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DIRECTV HD Receiver with TiVo (Official Q3 2010 Thread)

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by Stuart Sweet, Jun 24, 2010.

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  1. Jul 19, 2010 #41 of 765
    Mike Bertelson

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    This is total supposition on my part but I would think it would need to have MRV/SWM support.

    My theory goes like this...how could TiVo expect to sell any new service is it doesn’t support MRV/SWiM? Other than a few (and let's face it, that would be very few compared to the total customer base) diehard TiVo fans who don’t care about anything but the TiVo interface, I see people saying “with the DirecTV interface, I can watch anything from any DVR any where in the house, I’ll take it”.

    They have to appeal to new customers, so I would suspect it would need to have all the basic features of the current receivers.

    Hey, it’s a theory...but I’ve been wrong before. :grin:

    Mike
     
  2. Jul 19, 2010 #42 of 765
    bonscott87

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    It certainly would have to support SWM since most newly installed Dishes have SWM built into the LNB. MRV not required and I have big doubts they will include it.

    Because Tivo still thinks their poop doesn't stink. They've gone on for 10 yrs now of "build it and they will come" but they lose marketshare and subs every quarter and for some reason the Tivo executives still don't get that they need to change. Oh well.
     
  3. Jul 19, 2010 #43 of 765
    Stuart Sweet

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    I'd agree that SWiM Support would have to be mandatory. As for MRV, it would be great if it did, but I could completely see them putting the device out there without it.
     
  4. Jul 19, 2010 #44 of 765
    JBernardK

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    What would you do differently if you were a TiVo executive?
     
  5. Jul 19, 2010 #45 of 765
    Doug Brott

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    SWiM will likely be supported, but support for SWiM doesn't necessarily lead to support for MRV.
     
  6. Jul 19, 2010 #46 of 765
    jdspencer

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    From a technical standpoint, is it possible for DirecTV to port the TiVo interface into an existing HR DVR? Specifically, the HR24 since it's the latest box? It would also be nice if the user had the option to choose which interface they wanted to use. Similar to the option on the DirecTiVo to choose between two different styles of guide.
     
  7. Jul 19, 2010 #47 of 765
    Mike Bertelson

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    To extend my completely unsupportable theory a bit more...It would be bad business for DirecTV. That’s $3/mo they couldn’t get just because someone chose to have the TiVo interface. I doubt DirecTV would give up the potential income.

    Further, there will be a fee attached to having TiVo. How many people, including the diehards, would pay an extra fee that effectively disables MRV? Why the heck would DirecTV give up money so that TiVo can make money? IMHO, any feature that’s a revenue stream will most likely be included in the DirecTiVo.

    Of course I’m reminded of the recently posted EVO/iPhone video. There will always be those that, no matter what the feature set is, will say “I don’t care” and opt for TiVo. :grin:

    The question is can TiVo survive if they can’t lure large numbers of DirecTV customers?

    Can they attract enough subscribers to make this a worth while venture for them without MRV?

    Can TiVo survive as a company if they don’t bring in enough revenue from the DirecTiVo?

    I’m not a financial analyst but I suspect the answer to all of these is no.

    It’s a theory. :grin:

    Mike
     
  8. Jul 19, 2010 #48 of 765
    Sixto

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    Been wondering if the delay had something to do with a possible change in direction to port to a more current platform (HR24), and to properly support MRV.
     
  9. Jul 19, 2010 #49 of 765
    -Draino-

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    I can't believe TIVO is still in business.
     
  10. Jul 19, 2010 #50 of 765
    gregjones

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    If that is the case, TIVO is much worse than I previously assumed. The HR24 is nearly identical to the HR20. The few differences are easily remedied at the driver level. Even a beginning computer science student (at universities where professors still teach their own classes) knows that you build the core functionality separate from device- or function-specific modules.

    If the TIVO software is so monolithic that it could not accommodate so simple (and foreseeable) a change, then they have no business continuing to function as a software company. They would have wasted a great deal of money, time and intellectual property on an architecture out of date some 15 years in the past.

    I refuse to believe the world let them get by so long with such a concept. Bureaucracy, I can believe. Inept management I can believe. But who would allow the perpetuation of such a bad design over such a long period of time? If they were ever so foolish as to follow that particular path, they deserve to wither penniless on the scrapheap of obsolete technology.
     
  11. Jul 19, 2010 #51 of 765
    Mike Bertelson

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    On a hardware level it's completely different. I'm not sure it's just a matter of a couple of drivers.

    Let's assume it has a completely different processor (NXP CX24500/CX24118A). Is that just a matter of a new driver?

    I honestly don't know the answer but I would suspect it requires more than just a new driver. :shrug:

    Mike
     
  12. Jul 19, 2010 #52 of 765
    Stuart Sweet

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    I know that DIRECTV went to a more hardware-abstraction-layer type model a couple years ago. Much like a Windows PC that only needs drivers to operate with new hardware, the DIRECTV software is portable to a lot of different platforms, as we've seen.

    I have no evidence that TiVo ever made that jump. In fact people have told me that they didn't. So any software for a new piece of hardware would have major chunks that need revising. That alone tells me that the new TiVo, if it ever arrives, will be based on HR23 not HR24, because HR23 is much more similar to their current hardware.
     
  13. Jul 19, 2010 #53 of 765
    bonscott87

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    DirecTV would be priority #1. Period.

    They keep talking and have for years how they want to get out of the hardware business and just provide the software for 3rd parties. Yet they continue to spend what little money and time they have on new stand alone platforms that have limit use (cable and OTA) and are expensive up front compared to free from the cable company and no VOD (which is becoming a huge deal now) and have even screwed that up (Premier).

    Anyway, so they announce a new DirecTV deal and basically don't make it priority #1 and get it out NOW. DirecTV by far was always their biggest customer and made up the vast majority of their subs. Their cable deals have all been flops (or just plain vaporware that has never shipped). DirecTV is their golden goose. Yet they appear to have delayed themselves right into obscurity now. They had a window of about a year or less to make an impact. Now the ship has sailed and momentum is way too much behind the DirecTV in house DVRs for Tivo to ever make a big splash (or even a little one).

    They really screwed up by not focusing every resource they had on getting a new DirecTV box out yesterday. Now it's too late, it really is, even if it actually does ship next year.
     
  14. Jul 19, 2010 #54 of 765
    gregjones

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    If this is the case, they wrote their own expiration date.
     
  15. Jul 19, 2010 #55 of 765
    gregjones

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    Which only works if you a) develop good reusable software and b) deliver it close to on-time.

    And this is where they really disappoint me. They were winning, not an industry leader but the industry leader. And when they were cash-rich and able to raise additional capital, they should have moved to a modularized design. Not only would that have given them a more flexible product, it would have significantly reduced the cost to enter into new agreements. Because if porting is less expensive, you do it more often and with less risk.

    How did they accomplish so very little for so long?

    As it is they are now struggling to get a very old GUI on an aging hardware platform in order to provide features that are no longer unique or sometimes even best-of-class. Even if they released it today, would it matter anymore?



    Really, I knew they were gone when I got their latest email offer...a refurbished Series2 for $29.99. Sorry, but why would I possibly want a Series2 now? Next someone will offer to sell me year-old newspapers for only 18 cents apiece.
     
  16. Jul 19, 2010 #56 of 765
    gregjones

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    And for new readers...I was a huge TiVo fan. My old Sony DirecTiVo was a pretty big investment for me when I was much younger. Then updates started taking longer and longer for the Sony. And it took so long to get HD on a DirecTiVo. Then there were numerous problems with the HR10s. I did the unthinkable and went to cable HD. But when DIRECTV expanded HD and the HR20 was stable, I came back to DirecTV. I didn't miss that little guy at all. I just missed having a decent (non-Scientific Atlanta) DVR

    TiVo and I had a relationship, but it ran its course. After a while, TiVo didn't call me anymore (no updates) or care how it looked (slow to HD, then issues). We grew apart. So in my mind, TiVo broke up with me, not the other way around.
     
  17. Jul 19, 2010 #57 of 765
    Stuart Sweet

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    And I think that boils it down as well as anything else :)
     
  18. Jul 19, 2010 #58 of 765
    jacmyoung

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    They focused their resources on the lawsuits, which was undertandable but lawsuits take time and are unpredictable. After the case stalled at the appeals court, TiVo has been more focused on parternership with small cablecos and rolling out the new Premiere DVR, there were even sign of initial favorable acceptance.

    But I agree it is too late to right this DirecTiVo mother ship.
     
  19. Jul 19, 2010 #59 of 765
    tonyd79

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    Well, they did take on a pretty big launch of new hardware and a supposedly all-new GUI with, presumably, new underlying software in the Premiere. And they have having problems pulling that off. Now out for several months, they have yet to complete their new HD GUI, for example.

    When they did that (the new hardware), they changed their software model to a Java (is that what it is, my memory if failing and don't have time to look it up), so they should be more platform independent than they were.

    But they have wasted time with internet based (non-cached) features like pictures and suggested items in a ribbon (how Microsoft Office of them) rather than concentrate on getting the new box up and running.

    I think they are a mess without direction at this time. Their money is in getting out of the hardware business but they keep getting into it. They have built their brand on a perception of rock-solid appliances but are concentrating on gee-whiz items rather than making their new box rock solid.

    From outside, it appears they are undermanned for what they are trying to do.
     
  20. Jul 19, 2010 #60 of 765
    gregjones

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    I"m sure there were a few developers on staff that were not also serving as the TiVo legal team. They could have multitasked.
     
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