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More support for a decision that I made years ago...

Discussion in 'The OT' started by Richard King, Mar 11, 2006.

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  1. Richard King

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    http://www.churchnewspaper.com/news...ing Bishop laments US policy from Cuba pulpit
    US Presiding Bishop laments US policy from Cuba pulpit

    Many years ago I left the Episcopal Church becuase of changes that I saw coming in their leadership (along with changes to the services). My feelings have now been reinforced by the presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church of the US when he stated from the pulpet IN Cuba:
     
  2. Nick

    Nick Retired, part-time PITA DBSTalk Club

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    That's what happens when leftist liberals infiltrate (infest?) traditionally moderate-to-conservative institutions. Sadly, the Episcopal Church isn't the only church organization to slip down this slippery slope. I'm thankful that they didn't take you with them.

    Reminds me of the story of the old farm couple gong to church one Sunday. As they were driving along in accustomed silence in their beat up pickup truck, the farmer's wife broke the silence, saying "I sure miss the old days when we were young and you drove with your arm around me. Now we sit on opposite sides of the seat?"

    Without taking his eyes off the road, the farmer replied "Who moved?"
     
  3. jonstad

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    The situation in Cuba, as described here and in the other Cuba thread, might be quite different had we not decided to arbitrarily isolate Cuba militarily, politically, economically and socially for the unforgivable sin of choosing a path not preapproved and blessed by the US. Or it could have been quite different if we hadn't stubbornly maintained that isolation come hell or high water largely due to the influence of a small but powerful Cuban expatriate community in south Florida. Probably never in the history of this nation has such an otherwise insignificant immigrant group been able to dictate and control the foreign policy of the USA.:nono:

    All that said, many of the criticisms of Castro's regime and policies are justified. Castro for his part has been just as stubborn and unyielding, often choosing defiance of the US over what might be best for his people. But the position of the US has made this very easy for him to do. It's created a siege mentality that Castro has exploited very well and without which the Cuban people might have well turned to another leader, or at least forced him to moderate his policies.

    Castro now strikes me as someone in the grips of what appears to be a bit of senile dementia. He continues to rail against the US as much out of habit as anything, and from decades of practice.

    But even through the criticisms of the Canadian reporter from the other thread link, there seems to be the tacit admission that Castro's education and health policies at least, when previously fully funded by the Soviets, were effective and a benefit to the population.(I'll repost the link here)
    http://www.churchnewspaper.com/news...ing Bishop laments US policy from Cuba pulpit

    That a dictator of a small impoverished nation should institute seemingly arbitrary measures should come as no great surprise. Instead of increasing the availability of electricity by expansion and maintainance of existing capacity, Castro has chosen the draconian and Orwellian route of forced conservation.

    That Castro is largely responsible for the current sad state of Cuba is not in dispute. But the US should not be terribly proud of the role we have played in this drama either. By neglect, a neglect enforced by law, we have done more than our share to insure the Cuban people remain impoverished. And ironically, this forced neglect is undoubtedly a major reason why Castro, the man we have been trying to topple for nearly a half century, remains in power, and will remain so 'til the day he dies!
     
  4. Fifty Caliber

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    The current line of thinking is that Castro's regime will die with him. His system of goverance will end when he either dies or retires. This leaves him with a choice, he can end the current situation be retiring, or he can continue the status quo untill he dies.

    Castro has the choice at any time to end this whole mess, and he chooses not to.
     
  5. jonstad

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    Right!:rolleyes:

    Castro should admit he was wrong all along and repudiate what his entire life has stood for. Yeah, that's gonna happen!:sure:

    I'm sure I'll get some argument here, but I have to believe Castro is at least as sincere in his beliefs and vision as any of his adversaries over the years at 1700 Pennsylvania Avenue. At least he wasn't basing policies on Florida's electoral votes!:nono: If you think he's going to capitulate now after nearly fifty years of struggle, you're sorely mistaken.

    In the cited piece, the impression given is that Hugo Chavez and Evo Morales are the only nations on friendly terms with Cuba. In fact many nations maintain cordial relations with Cuba. And many that don't simply don't want to offend the USA or be subject to sanctions and penalties themselves. And nearly all of them don't understand why we continue the embargo except in the context of US wanting to crush this much smaller, weaker nation because they will not bend to our will.

    And in much of the world, especially Latin America, Castro is a bit of a folk hero. Admired and respected not so much for his politics or because they envy the plight of Cubans, but because he has had the cahones to stand up to the US and survive in spite of the best(or worst) we could throw at him short of a military invasion, and we even tried that ONCE!

    And even if Castro would step down, or when he dies, don't be so sure the Cuban nation will welcome back the residents of South Florida who took their cash and abandoned them. If they expect their plantations, hotels and casinos will be graciously restored to them with apologies and back rent, I think they've got a big surprise coming. Perhaps the Cubans will opt for a change from Castro, but I think very few will want to return to the days before Castro.
     
  6. Nick

    Nick Retired, part-time PITA DBSTalk Club

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    No argument here, except that being sincere in one's beliefs is no virtue -- one can
    fervently believe in something and still be wrong.
     
  7. SamC

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    The liberal church has lots of faith and plenty of beliefs.

    None of them consistant with, or based upon, any Christian religion as understood by any branch of the Faith up until about 1960.

    The same spew came from the same intelectual lightweights in the 80s. Peaceful co-existance. Nuke freeze. Third Way. All this same garbage.

    Until one wonderful night in October, when the people they, in their illiteracy, claimed just wanted "peaceful co-existance" showed the world want they really wanted. They wanted to be free of the chains of Communism. They ripped down their prison wall from within and dance on it. And with it, danced of the intelectual and moral vaccum that was, and is, modern liberalism. We found out that people in Poland, etc didn't disagree with us, they just didn't get a voice in their government.

    And the red banner was ripped down and tossed onto the ash heap of history. Just as Reagan, Thatcher, Koh, and John Paul II the Great, said it would be.

    Castro will die and go to hell soon. He will be replaced by another bloodthusty dictator.

    Someday. Maybe soon, maybe long from now, the Cuban people will be free and the Cuban communists (all 40 of them) will be shot, or exiled to some worthless country like France.

    And on that day this "bishop" should put his head down in shame and say to himself "I really have no soul". But then again, if he had one, he would have learned that basic lesson in 1990. Or 1945.
     
  8. Fifty Caliber

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    IIRC, The last time the Modern French nation won a war where they were not either fighting themselves or fighting with the help of the Americans, was the Thirty Years War. And they didn't get involved in that one till late in the game.
     
  9. jonstad

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    How delightfully simple, but oh so uninteresting, to live an a world that is completely black and white!
     
  10. Nick

    Nick Retired, part-time PITA DBSTalk Club

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    Well, considering the substantial and unfettered illegal immigration of our neighbors from the south, perhaps we should seek instead, the simplicity of a semi-poly-chromatic world that is 'black, brown and white'.
     
  11. Bogy

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    The first line is very correct. The second part is only your opinion, based on no fact, illustrates only your lack of knowledge of the Bible, the teaching of Jesus, the historic Christian church, and is ridiculous. :lol:
     
  12. juan ellitinez

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    Bogy, Do you( as a Christian Minister) believe in Hell??
     
  13. Bogy

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    Yes. But very likely not in exactly the same way you do (if you do). So?
     
  14. juan ellitinez

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    just curious.. Can you elaborate a little more ?
     
  15. Bogy

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    First off, do YOU believe in hell?
     
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