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Dual Buffers

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by Que, Aug 17, 2006.

Dual Buffers

  1. A must have!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Don't really care about it.

    94.1%
  3. Like the option but, Ok if it's not there.

    5.9%
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  1. Sep 2, 2006 #161 of 2967
    lpctv

    lpctv Legend

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    Aug 26, 2006
    I mentioned this in another reply...it wasn't in the 15 and it's not in the 20. Based on agreeing with your assumption that they didn't do any focus marketing groups, I'd say they have had other plans for why it's not in there in the first place. Except that no one seems to clearly state why (or why not)...so, let the speculation continue...
     
  2. Sep 4, 2006 #162 of 2967
    hoopsrgreat

    hoopsrgreat Legend

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    Sep 4, 2006
    I am a sports junkie, but I use the 2 live buffers everyday, regardless if I am watching sports. I will watch CNN, and surely also go find something else to watch. Then switch back and forth everytime a comercial comes on. This is a MAJOR problem for me in regards to getting rid of a tivo based HD DVR and switching to the HR20. Only when the HR20 would allow me to see my A's and Kings in HD fro the RSN would I switch. Since I was told I would be able to get the RSN in HD after I got the h20( I got one, only to find out that was a bunch of crap) I dont see much use for the Hr20 for me right now. To heck with recording 2 channels and playing that game. The beauty of the 2 dual live buffers is how easy it is to use. Take that ease of use away, and you make using a DVR a pain in the butt.

    They MUST GET DUAL live buffers on the HR20.
     
  3. Sep 4, 2006 #163 of 2967
    Wolffpack

    Wolffpack Banned User

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    Jul 29, 2003
    One item from another thread that should also be mentioned here. If Dual Live buffers are ever implemented on the DVR+ line of DVRs, it would be completely useless to those of us that want this feature if we cannot pause each buffer independently while switching between them.

    For example. Watching buffer 1, game goes to commercial I pause it and switch to buffer 2. When the game on buffer 2 goes to commercial I pause that and switch back to buffer 1, unpause it and then skip/slip forward past the commercial. When I hit the next commercial on buffer 1 I pause again and switch to buffer 2. Unpause that and skip/slip ahead past the commercial. That keeps going.

    So, to the DTV folks that may be considering Dual Live Buffers, make sure you know how we use that feature. Talk to some folks out here so that you don't release a feature such as this only to find out you're missing an important part (pausing).
     
  4. Sep 4, 2006 #164 of 2967
    lpctv

    lpctv Legend

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    Aug 26, 2006
    Are you basing that on the fact that you can't currently pause and resume a recorded program? Only asking since I think it was mentioned that this is currently listed as a bug.
    Or, do you think that there's a whole separate level of logic that they would have to build in just to do the dual buffer scenario and pauses?

    There is one other apsect of this that I was just thinking about...not sure if it's been brought up yet as a possible "why it's not implemented" reason. Would the buffering logic interfere with the + features? If you buffer a game (or record), do the stats and scores features show live or time shifted?
     
  5. Sep 4, 2006 #165 of 2967
    Wolffpack

    Wolffpack Banned User

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    Jul 29, 2003
    If you are currently recording two live shows and are flipping between those shows via the PREV button you cannot pause one and go the other. On the R15 that is. I don't have a HR20.

    + features such as the applications in MIX channels or YES do not allow for recording at all. I don't know how those would impact dual live buffers. But from my stand point, if the DTV development staff has a firm understanding on how we use dual live buffers on the Tivo units they should be able to replicate those on the R15 and HR20.
     
  6. Sep 5, 2006 #166 of 2967
    lpctv

    lpctv Legend

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    Aug 26, 2006
    Wouldn't you consider the lack of pause and resume to be the same for this instance too? I mean, if it has been identified as a bug and the feature is supposed to be there, there is probably no difference between trying to view a whole previously recorded program and doing a pause and return vs. using the record 2 shows workaround for live buffers. In either case, you're relying on the same feature - or lack thereof - in which case, the wait for the fix for the bug...or, am I missing something?

    Actually, since I don't have any receivers at this time that do any of that stuff, I'm not sure either. So, I guess what I was really after is to know if one records a ST game, and then uses any of the interactive buttons while watching it after the fact, what would happen? I would think that it's not like getting current time and such if you press the info button while watching a previously recorded show. Hopefully, I'm making some sort of sense here...and you see where I was going with it before.
    I agree with you wholeheartedly on the last point. Even said so previously. However, you're making an assumption that they would want to chase the horse even after they deliberately left the barn door open...because it seems evident (IMO) that they didn't do a whole lot of end user research beforehand.
     
  7. Sep 7, 2006 #167 of 2967
    Que

    Que Icon

    632
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    Apr 15, 2006
    WOW 340 people voted! I had no idea that this poll would get this much attention. I wish they could sent out mailer to all D* subs just to see what they wanted. Thanks for voting!

    65% -A must have!.......... That is just a small % that SEEN this poll.

    Earl,

    Have you heard anything else on this?
     
  8. Sep 11, 2006 #168 of 2967
    Que

    Que Icon

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    Apr 15, 2006
    I have seen some threads asking about dual buffers. So just a little bump.
     
  9. Sep 11, 2006 #169 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

    Earl Bonovich Lifetime Achiever

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    That latest is that they are trying to identify the best way to implement it.
     
  10. Sep 11, 2006 #170 of 2967
    wilbur_the_goose

    wilbur_the_goose Hall Of Fame

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    Aug 16, 2006
    If nothing else, yesterday's football games (along with the tennis final) showed how important dual buffers are.

    Seeing how DirecTV has positioned themselves as the sports leader, they really need to consider the sports-centric consumer in their decision.

    Thanks again for the info, Earl.
     
  11. Sep 11, 2006 #171 of 2967
    gdawg

    gdawg Cool Member

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    Sep 11, 2006
    I have had DIRECTIVO's for several years. I just purchased an HR20 and although I like some of the features, not having dual buffers is a big issue. Hopefully DTV will listen to their customers.
     
  12. Sep 11, 2006 #172 of 2967
    KCWolfPck

    KCWolfPck Legend

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    Jul 10, 2006
    I'm sure this was a big issue with the R-15 user base as well.....still no dual buffers for the R-15, why should we expect the HR20 to be any different?
     
  13. Sep 11, 2006 #173 of 2967
    Wally_Gator

    Wally_Gator Legend

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    Nov 28, 2005
    So, can we inferr that this has made it onto some sort of a roadmap?
    Or is this still 50/50?
     
  14. Sep 11, 2006 #174 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

    Earl Bonovich Lifetime Achiever

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    Maybe 51/49 now.. :)
    Nothing has really changed since my last conversations...

    They are more focused on correcting the current issues with the box, then adding major new features.
     
  15. Sep 11, 2006 #175 of 2967
    Drunk Wex

    Drunk Wex Cool Member

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    Sep 11, 2006
    I signed up for the forum just to vote and post in this thread. My HR20 is coming Sept 28th, or sooner if they have an opening, so I really hope they add this feature very soon. I almost don't want to give up my HR10 because of this... The speed and image quality improvements better be worth it.

    In the meantime I hope someone is able to find a work around so we'll have some sort of dual life buffer functionality.
     
  16. Sep 11, 2006 #176 of 2967
    BrettStah

    BrettStah Legend

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    Feb 7, 2003
    Earl, I'm sure that they have smart people thinking about ways to implement it, but I'll post my suggestion here anyway:

    First, I am assuming that the other tuner needs to be used for "other things" on occasion.

    The Tivos currently pop up a message, asking (paraphrasing here), "Is it OK if the other tuner is changed to a different channel?" This is for scheduled recordings, assuming that bother tuners are available and you're watching one tuner "live".

    So that's one way of handling it - ask the user if it's OK. If it's not OK, just reschedule.

    Another way is to keep track of activity on a per-tuner basis, and figure out a threshold of inactivity to watch for. For example, if you don't switch to one of the tuners after X minutes, the DVR will assume that it's OK to switch to a different channel to download VOD stuff. Then it can switch back to the original channel once that's done. I would recommend at least 120 minutes.
     
  17. Sep 14, 2006 #177 of 2967
    Que

    Que Icon

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    Apr 15, 2006
    Alright!! That sounds a lot better then before! So there going to do it, just need to find a way to implement it!

    NICE!

    [edit] Read Earl's 2nd post... So it about the same, right now.
     
  18. Sep 14, 2006 #178 of 2967
    cbearnm

    cbearnm Legend

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    Sep 6, 2006
    Boy, I hate to put myself out there and tempt the fates, but most drives are now rated in the area of 1,000,000 + hours MTBF, particularly from Seagate. That is approx 114 years. Even half that life will work for me.
    At the million hour mark though, if they have 3,000,000 customers with DVRs, that can be 3 units failing per hour, more than likely. (Pulled that number out of the air for demonstration purposes.)
    I appreciate that drives do die, but it's probably not a big concern for D*. They are probably more concerned about copyright issues.
    Personally, I would love to see them allow the SATA port or even the USB port to be used for archiving content, but I would virtually guarantee that it would be in a proprietery format that is useless on a PC. Even so, they would probably not do so.
    RAID is a great idea, particularly as drive prices fall, but then the next logical step is removable RAID. It does no good to have a drive mirrored (or striped) if you have a fire and both drives are in it. So it makes sense to make it removable, so you can store it in a firesafe. Then we're back to copyright stuff.
    I think it is a great idea, I just don't see D* making it a priority, until at least MS or Dish or TiVo make it a 'feature' that D* needs to 'we can that too'.
     
  19. Sep 14, 2006 #179 of 2967
    aqua nut

    aqua nut New Member

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    Sep 14, 2006
    I just put a call into the D* movers hotline because I'm moving. I was told there is an upgrade, to the new and improved HR20 so I accepted the deal. I decided to check out info on the new HR20 and the issue of NO dual live buffers is a big one! I found many sites with information about this. I for one use duel live buffer constantly and will not be without it after growing so attached. The new and improved HR20 will go into the kid’s room and I'll stick to the old HR10-250. Unless of course D* can work out an upgrade. :(
     
  20. Sep 14, 2006 #180 of 2967
    DougC

    DougC Cool Member

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    Sep 14, 2006
    I agree with aqua nut. I've just had the HR20 installed Saturday and will be having it removed this coming Saturday. The HR20 is simply not useable between not having the dual buffer feture and no OTA HD receiving/recording. I use the dual buffer feature on my standard def TIVO almost anytime the TV is turned on! It sucks not having it so much, that they will either have to bring me an HR10-250 or I'll redeploy my std def tivo until both features are fixed in the HR20. It'll be for ever until Charleston, SC ever gets HD LIL considering we just got SD LIL 18 months ago!

    Does anybody out there get the LA or NY HD LILs in markets where they aren't local yet? The CSR told me that its possible I could get NY HD LILs because my market doesn't have them yet, but it'll take 30 days for approval!
     
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