd need 2 receivers their hooked up to 2 different inputs.
     
  11. evan_s

    evan_s Hall Of Fame

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    he's just seeing the SWM label on tuner 1 on the back of the receiver. It is not an indication he has a SWM setup. With a WB68 in his setup he clearly doesn't have a SWMlnb.
     
  12. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

    829
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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    Understood that....sorry I wasn't clearer in my comment. What I was getting at is that he might already have a Slimline 5LNB if he's got a DVR with a BBC hooked up to it and that he may not want to switch to a SWM LNB but instead do as you suggested in your post. Didn't mean to imply he already has SWM and wouldn't since the BBC wouldn't be in place. It's kind of unclear about what, if any, HD programming he's already receiving.
     
  13. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    Sorry for the confusion.

    The DVR with the BBC is getting HD.
    I have a brand new HD DVR with the BBC.
    I have an older DVR (R15), that only has one line to it and does not have the letters SWM on it.

    I do have the new slimline (??) dish now. IT is the wider dish that requires the bigger support that attaches to the house.

    Thanks
     
  14. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

    13
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    Jan 26, 2009
    Is it possible to hook up the LNB, but not connect it to the DVR it will not work with?

    I tried to get help from the installer, but he did not seem to want to help much. I was surprised because he would have made extra money by doing so.

    I really appreciate the help you guys are giving me.
     
  15. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

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    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    The WB68 has 8 output connectors on it. You can suppy a maximum of 8 tuners from it. A DVR has 2 tuners, a non-DVR has one tuner. You have six receivers total, at least 2 of which are DVRs (the HD DVR and the R15). If all of your other receivers are non-DVR, then you should be able to connect both tuners of both DVRs (4 connections) and the other 4 receivers (4 more connections), which adds up to the 8 outputs on the WB68.

    If any of your other receivers are DVRs (if you have 3 or more DVRs), then you don't have enough output ports on the WB68 to hook everything up. In that case you have two options. First, get another WB68 and hook it up in parallel to the first one, giving you 8 more output ports. Second, replace the WB68 with a WB616 (which has 16 output ports).

    In any case, to get the second tuner working in your R15 you have to run a second coax to it.
     
  16. evan_s

    evan_s Hall Of Fame

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    A slimline dish and SWM are 2 separate things. It does sound like you have a slimline dish and that is expected because they have been standard for a while now. You don't have a SWMLnb tho or you wouldn't have the WB68.

    You could get a SWMLnb and not hook up the R15 but obviously the receiver won't work at all with out a sat connection so that doesn't seem like a good idea =)

    The best option for you is going to be to get a SWM8 to replace the WB68. You would just disconnect the 4 wires from the dish heading into the WB68 and connect them to the 4 input wires on the SWM8. Hook the R15 up to two of the legacy outputs and then connect up the hd dvrs to the SWM outputs using splitters where needed.
     
  17. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    Thanks again for the information.

    I will start looking for one now at the sites you linked.

    I guess my only other issue is to figure out how to get a 2nd line from the SWM8 to the non-HD DVR (R15).

    Thanks
     
  18. randyk47

    randyk47 Icon

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    Aug 21, 2006
    San Antonio, TX
    If you physically can't run a second line then changing out the receiver to a SWM capable model is just about your only choice. If you can run a second line then the SWM-8 can support by using the legacy outputs on the module.
     
  19. ccualumni

    ccualumni Cool Member

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    Jan 26, 2009
    The set up is the two DVRs and the rest are normal boxes.
    The problem with the current set up is that there is way to run a 2nd line to the HD DVR, so I have to get rid of the current WB68 to upgrade.

    From what everyone has said here, there is no doubt that i need the SMW 8.

    Thanks for the information.

    Everyone here has been extremely happy and I really appreciate it.
     

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