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MRV with DECA verses hardwired ethernet?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Connected Home' started by JRThiele, Apr 7, 2010.

  1. BudShark

    BudShark New Member

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    Aug 11, 2003
    You really think that D* abandoned Ethernet because their installers couldn't handle it? You feel the need to make a wide ranging insult against people you don't know?

    They don't NEED cat5/6 to be run. Period. They have a solution that works just fine. Complain, mischaracterize, insult all you want. DECA works great.

    You mention all these MRV beta testers. Well, here's a challenge for you.

    1) Find me 1 tester who has DECA who states that DECA is worse than Ethernet.
    2) Find me 1 tester who has DECA who states that he has excessive dropouts, poor trickplay performance, and when he went to Ethernet they went away.
    3) Fine me 1 tester who has Ethernet who states that he has dropouts, trickplay performance problems, and when he went to DECA they did NOT go away.

    You can't. And you won't. For all your posturing, for all your insults, for all your mistakes, you seem to be holding on to one thing only and that is a love of Ethernet. Fine... I'll take a line from Saturday Night Live:

    If you love Ethernet so much, why don't you marry it?

    No one insulted your beloved Ethernet, we simply pointed out why DECA had some advantages in the implementation DirecTV is using. And along the way, you began insulting me (when you were WRONG and I pointed it out and you ignored it), then insulted Doug, Lefty, VOS, and any one else - all the while you've been wrong. And wrong. And wrong. But you ignore that, and have now moved to insulting installers who you don't even know.

    Ethernet is wonderful. It is however, NOT, the second coming. You would do well to listen more, read some, and have a more open mind to that world and the fact that there is NOT only one answer to most questions.

    :soapbox:
     
  2. LameLefty

    LameLefty I used to be a rocket scientist

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    Middle...
    Okay, now you're playing games. "Broadband internet subscribers" ≠ "Number of people who have ethernet wired throughout their homes." :nono:

    By contrast, I guarantee you that every one of those 18M+ Directv subscribers has RG6 run to the locations of their receivers already. :)
     
  3. BudShark

    BudShark New Member

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    Blatant mischaracterization of the argument.

    The argument WAS ethernet infrastructure to connect DirecTV receivers IN the house for MRV purposes. Not how many homes have a single point of Ethernet connectivity in their home.

    Your facts prove nothing other than your ability to manipulate an argument into something that can support your position.
     
  4. Beerstalker

    Beerstalker Hall Of Fame

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    Again, that just means they have internet service. It does not mean that they have ethernet cable run to every room in which a D* receiver will be located. If there is no ethernet cable in the room with the D* receiver what good is it?

    Now if there is a room with a D* receiver in it then it could be assumed that there is RG6 cable going into that room that can be used to network the receiver.
     
  5. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    "The second coming" would be RVU wouldn't it?
    Oh wait, that's where DECA is heading.
     
  6. Mike Bertelson

    Mike Bertelson 6EQUJ5 WOW! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    I did make the distinction that, for the most part anyway, it’s most likely that Ethernet in most homes is limited to the connection between the PC and modem.

    However, it’s not a very large leap to connecting something else to that modem. It’s not very far down the line that the number of homes with more than one host connected to that modem will out number those that don’t. Granted, I work with a bunch of engineers so take this with a grain of salt, but they all have Ethernet home networks with multiple devices.

    Now as to how many DirecTV subs have a home Ethernet network capable of connecting two receivers, well that would be everyone with broadband in their home. I would think this is greater than those who don’t have broadband. Ok, I’ll concede that in most cases DECA over coax will be much easier to implement then extending the current Ethernet.

    I firmly believe that the majority of MRV users in the future will be using DECA. However, there will still need to be a Ethernet network to have On Demand, DirecTV2PC, etc. For the foreseeable future, Ethernet is a necessary component of, and a revenue stream for, DirecTV’s Connected Home. There’s no way around that. It will be required if there is going to be any money made from On Demand.

    For MRV we need DECA. For other features we need Ethernet...I’m just sayin’ :grin:

    Mike
     
  7. wavemaster

    wavemaster Godfather

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    Insults go both ways.

    I don't care a hoot about DECA, and I don't care how many people use it, nor have I told anyone I think they shouldn't use it.

    I just want D* to continue providing an Ethernet port. Thats all

    And when someone that seems to be really intelligent thinks Ethernet LAN's are a minority to DECA LANS well,..... honestly, how do you PC/sugar coat that?
     
  8. BudShark

    BudShark New Member

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    Please show me anywhere that anyone said that. No one did. You are confused. The conversation was Ethernet & Cat 5/6 between receivers, vs. RG6 between receivers. Then you turned it into something else on your own.

    And show me where anyone insulted you before you started bashing everyone else. I guess maybe us kids with our slicked back hair that give all your coworkers laughs because we are so clueless must really need things explained to us.
     
  9. BudShark

    BudShark New Member

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    This whole thread is about MRV. Period. No one even tried to get into the conversation of how people are connected to the Internet until wavemaster veered somewhere else.

    No one said Ethernet is bad. No one said Ethernet isn't everywhere. All that was said is the majority of DirecTV customers do not have an Ethernet infrastructure that would allow them to connect their receivers. I guess it could've been more specific by stating "without running Cat5/6 to areas where RG6 already is."
     
  10. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    And why there have been so many powerline & wireless adapters used, which are becoming "iffy" for MRV.
     
  11. RAD

    RAD Well-Known Member

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    Dripping...
    DirecTV has stopped selling the powerline adapters on their web site, they just have wireless now.
     
  12. wavemaster

    wavemaster Godfather

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    >Budshark

    I don't have time for this.

    Looking back at the thread the first insult was pointed at someone else - I mixed it up. If any of you have hurt feelings from anything I said, I am sorry it was not my intent.

    The funny thing is that after using MRV for a while the way it is, we probably won't continue to use it until they can figure out the list. In my setup you hit the list, it took 127 page downs to go through the list. LOL - DECA or Ethernet won't make that interface any better.
     
  13. ricochet

    ricochet AllStar

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    Interesting thread, but I guess I'm missing the point.

    Basically we have receivers that require coax to get signal from the dish. The argument here is that DirecTV better by gosh not take away my ability to redundantly wire them together with Ethernet? If there was an option to stream the incoming signal from the dish to the receivers over Ethernet I could see this being an issue but there isn't. You need the coax no matter what so why care if that wire is also used for MRV? I don't see how the physical media makes a house any more or less "connected".

    I could also see being upset if DirecTV requires people to pay for something or even if you had to go through the hassle of having a free install done, but that doesn't seem to be the issue here.
     
  14. Beerstalker

    Beerstalker Hall Of Fame

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    Most of us don't have an issue with them using DECA. We are just worried that they might force us to use DECA.

    I personally wired my home with SWM/RG6 Quad Shield, and gigabit ethernet to every room. I have that working with MRV right now and it works great. I tested MRV with this setup for quite a while before it was sent national and sent D* reports to help them improve it's function. Now D* says that they are going to start charging me $3/month for this feature on top of all the items that I already subscribe to (HD Access, DVR service, programming, etc.). To me the cost of developing MRV should have been covered with those fees already, it does not deserve a new fee. This is the topic of another thread though.

    What I will really be upset with is if D* suddenly decides that my curent home network that is working fine is no longer good enough for them, and that I will have to move to DECA to keep using MRV. On top of that they will want to charge me $150 for the upgrade on top of the $3/month that I will already have to pay. Especially when all they will have to do is add DECA adapters at each receiver and at my router (they charge the same $150 for upgrading others with a new dish, wiring them for SWM, and adding DECA adapters).
     
  15. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    I have been vary vocal to DirecTV through my means over this.
    "The truth is" their marketing has done the numbers and can justify adding the fee and still feel they're below the competition at this service level.
    Whether I/we agree is no longer the issue. This ship has sailed.
    The cost of the DECA upgrade has been setup for a "one price fits all", and everyone's needs will not be the same. Some will simply need more than others, so some may think they're coming out "ahead" and others won't. If you were to compare buying MoCA devices, you'll see that they start around $70 and you'd need 2 for starters.
    In everything I've heard/read, there are no plans to force everyone to DECA for MRV. There are [have been] many in DirecTV that wanted/thought this should happen, but Doug has clearly stated this isn't their plan and I've heard this through other means as well.
    Does DirecTV want everyone to use DECA?
    Sure and why they've set the upgrade price "so cheap", as an incentive.
    DirecTV would much rather tell a customer their setup is fully supported along with their service than have to say "use it at your own risk" but we'll still charge you the monthly fee.
    This just seems good business practice.
     
  16. dsw2112

    dsw2112 Always Searching

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    As Beerstalker said there is a pervasive fear, among existing customers, that D* will go DECA only for MRV. The DECA upgrade fee is touted between $99 - $150 and many simply aren't willing to pay the price. It has been said (repeatedly) that D* will continue to allow ethernet for MRV, but many are still concerned.

    I don't "think" most care about the MRV transport mechanism (obviously there are a few exceptions.) In essence, they feel that D* would be charging for a hardware solution redundant to their current ethernet setup... In other words: if the DECA upgrade were offered for free (with the $3 MRV fee) far less would be complaining...
     
  17. bigmac94

    bigmac94 AllStar

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    Hey VOS...
    Question on something you said... "The cost of the DECA upgrade has been setup for a "one price fits all", and everyone's needs will not be the same. Some will simply need more than others, so some may think they're coming out "ahead" and others won't. If you were to compare buying MoCA devices, you'll see that they start around $70 and you'd need 2 for starters."

    Will I still be able to use my 3 HR20-100s as my DVRs and Replace my H20-100 with a H24? Just worryin` on just what exactly I`ll have to do for DECA.
    The Upgrade will be a Great help to me as I have 2 Single wire Setups with a DVR & the H20. New Setup will Include Appropriate Dish & Include Replacement for my WB68 Correct? Anything Else of Note?
     
  18. dmk679

    dmk679 Cool Member

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    DECA sounds great for many homes, probably the majority right now.

    Looking forward, the amount of connected hardware will increase (eg tv, blueray, game consoles). To me, it makes sense to use a networking solution that will provide access to all devices, not just the directv box. This is why I bought a 1000' box of cat5e and learned how to run and splice cable. A little over a $100 later (and a donated 24-port 10/100 cisco switch), the whole house is up on a wired network that runs without a hiccup.
     
  19. dennisj00

    dennisj00 Hall Of Fame

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    DECA will be great for MANY homes. . . it will be installed and supported by D*tv.

    It is not the second coming of networking. . . there is no reason to try to justify it beyond ethernet.

    On a low tech comparison, it's nothing more than the use of the black/yellow pair of a 4-wire phone cable for the light on the princess phones. It was installed and maintained by the phone company. It worked.

    DECA is simply an ethernet transport on the existing RG-6 cable that puts your H/HRs on the same hub or 'cloud'. You can do the same with a switch and cat5 or good wireless.

    My network works fine for MRV, both wired and wireless. We see no difference in the trickplay on local or remote MRV on either the wired or wireless.
     
  20. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    You may be lucky or simply have a good setup, or....
    You really can't know if they is any improvement [or not] without comparing to a DECA network, though.
     

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