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mountain network /pac12 network...

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Programming' started by sticketfan, May 18, 2012.

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  1. Jun 20, 2012 #121 of 1671
    maartena

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    Well, from what I can figure out.... All Universities have signed over the broadcast rights to PAC12, 4 cable providers have signed on for the PAC12 channels, the main channels and at least 1 local for each lineup they support in affected market areas, and the games will therefore be broadcast *only* on the PAC12 channels.

    DirecTV is not the only one though.... Dish, U-Verse, and FIOS also have not yet signed a deal. U-verse and FIOS are just like cable, and could sign similar deals: The main channel and 1 local channel for the region. FIOS will probably sign a deal soon, U-verse is not really known for their sports so sports lovers won't have signed up with them in the first place.... but losing access to USC/UCLA in the Los Angeles area might mean some customer bleeding.

    DirecTV probably has the hardest choice to make.
     
  2. Jun 20, 2012 #122 of 1671
    JoeTheDragon

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    The BIG TEN teams have some of there games on CSN and FSN.

    Both teams need to be able to show the games and you should be able to see your local area team with out needing to buy the sports pack.

    now on cable where you may just have the out of area PAC 12 national channel they can easily feed in the game on a alt channel or the local CSN or FSN can pick it up and put on there own channels.

    on directv they may need at the very least all 7 channels part time (CONUS) to make all games show up 100% of the time with having to hope that local FSNs or CSN will pickup the games.
     
  3. Jun 20, 2012 #123 of 1671
    JoeTheDragon

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    How does that broadcast *only* on the PAC12 channels. Work when they play a non PAC12 team?
     
  4. Jun 20, 2012 #124 of 1671
    sdk009

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    The PAC-12 owns the broadcast rights for all home games of PAC-12 teams only. When a PAC-12 team plays a road non-conference game, the rights belong to the home school that they are playing.

    For those discussing FS San Diego, don't forget that with the.mtn dissolved, SDSU has an interest in getting their games not carried by CBSCS or NBCS on FS SD.
     
  5. Jun 20, 2012 #125 of 1671
    David Ortiz

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    The regional Pac-12 Networks on spot-beams would be extremely short-sighted and probably the least likely to happen.
     
  6. Jun 20, 2012 #126 of 1671
    inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

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    Why would that be? The only thing the PAC 12 expects to be picked up everywhere nationally is the national channel. Plus they could always bump them to nation after the next sat launch if it made sense to then based on viewership, etc, and that allows more bandwidth to stay freed up for other national Hi Definition.
     
  7. Jun 20, 2012 #127 of 1671
    David Ortiz

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    The regional networks make sense for the cable companies, but absolutely no sense for satellite, with regard to live sports. There will be times, probably lots of times, when all seven channels are showing the exact same event.

    I don't need to explain the advantage satellite has over cable from the view of a sports fan, but that advantage disappears when channels are on spot beams.

    If DIRECTV does it right, then it could be the go to provider for any PAC-12 university sports fan.

    BTW, the 350 events are slated for the Pac-12 National channel and are supposed to be simulcast to all six regional channels. The other 500 events are slated to be on the regional networks only. A total of 850 live events are slated for the first year.
     
  8. Jun 21, 2012 #128 of 1671
    alevine1986

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    This seems to be the same arguement Directv has with the Longhorn Network. If they added all seven channels full time, then the networks would be covering 1.7 schools each. Most of this thread has people saying that they think Directv would be crazy not to pick this up. However, the thread on the Longhorn Network had most people saying that Directv would be crazy to pick it up because it serves only one school. It seems to be about the same arguement, but people are taking the exact opposite sides of it.
     
  9. Jun 21, 2012 #129 of 1671
    maartena

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    Well.... there are some arguments to be made here.

    When DirecTV opted not to pick up Longhorn Network, they LOST 1 school, and probably a number of customers who wanted to see the Longhorn games, that switched to a provider that carried it. But they were viewers from 1 single market.

    With PAC12, there are fans of 12 universities, spread over 6 or 7 states, including really big markets like Los Angeles, where USC and UCLA - 2 of the schools in PAC12 - almost have a bigger following than any NFL team, as the Los Angeles market hasn't got a NFL team. On top of that, DirecTV is headquartered in Los Angeles, and is hugely popular in that region.

    So they could potentially lose a LOT more customers then the Longhorn deal.

    Also, we don't really know the numbers. It could be that the price PER network, and thus the price PER school/university would be cheaper.... it could be that Longhorn asked way too much, and DirecTV is looking at the risk/rewards and decided to send a message.

    I think the biggest factor in all this is the potential loss of customers, which is a lot bigger with 12 schools vs 1 school.
     
  10. Jun 22, 2012 #130 of 1671
    WebTraveler

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    There's one additional take on all of this - what happened IF every conference or every university set up their own channel...that's a nightmare for Directv or any provider, really.

    Big 10 did it, Pac 12, then what? SEC. ACC, Big 12? It can get out of hand. Also, Directv owns some of the RSNs that lose content IF all of this happens. They are also protecting their own investment.

    But as a practical matter I've spoken with escalation folks in the Office of the President. More or less they told me that any channel decision comes from the number of calls, complaints, etc. they have. If enough people want the channel and tell them that then it has a better likelihood of happening. Call them up and tell them you want the Pac 12. 1-866-785-5535. It's worth a shot.


     
  11. Jun 22, 2012 #131 of 1671
    JoeTheDragon

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  12. Jun 22, 2012 #132 of 1671
    alevine1986

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  13. Jun 22, 2012 #133 of 1671
    alevine1986

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    If they agreed to show the national channel only and use part time channels for overflow games, I completely agree with your logic.

    However, if they add all seven channels full time, then they are taking up a lot more bandwidth and you need to weigh the cost of all that bandwidth over the amount of programming. The national channel would be nothing but an event found on one of the other six channels and practally useless if all seven channels were available. In this scenario they'd have to weigh the value of 1.7 universities worth of coverage per channel. It seems to me that is about the same ratio as the Longhorn Network. Also, a previous poster mentioned they might pick up a Texas Tech game, so it looks like the LHN will broadcast games of other schools, so it's coverage numbers go up.
     
  14. Jun 22, 2012 #134 of 1671
    maartena

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    Well, regardless of how they solve it from a technical/bandwidth point of view, DirecTV is still looking at losing a fanbase of 12 schools as their customer. How exactly they will do it, remains to be seen.....But they probably can't just lose a few minor schools and keep some of the big ones, this is an "all or nothing" deal that the Pac12 is presenting.

    And that alone makes it vastly different then the Longhorn network. They can afford to lose 1 school. And perhaps their customer base in Austin, TX wasn't all that strong either way (I don't know this), and it was a risk worth taking. You are only looking it from a math perspective. But from your "1.7 schools" perspective, one could conclude that the "SmallVille Highschool Channel" with the local football team showing all their 30 games, is the same as the "Notre Dame Channel" showing all of their 30 football games. After all, they are both "just 1 school" right?

    The markets in the Pac12 are vastly different then the Longhorn market. Some are smaller, but half of them are significantly bigger. Such as the Greater Los Angeles area with 2 schools and a population of 18 million who do not have a NFL football team, and two stadiums that each fit almost 100k. It may still be "just 2 schools in the 1.7 schools per channel" average, but the following here is huge. REALLY huge. It's the next best thing after having a local NFL team. Then there is the Phoenix/Tuscon feud, and the Bay Area which are both also significant markets.

    There are different dynamics at play. The Los Angeles market is currently undergoing major shifts in broadcast rights of very popular sports teams, and they are also the breeding ground of DirecTV with an enormous customer base.... so there is a lot more to consider here then the "average number of schools per channel".

    And the fact that PAC12 already signed on with pretty much all cable providers in the PAC12 market (Los Angeles greater area is completely covered with TWC and Cox) just makes it more difficult for DirecTV, as customers have a place to go now.
     
  15. Jun 22, 2012 #135 of 1671
    inkahauts

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    Something else to consider, not only is there a price per channel, but total payments are usually based on number of subscribers to the package containing the channels, and who knows what they could decide to do with all these channels. I could see them carrying all six regionals, giving each market their own regional channel, and all the other market channels being in the sports pack for the regions someone is not in. That would heavily deflate the costs of these channels overall, by not supplying all the regionals to everyone in a regular package. It makes quite a bit of sense to do that.

    Then they could throw the national channel also into a regular tier, so realistically, you would give everyone in the country one channel like the big ten, each region would also gets its local channel and anyone else that wanted more could pop for the sports pack.

    And at the moment, based on other things we know, bandwidth really doesn't appear to be an issue at all, for any of the 11 or 12 RSNs launching in the next 9 months, while still leaving room for plenty of other channels that might get turned on. At last count the guess is they have room for 40 or so more Hi Definition channels.
     
  16. Jun 22, 2012 #136 of 1671
    alevine1986

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    Since you are a fan of PAC 12 football and I am a fan of the Longhorns, we both seem to be making a case for the channel we want and I think we both have good arguements. As a college football fan and Directv subscriber, I want Directv to add the PAC 12 Network as well (I'd be fine with just the national channel and overflow channels for multiple games).

    However, I think you are grossly underestimating the popularity of the Longhorns. UT has the highest athletic revenue of any school in the country. 10 of the 12 schools in the PAC 12 don't even approach UT's popularity. It's not just the Austin market, there are alumni and fans who didn't go to the school throughout the state. When they've played in Dallas, Houston, or San Antonio, they pack the stadium every time. A few years ago they played at UTEP and UT fans with buying UTEP season tickets for that one game. Texas has two top 10 DMA's and the whole PAC 12 footprint has two top 10 DMA's. Seattle and Phoenix are just outside the top 10, but Austin and San Antonio are in top 50 as well. However there hasn't been a mass exodus to FIOS. I haven't switched because I'd rather have the NFL ST and more HD sports than two Longhorns games per season.

    Let's hope we both get what we want, the Pac 12 Network and the Longhorn Network by the time the season kicks off.
     
  17. Jun 23, 2012 #137 of 1671
    JoeTheDragon

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  18. Jun 23, 2012 #138 of 1671
    sum_random_dork

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    While your statement about UT is true, what you're not seeing is the PAC 12 footprint includes many large DMA's: #2 LA, #5 SF Bay Area, #12 Seattle, #17 PHX, #18 Denver, #20 Sacramento, #24 Portland, and #28 San Diego. That's a lot of eyeballs DirecTV/Dish network don't want to lose. Unlike The Longhorn Network DirecTV/Dish biggest competition will be carrying the channel, Comcast and TWC. So by not adding the channel, there is truly a risk of rather large customer defections or customers downgrading their service and adding one of the carriers of the channel(s). Plus at minimum the channel will have at least 1 live football game a week in the fall, and every 3 weeks the game could possibly be the #1 game in the Pac 12.
     
  19. Jun 23, 2012 #139 of 1671
    maartena

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    I'm not a football fan at all. I consider football a sport that is played with a foot, and a ball. The sport that you like there is what I refer to as handegg. (Which is why I currently watch a lot of ESPN watching Euro 2012 games)

    And I personally could care less about Pac12. If we don't get it, fine. More room for other HD. I don't need it, won't watch it.

    I am just looking at the market size, and population, and the popularity of the team. I'm sure Longhorns are a popular team, but not having them is not really a big deal financially speaking. How many Longhorn fans have switched to another provider? Is the Longhorn network even available to you on *any* provider you can get?

    Pac 12 is 12 schools, 12 football teams, (plus baseball, softball, basketball, soccer, and more) and losing 12 schools, of which some are in markets encompassing a good 18 million people WITHOUT a local NFL team, is a much bigger deal.

    The problem with PAC12 is a double whammy. First, they have bought the rights of all 12 schools, so it is "all or nothing" in getting any games, and second, 4 of the biggest cable operators have already signed on with Pac 12, which means every sports fan that loves one of those teams enough, has a provider to go to.

    In the end, it really isn't about the amount of people they fill their stadiums with. It is about how much customers DirecTV might lose, how much they might have to pay for the teams, and what, in the end, brings the bigger bottom line.

    We both have no clue what Pac12 is charging, nor do we know what Longhorn is asking. But losing the Longhorns is a much smaller risk to DirecTV then losing 12 teams. And THAT is really what is going to make the decisions.

    Not how many championships. Not how much tickets they sold. Not how hot their cheerleaders are. Not how awesome the school is. But simply put, the bottom line. How much do we pay vs. how many subscribers can we either keep, or gain. And that sum might not have been very interesting with just 1 school, but it will be very interesting with 12 schools.
     
  20. Jun 23, 2012 #140 of 1671
    alevine1986

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    I have no idea why Tech would care if the game is on the Longhorn Network. If they're not running off the only successful coach they've ever had, they're not wanting to play a game because it would be on the Longhorn Network. This game will have no TV coverage now. You win Tech.
     
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