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HR20 and OTA problem with one channel

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by goober22, Nov 1, 2007.

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  1. Nov 1, 2007 #1 of 17
    goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    I have an HR20-700 setup with an OTA antenna. I have a problem with the FOX channel. I have strong signal but the HR20 won't pull it in. I can pull it in okay with my tvs built-in tuner. Here is my readings and info:

    CBS-4 = Digital 36 UHF = 55-57 tv tuner = 77 HR20 tuner
    NBC-7 = Digital 8 VHF = 72-73 tv tuner = 77 HR20 tuner
    ABC-13 = Digital 19 UHF = 66-69 tv tuner = 77 HR20 tuner
    FOX-28 = Digital 9 VHF = 49-55 tv tuner = 69-76 HR20 tuner
    PBS-11 = Digital 56 UHF = 28-35 tv tuner = 43-50 HR20 tuner

    All channels and subs pull in fine except FOX on the HR20.
    Fox28 is WPGX. My tv tuner pulls it in fine as long as the signal is 30+ but when I try to tune it on the HR20, I get "Searching for signal on the off air tuner... (771)". The HR20 constantly shows the signal level in the low 70s but never pulls anything in.

    I have tried re-aiming the antenna and those are the best signals I can get and get all the channels. FOX is a VHF channel but so is the NBC one and it pulls in okay. Towers distances are 17-21 miles for ABC, NBC & FOX. CBS is 57 miles, PBS is 24.

    One other note, my tv identifies it as 28- or 28-0 (instead of 28-1). The HR20 shows it as 28-1. Not sure if that matters.

    Any ideas why the HR20 won't pull it in even though it says it has a good signal - and my tv will pull it.

    Confused. :confused:
     
  2. Nov 1, 2007 #2 of 17
    gcisko

    gcisko I am Iron Man!

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    I am pretty much stumped. I am not even sure if they are still tweaking the OTA stuff or not. I Know I saw huge changes from one CE to the next until it was dialed in perfect (for me). Haven't had problems in months. I do know that if the guide is not correct, you will not get the proper picture. I would almost be tempted to try punching in 28-0 and see if that would work. But since it would not be in the guide there is a 100% chance you would get channel not found. If you have an adjustable signal amp between the antenna and HR20 try backing the amplified signal down. I seem to remember the HR20 would have problems with saturation if you had too powerful of an OTA signal.

    Thinking more.... I think if your TV sees it as 28-0 and the HR20 lists it as 28-1 you have no chance it will work until the database is fixed. At least that is my feeling from my OTA struggles over the past year or so. I would have everything perfect with OTA direct to my TV. Troubleshooting OTA to the HR20 was interesting :)
     
  3. Nov 1, 2007 #3 of 17
    Kansas Zephyr

    Kansas Zephyr Hall Of Fame

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    It might! If your TV is displaying 28- or 28-0 then it looks like the local Fox has their PSIP setup improperly. Verify the the other OTA channels on your TV are displayed as *-1 properly, first.

    Call the local Fox and speak to the chief engineer and tell him/her what you are displaying.

    I don't know...but the HR20 might be looking for the 28-1 from the PSIP encoding before "passing" that channel.

    BTW...I used to live in PCB FLA.
     
  4. Nov 1, 2007 #4 of 17
    skeebo

    skeebo New Member

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    Hey Goober,

    I live in the Panama City area as well and I am experiencing the exact same thing that you are. I'm not sure what the problem is but my HR20 will not pick up WPGX either. I am able to pick it up using my H20 because it has a scan function. I can pick in up on 9-24, 9-26, 9-28 and 9-30. Everything else comes in very well. I can even pick in up using my old 10-250 on 28-1. My TV tuner picks it up on 28-0. Therefore I know that I am receiving a strong signal but for some reason the HR20 will not pick it up. I have even tried calling Fox 28. I was able to talk to the receptionist twice but the only engineer thats at the station will not return my calls or answer his phone. I know that he has been there all along because the receptionist told me so. She even sent him a detailed e-mail asking him to give me a call. Right now I'm not sure what to do but it would be great if I could get this figured out. I'm about to drop Knology since I can now get most of the locals via antenna. I have the FOX SD from NY and LA. IAt this point I am still looking for answers.
     
  5. Nov 1, 2007 #5 of 17
    Rakul

    Rakul Slacker

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    I'm in the Richmond, VA DMA and about a month or so ago our Fox station went from Broadcasting on 35-1 to 26-4 for some reason so it gave my HR20 fits only mine would pull the station in but display a 771 at the same time. Maybe it's a Fox thing :D
     
  6. Nov 2, 2007 #6 of 17
    goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    Okay guys. It seems that I need to call WPGX and see if they would check their PSIP data. But after what skeebo posted, they may not be too willing to help.

    @skeebo - how are you getting the distant SDs? Did you ask for a waiver? I'm trying to drop Knology as well for tv as they are pretty slow to add new content. I plan to keep them for phone & internet. I'm hoping D* will get our HD locals added when they get the next sat up and running.
     
  7. Nov 2, 2007 #7 of 17
    goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    Well I called. The menu choice for engineering was a loop that takes you back to the main menu. I did get a hold of the receptionist and she said the engineer was in a meeting. She did give me his name and direct number and transfered me to it where I left a detailed voice message with my name/number. I guess I'll wait and see.
     
  8. Nov 2, 2007 #8 of 17
    hasan

    hasan Well-Known Member

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    Chances are the data being supplied by your local engineer/TV station to Tribune is bad. Until that gets fixed, you won't get the channel on your HR20. Be VERY nice to the engineer and explain to him that the HR20 tuner is driven by the data from Tribune (that they report to). Ask him to verify with Tribune what is going on. Make sure you tell him what you are seeing and what the HR20 is showing (compared to your other TV tuner). It can be resolved, but it will require the engineer to help you.

    (I went through the same thing here, and it took about 3 weeks to resolve with an engineer that really was trying to help, so don't expect a fix in a day or two)

    Once that is done, if you still can't get that channel, report back and we'll help you with the RF side of things (how to get a channel that is properly reported, when you have other issues like multi-path, etc)
     
  9. Nov 2, 2007 #9 of 17
    goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    But would that cause my TVs ATSC tuner to receive it but only as 28-0 instead of 28-1? I hooked my other HDTV (with ATSC tuner) up to my OTA and did a scan and it would NOT pull in their signal at all. It paused on the frequency (VHF 9) but then moved on and would not add it.
     
  10. goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    I placed a 2nd call this afternoon, got voice mail, left a message again. I guess I'm with skeebo and WPGX is not motivated to fix or look into it. I'll send a letter next week to the GM of WPGX if I don't get a reply and then to Raycom Media (parent company) the week later if that does not work. Finally I guess I'll try the FCC. If their PSIP data is wrong, which is required by the FCC, then they need to fix it.

    My fallback is that I hope D* adds OTA searching to their HR20s. At least it should come up then and I can manually sent a recording.
     
  11. MIJBFAN

    MIJBFAN Cool Member

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    After I got the newest update I lost my local CBS station WWMT 3-1 OTA. It worked fine until the update and still works fine hooked up to the TV.
     
  12. Kansas Zephyr

    Kansas Zephyr Hall Of Fame

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    I "lose" my OTA after every update, too.

    Try going to "initial setup" again. That usually clears it up for me.
     
  13. Kansas Zephyr

    Kansas Zephyr Hall Of Fame

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    His HDTV is displaying 28-0, not 28-1, so that's a local PSIP issue, isn't it?

    I don't know how the HR20 works, but it might be reading the PSIP and looking for 28-1 before it "remaps" to that stream and passes it.

    Anyone know more about how the HR20 OTA "looks" at PSIP?
     
  14. skeebo

    skeebo New Member

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    Goober,

    I applied for waivers and got approved for the East Coast and West Coast feeds of all four networks in Standard definition plus ABC HD and NBC HD. Fox and CBS would not approve the HD waiver.
     
  15. goober22

    goober22 Godfather

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    Sunny...
    I just wanted to update this. After two voice mails and no reply to the station, I sent a letter asking for them to look into it. I explained that I believed there was a problem with the Major/Minor channel assignments in their PSIP data.

    I received a call & email saying that they had corrected the issue. I checked and now my TV does identify the feed as 28-1 instead of 28-0 but more importantly - the HR20s now receive the channel just fine. I guess my main tv's tuner was more forgiving for the missing PSIP data, as neither HR20 would pull it in (nor a 2nd digital tv).
     
  16. Kansas Zephyr

    Kansas Zephyr Hall Of Fame

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    Thanks for the update.

    Yeah, I thought that would do it.

    Your TV tuner scans the entire OTA spectrum and displays whatever it finds.

    I assume the HR20 uses a database to tell the tuner to look only at a specific off-air channel, then it looks for a specific PSIP channel/sub-channel indicator, to "remap" and pass that stream inside the IRD.

    Since WPGX's PSIP was incorrectly set to 28-0, the HR20 didn't "know" that was supposed to be 28-1, and simply ignored it.

    FWIW...there should never be a *-0 for OTA DTV. The "primary" digital channel should always be *-1. Some dual analog/digital TVs use *-0 to tell the set to tune to the analog signal.
     
  17. gcisko

    gcisko I am Iron Man!

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    Awesome. Good the know how things work!
     
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