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Papa Johns and Tipping

Discussion in 'The OT' started by Stewart Vernon, Nov 27, 2012.

  1. Dec 9, 2012 #121 of 153
    kick4fun

    kick4fun Godfather

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    see ... :grin:
     
  2. Dec 9, 2012 #122 of 153
    SamC

    SamC Hall Of Fame

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    Umm, then you did not get paid? If you were paid, you were paid out of the net income of the company.

    It is shocking how many people think they are doing their boss a favor by working there. Don't like the set up? Quit.
     
  3. Dec 9, 2012 #123 of 153
    kick4fun

    kick4fun Godfather

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    I find this a bit insulting.
    I just answered a question about the delivery charge and now I'm "entitled"?? Wow.. When I signed up to work I was paid a certain wage.. Over time, that wage changed and was lowered. So I did just what you suggested.. I quit and thankfully it was just a part time gig to pay off debt.. Happy now..
     
  4. Dec 9, 2012 #124 of 153
    armophob

    armophob Difficulty Concen........

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    Ok, I wish my hair will never fall out.

    Man, I am just saying. I worked in the food services industry all through my teenage years back in the 80's. The things I saw back then in restaurants...
    That was when we kind of grew up with something close to respect for our parents and authority.

    What goes on these days makes me shutter to order a burger.

    But I still do.
     
  5. boukengreen

    boukengreen Legend

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    man when ever i order a pizza and can actallly get it delivered which is usally when i'm in the hospital cause i live in the country it is normally around 12-15 i just give the driver a 20 and tell him to keep the change
     
  6. djlong

    djlong Hall Of Fame

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    This is a common debating 'tactic' that my ex-wife used all the time.

    You are proceeding from a false premise. It's not one or the other. There is a middle ground. You can make plenty of money and still treat your employees. (And, the better you treat them, the more loyal they are)

    The problem I have with "Papa John" is, again, he can give away $20M worth of pizza and claim it's an advertising expense "investment". But he can't spend $5M-$8M to cover his employee's health care.

    That says "I will spend money to make money for ME. I will NOT spend money to save money for the people who work for me - they are commodities and can be replaced like anything else".
     
  7. SamC

    SamC Hall Of Fame

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    Maybe not. There is no real evidence that customers (you see, customers pay the cost of companies' decisons, there is no secret stash of money that Papa John, or any other company, has) are willing to pay the prices that would be associated with that. Maybe people will just have to buy less pizza, and these people will be out of work. Don't know. A massive expirament to be conducted with the lives of the most marginal employees during a recession/depression.

    In any event, this all goes down to so-called business ethics. The so-called "fair trade" stuff from foreign countries. Union vs. union free products. American owned companies vs. "foreign" companies. Products from communist/Islamic/whatever countries. Nutty conspiracy theories. Serious documented facts. Companies that take this or that stand on this or that issue. Etc.

    You can surf the internet and find 10000 boycotts of every company around. Left, right, religious, anti-religious, libertarian, authortian. Everything.

    And?

    And, none are ever successful. Most people don't care one way or another. Most people base their purchases on simply getting a fair product for a fair price.
     
  8. dpeters11

    dpeters11 Hall Of Fame

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    Boycotts can be successful, but the larger the company, the harder it is. For it to work, you have to get the vast majority of customers to join, and for a very extended period of time. Boycotts like the "don't buy gas on Tuesday" types are the most stupidly flawed.

    It can be said that if you don't like the setup, you can quit, but there are limits. I'm sure Henry Clay Frick would have said the same thing. Not that I'm comparing Papa John to Frick.
     
  9. fluffybear

    fluffybear Hall Of Fame DBSTalk Club

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    speaking as another 40-something, I won't doubt things happened back then & happen today.
    The customer has changed as well. In the 80's, my parents would say that we just had to grin and bear it (except in the case if the meat was blood rare) as it was considered disrespectful to return an item to the kitchen. Today, customers are more willing to make their opinion known. Not only in the establishment but social media as well.
     
  10. Laxguy

    Laxguy Honi Soit Qui Mal Y Pense.

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    FB raises an interesting question for me, at least: Is more food being sent back to kitchens because people are pickier than before, or because more of it is prepared badly?

    Inquiring minds want to know.....;)
     
  11. fluffybear

    fluffybear Hall Of Fame DBSTalk Club

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    IMHO neither. I think it has more to do with the fact that people in general have become stronger and are not afraid to speak up. As a matter of fact, establishments even encourage it by offering you incentives in order for you to complete surveys and voice that opinion.
     
  12. Rich

    Rich DBSTalk Club DBSTalk Club

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    I think that goes on in just about every company where tips make up the bulk of the employees' wages. Have you never worked for tips? Have you always had enough money?

    Rich
     
  13. Rich

    Rich DBSTalk Club DBSTalk Club

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    I grew up watching my father send food back that didn't meet the order he had placed and I continued doing that if I had a problem. Usually get comped for the meal (the part that wasn't to my liking). I've never had a problem with that.

    Rich
     
  14. fluffybear

    fluffybear Hall Of Fame DBSTalk Club

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    In reference to both questions, NO! I have worked my share of crappy jobs (none for tips) when I was younger and there were a lot of times when money was very tight.
     
  15. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Here is the problem: He can give "$20 million" worth of free pizzas (which actually cost less than $20 million to make). When he is done with that marketing scheme he can look at sales and say "that was good ... the company made more money with the giveaway than we did without". It is quantifiable.

    How much does spending $5-$8 million on health care increase sales? It might improve productivity and retention but does it increase sales? Where is the profit?
     
  16. Richierich

    Richierich Hall Of Fame

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    My wife is a Chief Financial Officer and a lot of times you can sense that the CEO doesn't sense or appreciate what the Accounting Department does for the company (such as keeping them solvent and out of jail for fraudalent practices) and yes it does not add to Sales or Profit but it is a Very Necessary Part of the Corporate World until we get the Polilticians to get rid of Corporate Taxes!!! :D
     
  17. hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    Translation = Big Tipper :D
     
  18. spartanstew

    spartanstew Dry as a bone

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    While increased productivity and retention don't necessarily equate to an increase in sales, they have a direct correlation on profit.
     
  19. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    It seems to be a high turnover job ... people coming and going who (just like Papa is accused of) just want a quick buck.

    Think about it ... how many people have you heard about who started delivering pizza in high school who turned it into a long carrier? At best it is a stepping stone to get out of that job. If someone said they spent 50 years of their lives delivering pizza what would your first impression of them be?

    Some jobs are just not designed for long term use.
     
  20. Stewart Vernon

    Stewart Vernon Roving Reporter Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Playing devil's advocate... how do you "know" the increase in advertising spending directly accounts for the increase in sales?

    You could make a case that spending money on employee benefits made happier employees who served the customers better and created incentive for return visits raised sales too.

    I mean, if we're going to make connections between A and B to yield C...

    The automatic tying of an advertising campaign to increased sales is a lot like the bear patrol.

    I am the president, founder, and chief patrol officer of my local neighborhood bear patrol. During my lifetime there have been ZERO bear attacks where I live. I conclude the project is working and is worth funding! I mean... you could risk cutting my budget and letting bears run rampant... but I have "proven" the bear patrol is 100% effective, so why take that risk?

    When you have a new company OR a new product, it's easier to tie advertising to customers... but once established, if you are a good company with a good product, the product and your customer service should sell the stuff to consumers without further advertising and then word-of-mouth increases your base as your happy customers drive more business to you.

    IF you send coupons with the paper... you know people used those coupons, so you know that was a good place to send coupons... BUT you don't actually know for sure how many of those people would actually have come in and paid full price anyway.

    Consider... most mass-mailing campaigns that flood snail or emails with advertising consider a few percent response to be good response... i.e. they consider most people trash the mass-mailings.

    So I've always wondered why so many assume they need to have expensive advertising campaigns.

    I've long argued... Coke and Pepsi, unless they introduce a new flavor, don't need to advertise... People buy groceries and will see Coke and Pepsi in the store on a weekly basis... I think they could chop most of their advertising budget year-to-year and see resulting increase in profit because customers know their product exists and will seek it out.
     

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