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KBTC Seattle SD (SE28)

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Programming' started by Renard, Sep 11, 2008.

  1. 1948GG

    1948GG Icon

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    Aug 4, 2007

    Well, the last guyed tower I climbed was in Grand Isle, LA, around 1985; 350'.

    Large microwave 'jumping off' point to the oil/gas production platforms off the coast in the gulf waters.

    After that, I swore off it! Not that it was all that 'bad', but it was kinda stupid as we had folks under contract to do the tower work, but I was impatient, and didn't want to wait another couple of days for the guys to get on site. So up I went, to repair some heliax connections and such.

    Can't even remember clearly whose tower it was (probably a 'shared' tower), or whose antennas they belonged to! But was probably either Tenneco Gas or most probably Exxon, as I was doing a lot of oil/gas microwave/sat work in the 'bidness' at that time, working out of Lafayette and Dallas.
     
  2. Renard

    Renard Godfather

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    Jun 21, 2007
    Seattle, WA
    Thanks a lot for all the replies.

    I read the link that you posted, and I was wondering something.
    The switch they are going to do on the 29th could be considered as a professional broadcasting. By that, i mean that the lambda people can't receive these feeds. (Am I right?)
    Then on February 17th everybody will recieve the digital feeds (different ones that the ones for Directv, Dish, Comcast...)
     
  3. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    What Directv will be doing is picking up the digital OTA feed instead of the analog OTA feed which is being used currently. These are the same digital signals which viewers can receive directly and have been available for quite some time, although a lot of people don't realize that you don't have to wait until February 17. If you have a digital TV or Directv receiver with a digital OTA tuner (H/HR20 or HR21+AM21) you can receive that now if the station is visible from your location. From here, I can receive the 5, 7, 9, 11, 16 and 22 digital signals, but none of the others. It might be difficult from Bellingham also. I think Comcast gets a direct (non-OTA feed) for at least some of the stations.
     
  4. levibluewa

    levibluewa Icon

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    Aug 13, 2005
    WA, OR, CA
    Regarding Comcast and 7.2. I've noticed in the morning when KIRO 7.1 starts the Morning Show, and they shift their local news to 7.2...it appears that the 7.2 signal is HD, but Comcast only carries something else? and the 16:9 is squished to 4:3.

    What accounts for this phenomena? Any ideas?

    Thanks.
     
  5. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    It's that way OTA as well. 7.2 is SD and they squish the 16:9 instead of letterboxing or center cutting it. All of the main (RTN) programming on 7.2 is 4:3, of course.
     
  6. levibluewa

    levibluewa Icon

    629
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    Aug 13, 2005
    WA, OR, CA
    is that early morning news on 7.2 actually being broadcast in HD? I would guess that it is. Are you able to pick up the OTA version? I wonder if Comcast has different qualifying standards for sub channels? They carry KONG in HD, which does the same thing in the morning as KIRO, by extending their early morning news feed.

    I know AAD (All American Direct) has the same problem with the distant nets they pick up from Atlanta. It usually strikes the NBC, and CBS stations--squished picture...sometimes the 4:3 picture is squished even more, so you end up with double pillar bars on both sides of the picture...it's like watching an old Sony tummy tv on a big screen :) Then someone notices and a tag will appear "aspect ratio adjustment" or words to that effect and click the picture returns to normal.

    I'm assuming that there is no magic correcting tool for this aspect ratio problem. I get the same result when I feed the out of my sat receivers thru a Radio Shack rf converter to a 2nd tv. Actually, the DISH box corrects it, to letterbox, etc., but the Directv doesn't. You either have to reset tv1 or put up with the squish on the 2nd tv.

    Thanks for your input, much appreciated.

    Bruce
     
  7. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

    12,435
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    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    The digital channel that is used has a limited total bandwidth. The more sub-channels that are squeezed into it, the lower the resolution/bandwidth of each of those channels.

    Typically, a station will run one sub-channel at most (e.g., 5.1 and 5.2, 7.1 and 7.2, 13.1 and 13.2 in the Seattle market). Channels 9, 15, 20, 28, 33 and 45 (in the Seattle market) have multiple sub-channels which means their primary "HD" channel is lower resolution than it could be - they are using tha bandwidth to squeeze more SD channels in.

    I highly doubt that KIRO is running HD on both 7.1 and 7.2 at the same time - but it is possible if both are "marginal HD", or as folks used to refer to regarding DirecTV, "HD Light".

    Set your receiver to Native On, then use your TV to see the actual resolution coming to it from the receiver/dvr (most HD TV sets can do that).

    Carl
     
  8. levibluewa

    levibluewa Icon

    629
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    Aug 13, 2005
    WA, OR, CA
    the 7.2 I received is filtered thru Comcast basic which is squished to 4:3. Using the picture mode on the tv...when adjusted to full (16:9) the picture appears normal...that's why I believe that it is an HD feed. Of course, I could be WRONG !!!
     
  9. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

    8,473
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    Bainbridge...
    KIRO is taking the HD 16:9 video and converting it to SD 4:3 by downrezzing and squishing. Since it is digital, the resolution still looks pretty good (like the news on KOMO or the widescreen SD stuff that KCTS used to have on 9.1 before that became their HD channel). It is that way OTA, so I doubt that Comcast is changing anything. I haven''t checked but suspect that if I set my HR20 to stretched format, it would look normal. I'm not sure how it would look on an analog TV with a converter box (I don't know what options those boxes have).

    The RTN content on 7.2 isn't as sharp, but that is probably how KIRO receives it from the network.

    KONG has a HD newscast on 16.1 and crops it for their SD subchannel 16.2 so that it is not squished.
     
  10. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

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    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    I was checking 7.1 and 7.2 OTA (using HR22 and AM21). Comcast basic (analog) doesn't carry the sub-channels. You've got to have some version of their digital cable service to get that. Well, that actually isn't true. If you've got a QAM tuner in your TV set, you can tune the digital channels off basic Comcast, but they come in at very strange channel numbers.

    Carl
     
  11. seadan

    seadan Mentor

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    Jan 23, 2006
    I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I'm seeing terrible ghosting on SE5 (KING) on the SD feed. Is it me or is this just an issue with DTV's feed? It's especially evident when there's any text shown on the screen.
     
  12. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    That should improve next week when Directv starts picking up the digital OTA instead of analog. Of course it will still be overcompressed.
     
  13. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    Comparing the HD and SD feeds on a couple of stations, it looks like the September 29 transition for pickup of Seattle locals didn't happen. I haven't seen a revised schedule yet.
     
  14. skyboysea

    skyboysea Icon

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    Nov 1, 2002
    I agree. KING-SD this morning was a textbook case of ghosting and reflections, even worse than KBTC has been in the past days.
     
  15. Renard

    Renard Godfather

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    Jun 21, 2007
    Seattle, WA
    I noticed this morning that KCTC channel 9 Seattle is now broadcasting in HD, but i wonder if it's really HD, because it is still on the SD feed SE9
     
  16. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    It's downconverted HD.

    Directv is now picking up the digital feed of the locals for the SD version (this was supposed to happen on Monday, but didh't take place until this morning). Since KCTS shows "HD" in their bug, it will also show up on SE9. The crawl at the bottom of SE16 during the news is set up for widescreen so the Comcast ad and the time/temperature area are cut off.

    The picture quality looks somewhat better, particularly on those stations which had recent problems (KING 5, KBTC 28).
     
  17. skyboysea

    skyboysea Icon

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    Nov 1, 2002
    The picture quality on the PBS stations is much better it has been in a while.
    The downside is that not all the content is 4:3 safe. KCTS is running it fund rising and the first 4 digits of the phone number is cut off. Some slides they were showing were 4:3 stretched to 16:9 and so they were missing part of the content. I noticed the same thing on some commercials on KONG.
     
  18. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    I noticed today that the crawl is gone from KING and KONG news programs. Perhaps they are reprogramming it so that it is center-cut safe.

    KOMO's HD signal was gone for much of today, but it is back. There was a slide saying it was a station problem, but with the same feed being used for SD that doesn't make sense, because KOMO SD was still there.
     
  19. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

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    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    I emailed KOMO and got a reply that said the digital transmitter was down for work. I noticed it down around 6:30 this morning, but it was back up for prime time. Both the OTA ATSC signal, and DirecTV's HD feed were down. SD (DirecTV) was still working, which means that isn't being taken from the digital transmission. I've got an ATSC converter box for OTA, and KOMO was also dead on that.

    Carl
     
  20. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

    8,473
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    Jun 29, 2006
    Bainbridge...
    Hmm, maybe Directv didn't switch all of the feeds to digital, after all (or possibly they still had the analog feed in place and switched to it when the digital signal went down).
     

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