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Losing hair trying to install dish

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by juicemavin, Oct 17, 2012.

  1. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    I have a SL3SPIG-P Multisatellite Ka/KU LNB Built-in Multi Switch. Out the bottom of the satellite are 4 cat 6 pigtails. From there I am going into the house with B band converters into a HD H22 receiver.

    Cable distances are maybe 20 feet with a level dish set to the appropriate azimuth, tilt, etc.

    On the receiver I have Slimline 3 selected with 02 - Multi-switch selected

    I continuously get the trouble communicating with the satellite messages (771A I believe).

    What am I missing here? Should I need a PI with the SL3PIG-P?

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. Davenlr

    Davenlr Geek til I die

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    Sep 16, 2006
    You are missing a signal from the satellite. It will give you that message until you aim it and find the satellite. Start with 101 (single transponder, not the full list) and move dish until you find it, peak it, then switch to a signal on 99c and peak that one. Then the 771A message will go away.

    BTW, Im not sure there is an H22 receiver. If its a H21, or HR22, you are ok. If its a H23, then you dont need the B Band converter.
     
  3. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    Thanks for the response... I just did a restore to default (based on another post). Once it finishes that I will work on 101 to adjust for optimal signal.

    BTW I was wrong its a R22/200 receiver. Does that raise any flags with my equipment/configuration.

    Thanks a ton for your help.
     
  4. Davenlr

    Davenlr Geek til I die

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    Well, it raises one flag. If your account (and that box) is not authorized for HD service, you wont get anything on 99 or 103, since those satellites are for HD (for the most part). You will get a signal on the signal meter, but none of the channels will be authorized to come in. If you do have HD service, and that R22 is authorized for HD, then it will behave exactly the same as an HR22.
     
  5. Lindsey-Star

    Lindsey-Star Cool Member

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    Jul 22, 2010
    771A would indicate you have a SWM system and then you noted you are using a B-Band Converter. Those two things do not go together.

    Check settings on your receiver to see if you have it set to SWM or multiswitch. If you do, indeed, have a SWM, you should not have the BBC and you should have a power inserter.
     
  6. iceman2a

    iceman2a Icon

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    Dec 30, 2005
    Hudson, FL...
    Contridictory information!
    If you have an sl3s that should be a SWiM LNB. Only 1 coax out!

    (771a can't comunicate with dish) indicates it is a SWM!

    BBC's are not needed but a PI is! You need to find out what EXACTLY it is you have!


    Like Lindsey-Star said if I only continued to read!
     
  7. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    Oh Man... my bad... I am so confused. It's an SL3PIG-P it does not have the "S" as I originally indicated.

    That being said. The BBC's are correct? Is a PI required? is the 771A specific to SWM only?

    I did notice that if I power off the reciever and power it back on it defaults back to SWM in the configuration. I then change it to Multiswitch but it seems like it keeps going back to SWM.

    Maybe my issue has something to do with that.

    BTW... I just went up to the store and bought a new LNB out of frustration. Same LNB.... Same Problem.

    Thanks all for your help!
     
  8. jimmie57

    jimmie57 Hall Of Fame

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    After you choose multiswitch,
    then go back and change the dish type. The order in the menus is out of order for some reason.
     
  9. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    Nothing seems to be working... I'm going to lose it.

    So going back over this.

    I have a slimline dish with the 3 LNB with 4 ports on the LNB
    I've switched the receiver to Slimline - 3 and Multiswitch
    I have 2 coax cables going into the receiver connected to B Band Converters

    I have adjusted the dish for hours and am getting nothing. I have a clear sky and by the way a brand new LNB just to make sure.

    Any suggestions? I first want to know that my configuration should work.

    Then I would like to determine a better way to get signal. Unfortunately I only have the receiver to measure signal with. Is it common to have issues when working with just the receiver and not a meter?

    Thanks again all of those that have helped.
     
  10. peds48

    peds48 Genius. DBSTalk Club

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    the problem with aligning a dish with a receiver is that there is a delay on the receivers signal meters. while a meter has a "real time" response.
     
  11. wahooq

    wahooq New Member

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    Oct 19, 2011
    Tulsa, OK
    $49.00...have a tech save your hair
     
  12. billsharpe

    billsharpe Hall Of Fame

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    Southern...
    Yes, it's time for a truck roll... :)
     
  13. eakes

    eakes Godfather

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    Sep 21, 2007
    This is an easy task if one starts properly. First, the mast must be vertically plumb - if this is off more than a degree alignment becomes exceedingly difficult.

    With a plumb mast set tilt and elevation for the numbers indicated in setup for your zip code. With those set use a compass to set the azimuth. Connect the receiver and go to the individual transponder screen for the 101 satellite. At this point you should have a signal. The last antenna I aligned about 2 years ago was dead on using this setup technique, I had high ninetys on 101 when I connected the receiver, although I went though the fine adjusts, no improves could be found beyond the initial setup.

    To adjust, position a TV such that you can see the screen while adjusting (align using a single transponder, do not try to use the consolidated screen which shows all the transponders on a satellite), first adjust azimuth left and right slooowly while watching the screen (there is a lag between movement of the dish and the screen display, so pause for a few seconds after each bit of movement). If no signal move azimuth back to your center position. Adjust elevation slightly then repeat azimuth adjustments.

    At some point you will have a signal. Once you acquire a signal peak with azimuth and elevation adjustments. At this point check some of the channels to see if you are on the right satellite (if a new receiver only a few of the 'barker' channels can be seen).

    Finish by peaking on the 103 or 99 continental satellites.
     
  14. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    Thanks to all of those that have responded.

    I've got one last idea before I give up. On the back of the r22/200 receiver there are two inputs for satellite connections. Port 1 on the top says SWM-2. Is it possible or likely that this solution only works with an SWM lnb vs the one I've been trying to use in this thread?

    I've talked to several different installers on the phone who mention it "should" work. The last one admitted that he just installs them though. Saying he doesn't pay much attention to what lnb goes with which receiver.

    Thanks again!
     
  15. jimmie57

    jimmie57 Hall Of Fame

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    If you had a SWM LNB then yes you would use just one coax to that connection.
    Since you do not have SWM you use both connections.
    Did you try choosing multiswitch and then go back and choose the dish type ?

    Most people are not far enough east with their aiming when they try this for the first time. There is a difference of quite a bit in the magnetic and true compass angles.
    Set the Tilt and forget it,
    Set the elevation and forget it for now,
    Start about 10 degrees too far east and very very slowly rotate the dish to the west and watch the signal strengths on the 101 satellite.
     
  16. peds48

    peds48 Genius. DBSTalk Club

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    here is the DirecTV "approved" method of aligning an slimline dish. replace "meter" with the DirecTV signal meter on the receiver


    Alignment:
Set Azimuth, Elevation and Tilt based on the customers Zip Code
    Rough peak the Azimuth pointing at the 101 satellite location by obtaining the highest possible signal level on your signal level meter, with the azimuth rough aligned, tighten the mast clamp bolts.
Using the Azimuth screw bolt, turn clock wise and counter clock wise until you get the highest signal level on the 101 satellite.
    Using the Elevation screw bolt, turn clock wise and counter clock wise until you get the highest signal level on the 101 satellite.
Record the signal level for 101, Set the Elevation plastic dial to zero.
Using the Elevation screw bolt, turn 2 full turns counter clock wise, record the signal level. Rotate the bolt clockwise counting the number of turns until the same signal level is reached. Divide this number of turns by 2, turn the Elevation plastic dial to zero.
    Rotate the Elevation screw counter clock wise by the divided number of turns, tighten the Elevation bolts down.
The signal level should be the same or higher than with your rough alignment.
Record the signal level for 101, Set the Azimuth plastic dial to zero.
    Using the Azimuth screw bolt, turn 2 full turns counter clock wise, record the signal level.
Rotate the bolt clockwise counting the number of turns until the same signal level is reached. Divide this number of turns by 2, turn the Azimuth plastic dial to zero.
Rotate the Azimuth screw counter clock wise by the divided number of turns, tighten the Azimuth bolts down. The signal level should be the same or higher than with your rough alignment.
    Check all nuts and bolts and make sure they are tightened to specification. Pay close attention to the LNB lock down bolts. They must be installed wrench tight to prevent LNB movement.
     
  17. Jason Drummer

    Jason Drummer Cool Member

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    Oct 21, 2012
    The problem with pointing an ODU with the signal meters on the Receiver is it is only showing Signal Quality (data packets) not actual signal power. Using the signal meter on the Receiver is like looking at a bucket of water from the top... You can see that there is water in there but not how full it is. Using an AIM meter (a DTV tech will have this) you can actually read the Signal Power in dbms (looking at the bucket from the side) You can have 98% signal strength and still be almost out of wack. aka early rain fade, pixilization, the whole nine. 1/30" is roughly 778 miles off from the bird in space when you are dealing with Ka frequencies. You need to get a real time meter. Follow the previous posts step with a signal meter. You can use a birddog, a sat buddy, supper sat buddy, or an AIM. However... all of these are more expensive than the $50 you'll spend on a service call.

    771A is an indication of an interuption of the 2.3MHz frequency used to comunicate with the SWiM LNB or Module. You will NOT see this on a Traditional LNB (if you have four outputs on the LNB it is a Traditional)

    Your current setup should be;

    Four lines down to a groundblock> 2 lines to the back of your receiver > 2 BBCs in line next > connect both to the DVR (order does not matter here as long as they are both connected to input 1 and 2) > on setup screen you should have SlimLine 3 selected on your LNB > Multiswitch setup on your Switch selection. Only SWiM auto-detects the LNB.

    Are you running the LNB into a SWiM Module? aka SWiM 8 or SWiM 16? This could be the only reason you would be getting these errors. That would require a completely different setup.

    Hope this helps.
     
  18. Davenlr

    Davenlr Geek til I die

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    I align C and Ku band dishes several times a year. Those receivers have both a signal stregth and quality meter on the same page.

    I have never found any situation where the signal quality went higher and the signal strength went lower. I have found that you can get higher quality by fine tuning, with the strength remaining static. Theoretically, the stronger signal should relate to stronger quality, but on the receivers I use, you can go from 0% quality to 98% quality with the strength remaining at 70% and barely moving a point up or down.

    I would bet a higher (highest possible) signal quality would result in the least amount of rain fade.
     
  19. Jason Drummer

    Jason Drummer Cool Member

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    Oct 21, 2012
    Completely agreed and well put. However the issue isn't with the Ku frequencies (aka the 101) You can do that all day long. And while yes you can "eventually" get the Ka birds in also it will take quite a while. If you peak the 99 to max signal, the 103 will suffer because they don't park at max signal when properly tuned. Theory aside, I personally have an IRD at the shop that is -62 dbm (only 3 -dbms away from pixiliating) showing 98% accross the board. The DTV Hx series boxes have (on average) a floor of -65dbm and a ceeling of -25dbms. You can't get the dbms from the signal strength screen.
     
  20. juicemavin

    juicemavin New Member

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    Oct 17, 2012
    It's working!!!

    So I brought my LNB and receiver into a dish shop and we troubleshot for over an hour. Here's what we figured out...

    1. Receiver worked immediately with their SWM lnb setup
    2. Receiver would not get signal with their multiswitch lnb
    3. Took their lnb and my lnb outside with a meter and got full signal from each.
    4. Went back inside and found one of the BBC's to be bad.
    5. Replaced BBC and still could not get signal from perfectly aligned multiswitch lnb.
    6. Went back to SWM and upgraded the firmware
    7. Still nothing with multiswitch lnb.
    8. Bought a new SWM and pi brought it home and I had a 99% signal within 5 minutes.

    What a headache. BUT it's ready in time for NFL Sunday ticket.

    Thanks all those who helped.
     

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