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Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by Earl Bonovich, Oct 6, 2007.
Well then I guess they just ignore their customers.
That's it.... you figured it out....
Voted for TIVO, but the HR20 has many positives for it as well - quicker interfaces/quicker ability to move through menus.
Overall, would simply be nice to have the 'option' to choose.
I guess my only response to this is Earl, without being too argumentative, is sometimes you don't want to have to record something to be able to pause live TV, switch to another channel, and then be able to go back to where I left off. With the HR20, I can't even do that while recording a show.
Case in point. I was recording the Bears game last night. My wife wanted to watch a show we had recorded earlier in the week. My best case scenario would allow me to pause the game so when I stopped watching the other show I wasn't forced to see the score of the game 60 minutes later, but where I wanted to pause it. This isn't allowed.
For a shorter program, with DLB and the old DTivo, I didn't even need to record the 1st tuner. I could just pause, watch the other show and then come back without skipping a beat...
Unless I am missing the point, this would be my take on how it could work to ease the pain of some users.
If you had asked this question shortly after the HR20 came out, my reponse would be a "Hell Yeah!" Now after working through most of the issues (I know there are some that bother others, but for how I use it, it now works perfectly) I would NOT trade my HR20 for a DirecTivo.
I still have a SAT-T60 and HR10-250 (both hacked, so yes, there is more you can tune / tweak with the Tivos and that is the only advantage I see with those) but if you had asked if I would trade either my SAT-T60 or HR10-250 straight up for a HR20, my response "Hell Yeah!"
Just to put things in perspective, I bought a SVR???? (Sony's original standalone) about a week or so after they came out, so I have been using a Tivo since it has come out and when I originally got the HR20 I was disappointed and preferred the Tivo interface, functionality, etc. Now it is the exact opposite - maybe because I spend more time with the HR20 then the Tivo and spoiled by the additional HD content I get on the HR20.
So to summarize:
1) Would I trade my HR20 for an MPEG-4 compatible DirecTivo -> NO!
2) Would I trade a DirecTivo (SAT-T60/HR10-250) for a HR20 -> YES!
I also voted that I'd trade my HR20s for Tivos, but not nearly as emphatically as I would have a month ago.
Things I've come to like about the HR20 over Tivo:
-Basically always have a small window so I can keep watching what's on
-30 second skip stacking
-12 hour skip when browsing the guide
-Caller ID (maybe Tivo had/has this, and I never used it? Not sure)
-Being able to browse the guide while watching a recorded show
-HD space remaining
-90 minute buffer
Things I still like more about Tivo or annoy me about HR20:
-The slow-mo button (holding down play) is annoying, prefer the ability to pause and then hit slow-mo
-Tivo interface is both easier to use overall (though I've been warming to the HR20) and just plain prettier
-Season Passes still seem to be better than Series Recordings or whatever they're called
-I like the 8 second back function better than the (5 second?) back function on the HR20
-Dual live buffers, obviously
-The remotes...I actually use an MX-500, and it's much harder to program it for the HR20 remote than the Tivo remote because of the extra buttons on the HR20 remote...ultimately it's not that big of a deal, but it seems D* just kept adding a new button for every function they came up with, while Tivo had things more planned out
Of course some other things that the HR20 will have in the future would probably get me closer to the center, like DOD and remote booking.
Still, I'd go with Tivo for now. The only single thing that could get me fully in the HR20 camp would be if DLB were added.
Has TiVo ever come up with a usage for that Window button?
I like the HR20 interface better than the TiVo's, but I would make the trade for hacking, keyword wishlist autorecords, overall better reliability in terms of recording what I want recorded, and DLB.
I switched from an old Hughes Tivo DVR to the HR20 in July to prepare for the launch of the new HD channels. While things operate a bit differently, I'm over all that by now. I've adapted to the HR20 and it really isn't much different than my old Tivo DVR. It does a few things better than my old Tivo DVR. My wife has learned how to use it and she's not complaining at all. That is a solid endorsement from someone that doesn't handle technology well at all, let alone changes in technology.
I still want dual buffers and a prioritizer list that allows more than 50 entries, though.
after 10 days with the directv hd dvr, i simply cannot understand why most anyone could ever favor it over the tivo version. it's just not close. maybe after more time with it, that may change, but i'm guessing that would take multiple upgrades. for now though, using them side by side, wow, there's no way directv's version is better. so far i've only seen 3 positives with the new one--space remaining meter, mpeg4 allows more shows on the drive and more hits per search. that's it.
After 13 months of the HR-20, I still get annoyed by the lack of wishlists. It think it is because of the premier season. There is no rhyme or reason to the series links I have set to catch first runs. I find myself grooming the matches daily to get rid of errant hits.
TiVo has wishlist functionality in spades.
However, I'm am now used to the HR-20 interface. It is speedy and once you get the shortcuts figured out, easy to use. So, I'll vote to keep the HR-20.
First, as a fairly infrequent poster/reader and relative non-techie, let me say:
a) I hugely appreciate Earl's participation and insights on this board (hate to disagree with him!)
b) I think the HR20 has a lot of great features (especially the picture-in-picture on the guide & list, better speed/performance, and eSATA)
But, with that said, I have to give a no-brainer vote for Tivo. As many others have said, the DLB's, non-grid guides, better remote, and "wife-friendly" usability are all keys factors. The one thing I haven't seen mentioned (maybe I missed it?), however, is the ability to "watch" an HD recording in FF (1x) ... especially sports. As a busy person (kids, work, etc) and HUGE sports fan, I frequently record games and watch part (i.e. - the first 3 quarters or 6 innings) or all of them in FF mode. I used to do this all the time with my HD-Tivo, but I've noticed that HD sports recordings on the HR20 are not very watchable in 1x FF (much too "choppy" - or maybe just a bit too fast??). Interestingly, the choppiness isn't as bad in SD, but who wants to record a game in SD?
Am I alone in this last observation? Maybe this "feature" isn't a big deal to many people. Does anyone disagree - and think that "watching" sports in 1x FF on the HR20 is as good as on the HD-Tivo? Is a tweaking to the speeds of the FF on the HR20 a possibility?
FWIW, even taking away this "watching in 1x FF" issue for me, I'd still give a slight nod to Tivo. This is NOT to say that I don't like the HR20, as it has some nice features and it appears (from reading this board) that DirecTV has done a nice job making improvements to it over the past year (which is promising).
Thanks again, Earl, for your participation and insights on this board.
Edit: Earl ... after seeing your new thread about "usability" of the HR20 versus Tivo ... I have to add two other things to this post ... 1) slow-mo is another HUGE factor in my love of the Tivo over the HR20 ... especially when watching sports ... with the 3-second delay (and faster speed of slow-mo on the HR20?), the slow-mo feature is almost unusable on the HR20 ... and 2) while far less important than slow-mo, the "skip to tick" feature on the Tivo is much easier to use than on the HR20 ...
This poll really needs 2 additional options:
I would keep my HR-20 but I've never had a tivo
I would switch to tivo but I've never had a tivo.
And the 2 original poll options should add 'and I've had a tivo.'
It is stupid for someone to vote to not switch to a tivo if they've never had a tivo. How would they know? If you've ever had a tivo and an hr20, you'd pick tivo in a nano-second. Just for the fact that a tivo would ALWAYS record according to your selections vs a hr20 which is in fact a random-video-recorder. Not to mention CIR, DLB, and a better ui. Or lets just say a significant-other friendly UI.
How is that, considering that TiVo has given a broad license to D*?
Well, on the HD-Tivo it's called ratio and has a use.
Has the HR20 team really thought out the existing method of setting recording defaults? Or why the Recording menus are all off among Help and Settings rather than on the first menu screen?
I could pick at TiVo, too, mainly on speed, but the structure is a lot cleaner.
I keep reading about how the HR20 is "faster". In what specific way?
I'd switch to a MPEG4 TiVo without hesitation. The HR20 is okay, but after having used TiVo's since the early 14 hour models, I find it very hard to love.
My reasons for choosing the TiVo in this poll:
1. Suggestions/Thumbs system
2. The remote
3. DLB, of course
4. The ability to pause live TV and have it stay that way while watching something else.
5. The TiVo interface.
I miss my TiVo.
HR20 is MUCH faster in rearranging series links. On the Tivo you can go to dinner while you wait for it to finish. That's the only place I've really noticed the HR20 being faster.
I definitely feel the Tivo is faster in the guide. And I think they are just about the same everywhere else.
As for your first question...
What is the problem with having the Recording Defaults in the menu that is available, when you are setting up your recordings? Why does it have to be in a full menu, under settings?
What listing would you like to be in on the first menu? Scheduler?
I don't know why it is under Help & Settings, other that is the first default button you get on the menu.
I rarely go that way anyway... I usually go via the ToDo list... : LIST->YELLOW
Big difference between using patented technology... vs a direct copy of a product.