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New MPEG4 more susceptible to rain fade?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by MalibuRacing, Oct 18, 2007.

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  1. MalibuRacing

    MalibuRacing Legend

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    On Tuesday we had a shower pass through and I started experiencing rain fade, and I didn't think it was raining *that* hard. Have you guys noticed that the new channels are more susceptible to rain fade? My signals are normally in the mid 90's on 103b. I checked and they were in the mid 30's - low 40's when it started losing the severe pixelation. Unfortunately, I didn't check other sats or channels because I was upset that I was losing the show I was watching. :grin:
     
  2. litzdog911

    litzdog911 Well-Known Member

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    Mill Creek, WA
    I've actually found the opposite to be true .... my MPEG4 channels seem to be less effected by heavy rain. Of course, our Seattle rains are somewhat different than Alabama rains :)
     
  3. Steve Robertson

    Steve Robertson Hall Of Fame

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    I agree with the OP rain fade on this dish really does suck
     
  4. skyboysea

    skyboysea Icon

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    In my experience rain fade is less of a problem on MPEG4 channels than it is on MPEG2 channels. With signal strength in the low 20s I had no pixellation or signal loss.
     
  5. Tom Robertson

    Tom Robertson Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    To answer the question is a bit complex. Yes, the frequencies used by the MPEG4 channels are more susceptible to rain fade--given the same sized reflector and same style LNB.

    So DIRECTV engineered a better reflector, better fine-tuning alignment, and better LNBs. The net effect seems to be that on a properly aligned dish (that isn't having LNB problems) less rain fade issues, just as litzdog911 (and I) are experiencing.

    So anyone having rain fade problems should consider having their dish realigned.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  6. say-what

    say-what Active Member

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    New Orleans
    Problems with rain, no. Problems with lines of heavy thunderstorms with thick, high cloud tops moving in from the S/SW in the New Orleans area, yes.
     
  7. Tom Robertson

    Tom Robertson Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    And always remember, it might be a storm between you and the satellites, not directly overhead that is the problem. You can be in sunshine and still have a big storm to the south causing problems.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  8. Steady Teddy

    Steady Teddy Godfather

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    Jan 23, 2007
    Are we talking about the slimline dish here?
     
  9. Steve Robertson

    Steve Robertson Hall Of Fame

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    I am having a second visit from D* this Saturday and hopefully a person that understands the dish better the guy I had last week did the original install and said that was the best that I can get for signals 70-80 on the 1-8 transponders and 80's + on the rest with a few 90's. I have the slimline dish so we shall see what happens this weekend.
     
  10. Tom_S

    Tom_S Icon

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    Apr 9, 2002
    Well my dish is properly peaked, when it rains my MPEG4(Ka band) signals always go down first. The last channels standing are SD locals from a Ku spotbeam.
     
  11. bobojay

    bobojay Godfather

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  12. dwrats_56

    dwrats_56 Godfather

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    Here in central Missouri we have had a couple of nice steady rains over the past week, and I have not noticed any rain fade. (and I have only been watching HD programming)

    If my memory serves me, before D10 went live, I would have experienced rain with any type of shower.
     
  13. RJRGator

    RJRGator New Member

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    Aug 17, 2007
    I have a slimline dish & I have experienced the same issue - the locals go out with the slightest of rain but so far the national channels have been solid. I have not noticed whether the HD or SD go out at different times but I'll keep an eye on that moving forward.
     
  14. MalibuRacing

    MalibuRacing Legend

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    I have the standard AT9 dish, not the slimline.
     
  15. Tom Robertson

    Tom Robertson Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    That will still be true, Ku, especially spotbeams, are least affected by rain and most powerful (roughly) received. And the Ku SD signals will also benefit from the larger reflector and better LNB.

    What you should see is better rain characteristics than you ever had before on any previous dish.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  16. techrep

    techrep Hall Of Fame

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    We can ask K4SMX, but I believe, the higher the frequency; the more punch.
     
  17. Tom Servo

    Tom Servo Icon

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    A good line of storms (finally) moved through the area late last night. 110/119 were the first out, followed by 99 and 103. The new HD channels did seem to go out sooner. Unlike the old single sat dish, it appears that the 101 goes out quicker now... :sad: Especially the transponders above 24. They were all zero while the lower TPs were still in the 60's and 70's.
     
  18. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Sorry but it's the other way. Because of the higher frequencies to more loss due to water [rain, hail, snow, etc.].
    My dish is aligned quite well, but I do get fade [signal loss] when it rains hard between my dish and the SAT.
    Ka hi/lo are the first to go. So far "fade" hasn't lasted more than a few min.

    MPEG-4 may also have some effect as it uses more compression and so a missed "bit" might have a more noticeable effect.
     
  19. techrep

    techrep Hall Of Fame

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    No, I am sorry. I thought it would be like GSM cell phone transmissions where they seem to use 1900 in metro areas (I thought for penetration) and 850 for distance in rural areas. I know it also depends on transmisson power and I will remember this in the future.
    Thanks
     
  20. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Don't be sorry, you didn't need to sit through all of the classes/labs I had to. :lol:

    The simple truth is the higher the frequency, the smaller the wavelength, the bigger the water molecule "looks" to it, & thus blocks it more.
     
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