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HR20 seems to be running Linux...possible GPL violations?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by mateom199, Mar 16, 2007.

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  1. Oct 8, 2007 #141 of 267
    thumperr

    thumperr Godfather

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    It would have been a much easier if the HR20 just used Microsoft Windows underneath, then no messy Linux arguments. :)

    I will offer that my HD-DVD player, came with a copy of the GPL. and When Toshiba sends a copy of updated firmware to me, it contains a reference to the GPL.
     
  2. Oct 8, 2007 #142 of 267
    Ken S

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    Doug,

    If DirecTV ever had to defend this type of thing in court you would probably see many different assertions for the defense. I hope they have stronger arguments than what you're suggesting for their sake.
     
  3. Oct 8, 2007 #143 of 267
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    :lol: fair enough :lol: .. I did say I'm not a lawyer :D.
     
  4. Oct 8, 2007 #144 of 267
    Spanky_Partain

    Spanky_Partain Active Member

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  5. Oct 8, 2007 #145 of 267
    NorfolkBruh

    NorfolkBruh Legend

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    Spanky, what does this mean?
     
  6. Oct 8, 2007 #146 of 267
    Spanky_Partain

    Spanky_Partain Active Member

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    So here is the history, hope that helps...

    You can use the instructions in the link to get this information if your HR20 is networked.
     
  7. Oct 8, 2007 #147 of 267
    Tom Robertson

    Tom Robertson Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    To the argument "We don't want Open Source to be a lawyer fest", I contend that the burden of GPL is very small: a copy of the license and access to the orginal sources. Only companies that try to skirt the edges might face the burden of lawyer costs.

    To the point "All sources must be made available": not true. Wholly written additions to the kernel such as specific modules or device drivers that are not derived from the GPL Program but work with the GPL Program are not required to be released as source. Neither are applications that run upon the Program.

    To the point "DIRECTV just provides video content": Also not true. Once they started branding and manufacturing receivers with their name, they became consumer electronics manufacturers as well as video content providers. All the issues for CE manufactures come to bear: support, legals, manufacturing, etc.

    And the system is not closed. Individuals may own the hardware. (I own 3.)

    Is the sofware distributed? As the point was made, the hardware doesn't do anything without it. :)

    You know, I bet the amount of money DIRECTV already spent on the R15 and subsequently on the HR20 GPL review is far greater than just putting a webpage up for the source, and a copy of the GPL embedded in the HR20 help pages... :)

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  8. Oct 8, 2007 #148 of 267
    P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

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    You just can't imagine how do that mountain work to split the GPL source code from DTV parts for publish it. How much time it will require to review before it appoved to publish. Plus count there are more then one HR20 what run Linux. Money, money ...
     
  9. Oct 8, 2007 #149 of 267
    mateom199

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    Exactly! They probably wasted way more time and money figuring out how to skirt, or how they can manipulate the GPL than if they had just (easily) complied!
     
  10. Oct 8, 2007 #150 of 267
    mateom199

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    If D* was stupid enough to include GPL'd code in their own application, I would not feel bad about the money or time spent.

    That being said, I seriously doubt they were that stupid.
     
  11. Oct 8, 2007 #151 of 267
    Tom Robertson

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    P Smith, I disagree--if Earl's statement is true that no changes to GPL code have been made by DIRECTV (and I have plenty of reason to believe that statement.) It could be as simple as repackaging the distro they started with.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  12. Oct 8, 2007 #152 of 267
    Doug Brott

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    My point was more that the system is closed with respect to accessing the software directly .. You still can't do that under the TOS with DIRECTV even if you own the receivers.

    True, but does MySpace really exist? DBSTalk.com? There is a virtual aura about this and where is the line actually drawn? Ken S pointed out the license agreement, etc. etc. Fair enough.

    On this I agree. Sometimes the simplest solution is the one staring you in the face. What harm is there in including the license and otherwise making some of this information available. I would think negligible, but I'm not the VP, just a customer.
     
  13. Oct 8, 2007 #153 of 267
    Spanky_Partain

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    I don't see any reason why they cannot supply the kernel and even the kernel source.

    That should not be any big deal and should be easy to grab and post. The version of the kernel in use has not changed since the first time we saw it at the end of last year.
     
  14. Oct 8, 2007 #154 of 267
    Ken S

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    I guess the could avoid all that unnecessary work by writing their own operating system.
     
  15. Oct 8, 2007 #155 of 267
    P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

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    I know some of the GPL pitfalls from real life with the similar to 'bcm' part but from other huge Company.
    But it works at the end and all partners happy (include Linux community and users). Same time I know how Broadcom is protective its own IP - tough is not that right qualifying word :(. Plus I know for sure, the system is not basic Linux and busybox but had proprietary modules/drivers/etc and customized.
     
  16. Oct 8, 2007 #156 of 267
    TommydCat

    TommydCat New Member

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    I didn't aim to interpret how, why or if the GPL is being violated; my intent was to explain why the open source community wants it to be honored and the spirit in which the license is offered. I tend to drift a bit when I get going on a rant ;)

    I don't necessarily agree with the statements I guess you are channeling for D*, but that's not really the point of my posting, nor does it really matter since I am not a damaged party :confused: I shall say no more...

    My god this thread took off! :eek2:

    I do wish the best for all involved, as this is an amazing coordinated symphony of different technologies being utilized to paint pretty pictures on my livingroom wall accompanied by amazing sound. :grin: :grin:
     
  17. Oct 9, 2007 #157 of 267
    Tom Robertson

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    As I posted many moons ago, I do not think DIRECTV intends to violate the agreement, and from what I know of many key people, I am absolutely certain they wish to keep everything on the up and up. My participation in this thread was fully intended to help them consider other points of view; not to bash them in any way. They very much have my respect for honesty and for their strong desire to help the customer.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  18. Oct 9, 2007 #158 of 267
    oakwcj

    oakwcj Lower Echelon

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    This thread reminded me that my Panasonic plasma TV uses GPL'd software. The only way I knew this is from the setup menu. Under "About" is "License," which includes a reference to the GPL and this website:

    http://www.am-linux.jp/dl/DTV05U/

    It contains links to some fairly generic linux packages like glibc and autofs. This is probably all DirecTV would need to do to comply.
     
  19. Oct 9, 2007 #159 of 267
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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  20. Oct 9, 2007 #160 of 267
    Gotchaa

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