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Tape: Bush, Chertoff Warned Before Katrina

Discussion in 'The OT' started by tomcrown1, Mar 1, 2006.

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  1. Mar 1, 2006 #1 of 39
    tomcrown1

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    http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/03/01/national/w135354S56.DTL
    In dramatic and sometimes agonizing terms, federal disaster officials warned President Bush and his
    homeland security chief before Hurricane Katrina struck that the storm could breach levees, put lives at risk in New Orleans' Superdome and overwhelm rescuers, according to confidential video footage.


    Bush didn't ask a single question during the final briefing before Katrina struck on Aug. 29, but he assured soon-to-be-battered state officials: "We are fully prepared


    Boy I am glad Bush is our President another attack from mother nature or terrorist and we will all be safe( do not look at all the bodies)
     
  2. Mar 1, 2006 #2 of 39
    juan ellitinez

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    ummmmm im confused was Bush supposed to flip out or something?
     
  3. Mar 1, 2006 #3 of 39
    Bogy

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    It is possible that tomcrown is commenting on the Bush excuse soon after the hurricane hit that no one let him know it was going to be bad. Or that his comment, "We are fully prepared," might have been slightly optimistic.
     
  4. Mar 1, 2006 #4 of 39
    tomcrown1

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  5. Mar 1, 2006 #5 of 39
    jonstad

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    Problem is, this is no great surprise. It's what we've come to expect.

    Clueless and out of the loop as usual, we simply write it off as "his management style!"

    Is it time to add another to the list?

    Trust me! Brownie, you're doing a heckuva job!
     
  6. Mar 2, 2006 #6 of 39
    Eagles

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    No, the problem is you take at face value anything said or printed if it sheds a bad light on Bush. You seem to have no problem with the intellectually challenged tomcrown1's take on things so long as it's anti Bush. You seem to have no problem with the anti Bush AP. First of all AP makes it appear in the story that they somehow secured this tape under cover of darkness and against the administrations wishes.The Associated Press obtained the confidential government video and made it public Wednesday, offering Americans their own inside glimpse into the government's fateful final Katrina preparations after months of finger pointing and political recriminations.
    Did you know that they had access to this video since days after the storm? The administration gave this to all of the networks. If you remember at the time immediately following the hurricane, when the levees gave way and compounded the disaster exponentially, the blame game started in full. The blame Bush talking points at the time were that Bush was not even concerned about the hurricane to the point that all of the communication and concern shown on the video never took place. Bush never requested or was never briefed by federal and local officials. Bush was at his Texas ranch on vacation, oblivious to the impending doom to come. Basically he didn't care. Bla Bla Bla. As usual, anything that does not fit into the get bush template, the mainstream press ignores. If this was shown and reported at the time immediately following the disaster, it would have basically blown that talking point out of the water.
    Now they release it and try to morph it into "Bush was warned about levee "BREACH". I saw the video. The expert they referenced who warned bush said nothing about "BREACHED" levees. He painted as a possible scenario, if all conditions were just right, wind speed and direction that the water from lake Ponchartrain could possibly "TOP" the levees. He went on to say he has no way of knowing for sure, but it should be considered and be of concern.
    I'm sure jonstad you know there would be a huge difference in the damage cause by a breached levee versus a topped levee.
    If you really want to place blame for the breached levees, which was the major cause of damage in New Orleans there are a couple of people and a God (oops, I forgot) who would line up way ahead of G.W. Bush. How about the local politicians who used the levees in dire need of upgrades as a political football for years?
     
  7. Mar 2, 2006 #7 of 39
    billpa

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    Then why are we just seeing this now?
    If all the major networks, save Fox, in this country are so anti-Bush, why have they been sitting on this video?
    And why are they giving AP credit for the video when its shown on the networks?
    Why don't they just go get the tape the White House passed out months ago?
    After these dire warnings that Brownie is seen giving to Bush in his "Western White House" in Crawford, why did he remain on vacation?
    Why didn't he head back to the White House (the proper one in Washington) and LEAD?
     
  8. Mar 2, 2006 #8 of 39
    JM Anthony

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    I suspect one of the reasons Dubya's approval ratings are tanking is that no one trusts him any longer regardless of what the issue is. When his hacks on the hill link arms to support him it only makes matters worse. I suspect we'll see the consequences this fall and then again in the next Presidential election.

    John
     
  9. Mar 2, 2006 #9 of 39
    Tom in TX

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    Maybe that's why "The Government" told everyone, days ahead of the "hit", to "EVACUATE".
    I guess that President Bush, and other Government officials should have gone to New Orleans, and told people, "We're really not kidding, you might not believe us when we say to evacuate, but we really, really mean it". "Please take our advice, and leave the area". "There is a major hurricane coming, and it could be bad, please evacuate".
    Tom in TX
     
  10. jonstad

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    The media did not manufacture Katrina, nor the response to it, nor these videos, nor Bush's statement later no one had anticipated the levee breaches, nor that he hadn't been warned of the possible severity of the storm. BTW, I understand Bush is no rocket scientist, but it doesn't take one to understand that a "topped" levee is in real danger of being "breached". In fact I suspect any levee, especially an earthen one, "topped" for any sustained period WILL inevitably be "breached". If Bush coudn't envision this possibility himself, surely SOMEONE in the White House, Homeland Security, FEMA, or at least NOAA failed miserably by not cluing him in.

    Ironically in all this, it's beginning to appear that "Brownie" was about the only one who was at least trying to do "a heckuva job!" His fatal flaw was believing anyone else, from the President on down was doing any "job" at all!

    As far as the media having had access to these tapes all along, I've heard that too. Although it seems odd that all the outlets are replaying the grainy AP videos with patchy and scratchy audio. However, if they DID have this smoking gun all along, doesn't it kind of blow holes in your theory the media is "anti-Bush"? Certainly these would have had more impact directly after Bush made his "nobody anticipated" remark rather then six months later. At this point it doesn't make much difference. I can't imagine Bush's approval ratings being much lower. Although he still has a couple years to go and I wouldn't want to misunderestimate him.:p

    Even if your anti-Bush theory does hold some water(no pun intended:D), it would seem they are rather careless and lackadaisical in their mission. To let this slide for six months means they're at best phoning it in. Not "a heckuva job" by any measure!

    And FYI, the media didn't manufacture the Iraq invasion, although they sure did their best to promote and sell it to the American public. Nor did they invent Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, Terri Schiavo, Social Security "reform", Harriet Meirs of Dick Cheney shooting his hunting partner in the face! In fact, in all of the above the media has bent over backwards to insure the administration's excuses and explanations are fully heard by all, no matter how contrived or ludicrious they may be.

    Bush has dug the hole he is in all by himself. The fact the media hasn't thrown him a rope doesn't mean he should keep on digging!
     
  11. Danny R

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    Maybe that's why "The Government" told everyone, days ahead of the "hit", to "EVACUATE".

    "Days" is a bit inaccurate. Lest we forget, this storm did turn into a monster in a hurry. If someone didn't pay attention to the news for a day they could easily have missed the evacuation orders.

    First evacuation order came saturday morning, less than 2 days before landfall, and it was voluntary. Voluntary orders certainly don't give the impression of "yes, we really mean it! Get out!"

    The mandatory order was only 20 hours prior to landfall, and by that time much of the public transportation had already stopped.

    Now some local parish leaders did order mandatory evacuations for their districts as early as friday, but those were just local warnings.
     
  12. Mark Holtz

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    From Nola.com:

    FULL ARTICLE HERE

    From the series of articles published June, 2002.
     
  13. AcuraCL

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    Yes, they should have all instantly loaded up their Porsches and Escalades and motored off to the Hamptons ...
     
  14. JM Anthony

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    One of the things I find interesting about all of this is how quickly "Brownie" is being redeemed. Not that long ago, both the R's and D's and just about everyone else were crucifying this guy. Now companies are lining up for his consulting services and he at least appears to have had a clue as to what was going on while the Pres & Co. were out dozing on the ranch.

    Interesting times!!

    John
     
  15. sikma

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    My problem has always been, too much blame (nationally) was put on the Feds. for the evacuation. The city of NO and state of LA should have been more responsible to their citizens. If they had acted sooner, they would have been much more organized with regards to evacuation, transportation and housing. I do not like playing 'arm chair quarterback' trying to place blame on the largest government agency available. It seems to me the governor, mayor and each parish head should take the brunt. If I had been a resident of NO, I would have taken evacuation warnings more seriously if it had come from my local authorities than some federal bureaucrat. I would have also expected the same local government leaders to have a comprehensive plan that was feasible.

    I remember watching 24-hour non-stop coverage during and after the storm on NO tv stations (FTA) and several local leaders admitted they acted too slow in organizing the evacuation. Leaders from surrounding states also said they were willing to do whatever they could, i.e. turning their state highways into one-way traffic to assist in getting the residents away from the coast. Eventually this was done, but many hours later than even they expected.

    Let the blame game end and the rebuilding begin. I think the only good thing that can come out of this tragedy, is for other areas of this country to be better prepared for any disaster, whether it's via mother-nature or man-made.
     
  16. wisdom

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    No, but it would have been great if the mayor and governer had released the 1000 school buses to evacuate people.
     
  17. jonstad

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    I don't think anyone is blaming the feds for the evacuation or lack thereof. They are being blamed for not responding AFTER the storm hit and the situation became apparent. In fact, something like 80%+ of NO's population DID evacuate, even on short notice. It is largely understood that no large city can be completely evacuated. Under the circumstances it seems nearly everyone who wanted to leave and had the means, did leave. Having school buses and drivers at the ready would have certainly helped, but IMHO wouldn't have made all that much difference. In addition, it's a tough call to order an evacuation even 48 hours out with these storms. Had Katrina changed course, which hurricanes are wont to do without warning, state and local authorities would have been vilified for making the call too soon. It's not as clear-cut and obvious a decision as it now seems in hindsight.

    In the recently released video, Bush assures the local authorities not only will the feds be there to prepare for the storm, but promises quick action after. And this is where the criticism kicks in. State and local officials may serve an entire career of 20, 30 or even 40 years or more and never have to deal with a storm like this. This is precisely why we have FEMA. The logic is that in these situations, local government is normally inexperienced and quickly becomes overwhelmed. FEMA's job should be to advise local governments, even to the point of telling them what they need and when they will need it, AND to insure what is needed is available on a timely basis.
     
  18. juan ellitinez

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  19. jonstad

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    It's all semantics.

    "What is the meaning if "is"?

    Your implication is the disastrously slow federal response is fully justified, excusable and forgivable because Bush was specifically warned the levees could be "topped", and not that this could lead to being "breached"?

    Once again we are forced to witness the same spectacular failure of imagination that has been the hallmark of this administration.

    "No one could imagine terrorists would fly planes into buildings!" Even though we had uncovered plots to do the same and only weeks before were warned "al Qaeda determined to attack in the US!"

    "No one could imagine mercenary Afgan warlords wouldn't be up to the job of capturing bin Laden!"

    "No one could imagine Saddam might not have WMDs!"

    Or that the war wouldn't pay for itself!

    Or that we wouldn't be welcomed as liberators!

    Need I go on? Torture, kidnapping, Guantanamo, black sites, warrantless wire taps?

    The list is endless!
     
  20. Bogy

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    To where? Before the storm, those who had somewhere to go and/or the means to take care of themselves while they were evacuated, left. Where would those school buses full of evacuees gone? Who would have taken in thousands of homeless people BEFORE a flood inundated their city. AFTER that happened, compassion ruled and cities offered to take them in. That would not have been the case BEFORE the flood.
     
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