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Dish drops AMC (+WeTV, IFC & Sundance)

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by lparsons21, May 4, 2012.

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  1. Jul 8, 2012 #1361 of 1922
    strikes2k

    strikes2k AllStar

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    So why doesn't AMC just ask that DISH carry their channels A La Carte? I'm sure DISH would be open to that. It doesn't require them to subsidize the channels with people who don't watch AMC's money. Seems pretty simple to me.
     
  2. Jul 8, 2012 #1362 of 1922
    maartena

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    Since none of us has details of what was discussed - if anything - between Dish and AMC, it is hard to place any blame.

    In general, I side with the carrier, whether it is Dish, DirecTV, U-verse, FIOS, Cable or whatever.... as it has been very clear that media companies have been asking way too much in recent years.

    IF Dish (which we don't know) would have said: "We will pay the same amount we previously paid, take it or leave it", I would applaud Dish. If not someone stands up against media companies, nobody will. And yes, that goes for DirecTV as well. As a matter of fact, although the size of the station is considerably smaller (and without "award winning" programming), DirecTV did something VERY similar: They dropped G4 for pretty much the same reasons Dish is giving for AMC: Not worth the asking price.

    As for Dish: They promised not to raise the prices in 2012, and they didn't. Where virtually every other provider did. Dropping AMC might just be the victim of that.
     
  3. Jul 8, 2012 #1363 of 1922
    Rduce

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    As Oscar Wilde once said, “The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.” or if you prefer, the P.T. Barnum axiom, “There is no such thing as bad publicity.” Both of these statements are pretty much spot on by most things that Dish seems to shine at.

    You want to look the part of the rebel alliance you take on the Big 4 Networks over there never ending commercials. You want to look fiscally responsible you then tell another Network with a couple of semi-popular programs. (Sorry fans, but when your program does not beat Ice Road Truckers, it just isn’t that popular) to go screw themselves.

    Dish gets a great deal of press for free and a reputation as hard-nosed negotiators, which sends the message for every other Podunk, Peanut Wagon outfit with a contract coming due, “You’re Next!”
     
  4. Jul 8, 2012 #1364 of 1922
    phrelin

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    I'm sure Dish would say yes.

    As I've said before here's an approximation of what I believe happened:
    A bunch of people think that Ergen's response is wrong.

    I and others think Dolan's demand was outrageous and Ergen's methodical approach giving Dolan time to propose a reasonable contract was in the best interest of the future of retransmission fee negotiations.

    And that is in the best interest of viewers around the country, including Dish customers most of whom can stream episodes the day after they air of all five of the "really good" AMC shows for a fee. Those who can't stream the shows will have to wait for the season to come out on DVD. And if AMC changes the streaming access then we will have a very clear picture of who is the greedy thief.
     
  5. Jul 8, 2012 #1365 of 1922
    Stewart Vernon

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    I feel like we've had some circular posting and some I-know-you-are-but-what-am-I posts as well as some baiting posts lately. I feel like the cereal commercial...

    The moderator in me says cut out the attacks and baiting and trolling posts that are not adding to the conversation.

    The kid in me says... I've maintained all along that I support Dish BUT that I thought it was a cheap move for Dish to relocate the AMC channels in those last few weeks. I get what Dish was trying to prove (how long it took people to notice the channels had moved)... but it was a cheap trick to play on their customers.

    So, does Dish have blame? Sure. Unless you are doing some weird kind of new solo Tango... it does take TWO to tango... and Dish mis-stepped with the channel number changing in my opinion.

    I'm sure Dish had the Voom suit in the back of their mind, but I'm also sure AMC did too. For AMC to fire that out of the gates as the "real reason" is just baldface lying to their "fans" and trying to stir things up. IF AMC had put half the effort into negotiating that they put into the "Dish sucks" Web site, maybe the channels wouldn't have gone dark?

    AMC also had a dispute with AT&T, though it was solved in the eleventh hour... but AMC had a dispute with AT&T 2 years ago as well! So... AMC is developing a pattern of asking for more at a rate that the providers are not willing to bite.

    Simultaneously, we have too many stories about how AMC is treating their creators of the award-winning shows... so if I were working on Walking Dead or Mad Men I would be ticked off to see AMC using my show as a flag for "pay us more money because we spend it on quality programming" when *I* know that simply is not the truth, because AMC is squeezing at both ends.

    AMC is making more profit now than they have in years... and while asking more for their commercials, selling overnight paid-advertising instead of airing "quality programs", asking for ad-placement in shows they buy (like Mad Men)... they are paying less to the creators of those shows and asking Dish to pay more for the right to have the channel.

    What's wrong with that picture?

    AMC tried to use the "look what we have" argument... but they only have a handful of shows, shows that AMC keeps trying to penny-pinch and sell more commercials. Heck, the people in the commercial-skip thread should all be on Dish's side vs AMC given that position alone!

    We don't know all the info... we never know all the info... but AMC has, in my opinion, made many more mis-steps and poor decisions in all of this than has Dish.

    And while Dish may or may not lose some customers over this... AMC has definitely lost 10 million or so times ~25 cents per month, and may lose more when their advertisers want to pay less for the known lower viewership.

    AMC needs Dish more than Dish needs AMC.
     
  6. Jul 8, 2012 #1366 of 1922
    SayWhat?

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    .... and Dish did.
     
  7. Jul 8, 2012 #1367 of 1922
    dakeeney

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    :contract: I watched Sundance channel all of never, IFC just for the Three Stooges and AMC for Mad Men, Hell on Wheels, and The Walkind Dead. Will I cry because they're gon....NO. Charlie is probably justifiied in saying the AMC networks are not worth the Price AMC is asking.
     
  8. Jul 8, 2012 #1368 of 1922
    dunkonu23

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    The end result is this and it's what both parties should really balance in negotiations: Who gets hurt?

    In my case, my wife and I. We'll have to stream TWD and pay. Who wins that one? AMC. I don't know if Talking Dead is streamable, but we've found that program to be funny. So we lost two.

    If I'm hurt, I get fixed. In this case, it's not an empty threat to write that I will drop Dish and go elsewhere at the end of my two-year contract. Analyze it all you want, but this is the bottom line.

    Both are hurting viewers and both need to be spanked.

    Scott
     
  9. Jul 8, 2012 #1369 of 1922
    StringFellow

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    100% agreed. AMC is selling a service to Dish and Dish didn't feel the cost justified the service provided by AMC.

    The funny part is that 99% of the posts reference AMC with no real interest in the other channels. My these less watched channels were the deal breaker for Dish.
     
  10. Jul 8, 2012 #1370 of 1922
    StringFellow

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    And do you really think other providers will never drop channels? If providers like Dish don't take a stand on high priced programming, you TV bill will spiral out of control. And I bet you would be the first to complain if your bill goes up!
     
  11. Jul 8, 2012 #1371 of 1922
    Stewart Vernon

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    Yep. We've noted that before. AMC, IFC, WeTV, and Sundance were all dropped by Dish. People forget that we aren't just talking about AMC... but all four channels in their "suite"...

    Would AMC go a la carte? Probably not, but we don't know for sure if that came up. We do know Charlie has publicly said in other disputes that he offered that as an option.

    Would AMC have negotiated for just AMC and let Dish drop the other 3 channels? Doubtful. Companies, and especially those with the history AMC/Rainbow has, typically are "all or nothing" negotiations...

    So while touting their "award-winning" programming... they fail to mention how that's pretty much it... nothing else left to brag about on 4 total channels... and many of them go into infomercial mode overnight instead of showing that high-quality award-winning programming that they want you to pay for.
     
  12. Jul 8, 2012 #1372 of 1922
    satcrazy

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    Great...
    pretty much have to agree with this post.

    Companies are trying to squeeze out every dime they can for their "profit margin". While I know this is the American way, God bless the US, etc,etc, I realy think most consumers have had enough. I say most because some are fortunate enough to be in a position to pick and choose without consideration to cost.
    I am not one of those fortunate sons. I have a budget to work with, and have to make decisions every month to balance that budget. If it means cutting something out to keep something else, so be it.
     
  13. Jul 8, 2012 #1373 of 1922
    Stewart Vernon

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    A curious development perhaps...

    The keepamc.com Web site no longer has the link to the "real reason" stuff on it anymore. I wonder why AMC would take that down now? I mean, if it was the "real reason" then wouldn't it still be the "real reason"?

    Could it be, perhaps, that AMC realized they were stepping on their own toes and keeping Dish away from the negotiating table by that whole "real reason" business?

    They also have a bunch of emails on their Web site from "angry Dish customers"... curiously they are all pro-AMC... which is interesting, since if you go to their Facebook page they definitely have received some pro-Dish comments... Why wouldn't AMC also post those emails?

    IF you just read the AMC page, you would think it was all one-sided pro-AMC.

    The spin continues.
     
  14. Jul 8, 2012 #1374 of 1922
    lparsons21

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    I think that AMC has bought into the current corporate thinking of providing less for more!

    they want a rate increase, yet provided less Mad Men, and are breaking the last season of Breaking Bad into two parts, and of course it also appears that The Killing has seen its last too. So that leaves Walking Dead and Hell on Wheels as the only fairly sure things going forward.

    Kind of like the can of tuna you get in the store, was always 6.25oz now it is 5oz and the price is much higher. Not to mention that every tuna recipe uses a can of tuna and so now you need to buy multiple cans to get the same flavor.

    As I said, less for more! :(
     
  15. Jul 8, 2012 #1375 of 1922
    SayWhat?

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    Doesn't even taste the same anymore either.
     
  16. Jul 8, 2012 #1376 of 1922
    Stewart Vernon

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    Yep... and going back to James' sports analogy...

    IT would be like IF the Miami Heat announced that since winning the championship, that Dwayne Wade was retiring and they were going to trade Chris Bosh, and were going to cut LeBron James' salary... but then were going to double ticket prices for home games next season.

    That wouldn't make any sense would it?
     
  17. Jul 8, 2012 #1377 of 1922
    Inkosaurus

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    No more dolphin in that tuna :<
     
  18. Jul 8, 2012 #1378 of 1922
    dunkonu23

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    Michigan....
    Dish dropped a channel my wife and I watch, so your statement about other providers dropping a channel has no basis in logic. Your statement about complaining about pricing is an assumption with no basis in fact. The amount of my bill is of no concern to you or anyone else. I do understand what you are trying to write, however it does not change the fact that you make assumptions about my behavior with no supporting evidence or knowledge about me.

    Scott
     
  19. Jul 8, 2012 #1379 of 1922
    Inkosaurus

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    You completely missed the point and obviously dont understand the point he was alluding too.
     
  20. Jul 8, 2012 #1380 of 1922
    dunkonu23

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    Michigan....
    Unfortunately, I do understand as I stated, but I don't think his point makes any sense given that I am not currently on another service and will not be on any other service until my Hopper contract expires. As such, any past behavior of another service does not affect me now and will not affect me until my contract expires. At that time, if Dish has not reinstated AMC--at whatever cost, it does not affect me, either as I can afford rate increases--I will drop Dish and move on.

    I had hoped I would not have to spell this out, obviously.

    Scott
     
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