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DirecTV National HD Listing/Maps Discussion Thread (Technical - Not Anticipation)

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Programming' started by Sixto, May 29, 2012.

  1. Jun 3, 2012 #41 of 653
    Sixto

    Sixto Well-Known Member

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    Worth a look. I usually don't look at the locals very often but that's certainly possible, especially if they've been using the latest encoders on the new local launches.
     
  2. Jun 3, 2012 #42 of 653
    P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

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    Your memory is good enough to bring the fact, as for details - look at gct's historical threads.
     
  3. Jun 3, 2012 #43 of 653
    harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

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    Recognizing the much of the rest of the planet receives their regular programming via satellite is something that many American's obviously can't get their heads around.

    There are surely much more than a handful as James suggests. Some of them may be cooperating to share the equipment but there's doubtless hundreds of channels that are being multiplexed every day.
     
  4. Jun 3, 2012 #44 of 653
    harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

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    It is probably notable that the Tandberg EN8190 is an encoder module as opposed to a monolithic piece of equipment.

    While modular doesn't always mean cheaper, somebody is saving some money by not including a rack mount enclosure.
     
  5. Jun 3, 2012 #45 of 653
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Perhaps the uniqueness of the American broadcast market is something that some pundits choose to ignore.

    Name one other satellite broadcaster other than DISH or DirecTV that has to deal with over 1700 full power licensed stations plus nearly 500 lower power Class A stations. Just because those stations are not all on ConUS beams does not mean they do not need an encoder for each transponder - plus encoders at each point of presence to backhaul the signal to the DBS uplinks.

    Try reading. I said "and one can count on one hand the number of companies trying to multiplex multiple HD streams on dozens of transponders. At the level DBS providers are doing it, you could probably count it on two thumbs".

    As previously stated, no company needing a multiplexer is dealing with the number of transponders DISH and DirecTV individually deal with. I was thinking US ... perhaps you'll need the second hand to count other providers worldwide that do "dozens" of transponders ... of HD. I doubt you'll find any system with the HD transponder count of DISH or DirecTV.

    I have no doubt that there are hundreds of companies multiplexing a handful of their channels for distribution. No one is doing it on the scale of DISH and DirecTV. Add the "hundreds" of small companies to the hundreds of encoders DISH and DirecTV need and it still is not a huge marketplace.

    As I said before:
    We are practically talking about individually built devices ... not cheap mass production runs of 10s of thousands or millions. And to get it right with industrial quality it is expensive. $100k each isn't out of the ballpark for such a complicated device.
     
  6. Jun 4, 2012 #46 of 653
    Alan Gordon

    Alan Gordon Chancellor

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    Well... if so, you can consider me pleased to read that.

    DirecTV currently offers NBC, PBS, FOX, and CBS in HD, and ABC, The CW, and an Independent in SD. PBS is on a separate transponder, meaning there are THREE HD feeds and three SD feeds. If they can fit 6 HD channels on a transponder, that means that they can (theoretically) add ABC in HD, and still have room left over in case The CW EVER offers an HD feed to CW Plus stations and my local affiliate takes advantage of it and upgrades to HD, still leaving room to potentially add the SD MyNetworkTV affiliate.

    Then again, my market probably isn't worth the expense... :(

    ~Alan
     
  7. Jun 4, 2012 #47 of 653
    Alan Gordon

    Alan Gordon Chancellor

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    That brings up a thought though...

    With the HD-LiL markets added last year, and the ones coming this year, I wonder if DirecTV already had enough older encoders to offer them, or if they thought, "Hey! Let's offer these smaller markets locals with our older encoders and upgrade the national/CONUS channels to the newer encoders."

    ~Alan
     
  8. Jun 4, 2012 #48 of 653
    cypherx

    cypherx Hall Of Fame

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    I know the encoders cost a crapload of money but I wonder what the annual support contracts run them per device?
     
  9. Jun 4, 2012 #49 of 653
    charlie460

    charlie460 Godfather

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    So, is the consensus that with this new hardware there will really be no noticable difference in quality even when squeezing 6 HD channels in one transponder?
     
  10. Jun 4, 2012 #50 of 653
    Sixto

    Sixto Well-Known Member

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    Yes.
     
  11. Jun 4, 2012 #51 of 653
    yosoyellobo

    yosoyellobo Icon

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    Bottom line. How many new HD channel would be possible with all new encoders.
     
  12. Jun 4, 2012 #52 of 653
    charlie460

    charlie460 Godfather

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    Sounds good to me. This sort of stuff worries me as I'm picky when it comes to picture quality (which DirecTV has been good for me so far), but if there's no noticable difference I'm happy.
     
  13. Jun 4, 2012 #53 of 653
    Sixto

    Sixto Well-Known Member

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    There are currently 44 HD transponders, with 38 being used for linear HD.

    D10 has 14, D11 has 14, D12 has 16 with 10 used for national HD today.
     
  14. Jun 4, 2012 #54 of 653
    TBoneit

    TBoneit Hall Of Fame

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    Probably, must be, cheaper to change encoders than to add a location and satellite to be able to add transponders. and swap everybody's dish out. Less lead time than a new satellite and launch window.

    Only so many transponders licensed per location so adding one new HD channel per current transponder has to be cheaper.

    And lets not even go into losing a encoder is not near as bad as losing a transponder. You can not go up to the satellite and fix a dead transponder, OTOH you can swap in a spare encoder easily.
     
  15. Jun 4, 2012 #55 of 653
    georule

    georule Hall Of Fame

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    I'm still trying to get my head around this new encoder thing. This is still standard MPEG4, but more efficient? Does it put more of a load on the STB to decode as well? I'd think it'd have to, yet if it is still complying with the MPEG4 standard, presumably any MPEG4-rated STB should be able to decode it?

    Which sort of makes me wonder if the rather thorough rewrite of the STB software might have been about more than just the UI. . . optimizing the mpeg4 decode path and providing more head-room for mpeg4 decode load?
     
  16. Jun 4, 2012 #56 of 653
    Justin85

    Justin85 Legend

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    So, it was stated above (unless I'm confused) that we have 30Mbps per transponder. Adding a 6th feed with bring us down to 5Mbps per feed... U-Verse level compression. If this is true, how does DirecTV plan to deliver the same channel, in the same bandwidth as U-Verse, but have no change in image quality?
     
  17. Jun 4, 2012 #57 of 653
    Racer88

    Racer88 Icon

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    Yep it would seem any terrestrial based means of increasing the amount of content they're able to deliver has got to be the most desirable of all other possible solutions.
     
  18. Jun 4, 2012 #58 of 653
    Sixto

    Sixto Well-Known Member

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    Just relaying what we read in the Tandberg press release: "As part of a TANDBERG Television HD solution, the EN8190 encoder enables an additional HD channel per transponder for satellite operators when compared to alternative compression solutions."
     
  19. Jun 4, 2012 #59 of 653
    georule

    georule Hall Of Fame

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    Compressed bits and uncompressed bits don't have to turn out the same with different providers, depending on the quality of the hardware and software that compressed and uncompressed them. Your typical competitive bandwidth analysis assumes equality on that point. . . but it doesn't have to be so.

    I'm still somewhat dubious, but apparently D* is already using it on a couple transponders, and I haven't yet seen any of DBSTalk's many, MANY IQ hawks raise any red flags yet. I feel pretty sure they would.
     
  20. Jun 4, 2012 #60 of 653
    Sixto

    Sixto Well-Known Member

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    Or everyone can go check out the following channels ...

    Both these transponders have 6 HD right now:
    Code:
    D11  3 FT  246 TRUTVHD 1060 
    D11  3 FT  397 ABCwHD  1030
    D11  3 FT  549 EXTRHD  1040 
    D11  3 FT  649 SPSOHD  1050 
    D11  3 FT  681 ALTHD   1010 
    D11  3 FT  686 FSAZHD  1020 
    
    D12 15 FT  236 E!HD    1060
    D12 15 FT  254 AMCHD   1030 
    D12 15 FT  307 WGNHD   1020 
    D12 15 FT  521 WMAXHD  1050 
    D12 15 FT  548 SHO3HD  1010
    D12 15 FT  619 FSCHD   1040
     

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