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VOOM sues Dish.


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177 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   BobaBird

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 05:46 PM

The oddest part of this, is the paragraph quoted previously is from Cablevision's 3rd quarter report - and it gives $100k and $500k number. Now in the annual report it is $100 million and $500 million.

The larger number strikes me as much more believable. I don't expect the lower number would pay for very many new productions at all.
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#52 OFFLINE   HobbyTalk

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 06:14 PM

$100k would barely pay for a single episode of a program like Dirty Jobs.

#53 OFFLINE   racton1

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 10:31 PM

There are apparently 7 uplinked HD channels right now that are not available to us... Voom is not preventing those from being turned on... so it is a reasonable leap to say that even if Voom was not on Dish at all 6 months ago, we would still not have SciFi, USA, etc. at this point.

We don't know what is preventing some of the new HD channels launching on Dish... but right at this moment it isn't lack of bandwidth because of having Voom that is preventing.


Perhaps E has not come to terms with the networks you have mentioned. I have contacted out local CW station and they say we are in discussions with E to carry the station in HD.

#54 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 06:38 PM

One thing. Maybe rather than engaging in shinanigans leading to a lawsuit, Dish should try this approach to getting HD content - pay for it.

Surely Voom's Rave would have carried this if Dish paid for it:

DirecTV to Air South by Southwest Concerts in HD
U.S. satellite-TV leader DirecTV will broadcast 24 shows in high definition from the South by Southwest festival in Austin, Texas, between March 13 and March 15, the company says. X, Daryl Hall and the Lemonheads are among performers appearing at the Austin Convention Center that will be broadcast on DirecTV’s The 101 channel.


And then there's this Friday Night Lights renewal DirectTV marketing coup using content that could have appeared on WorldSport if Dish had paid for it (emphasis added):

The answer came in a deal with DirecTV, now owned by John Malone's Liberty Media. Clearly Malone is looking to distinguish DirecTV from its rivals on a content as well as price basis. "It's an innovative deal where NBC found a partner who will share costs and exhibition windows," an insider explained to me. So both NBC and DirecTV will be airing Friday Night Lights across multipurpose platforms.


Dish may have its hands, as well as transponders, full competing with a content oriented DirectTV. Neither of these items can compete with a Charlie Chat, of course, but....;)

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#55 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 07:15 PM

One thing. Maybe rather than engaging in shinanigans leading to a lawsuit, Dish should try this approach to getting HD content - pay for it.

Surely Voom's Rave would have carried this if Dish paid for it:


Dish DID pay for it, not that specific programming, but much other programming. They invested in Voom to the extent of a 20% ownership. VOOM is responsible for securing programming for the service, not Dish. That was part of the agreement when Dish bought in. It would be rather hard for Dish to start a service that would compete with Voom at this point, and I am sure there is a clause in their contract saying that they won't so long as the ownership agreement is in place. I wouldn't be surprised if this flap between them is Dish's attempt to free themselves from Voom and the various restrictions in their contract. IF Dish gets out of Voom Voom will quickly disappear. I would miss Rave, but, hopefully something will come along to replace it in the near future.
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#56 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 07 March 2008 - 12:49 AM

In 2005, subsidiaries of the Company entered into agreements with EchoStar by which EchoStar acquired a 20% interest in VOOM HD and agreed to distribute VOOM on its DISH Network for a 15-year term.

How much money did Echostar pay into Voom for that 20%?

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#57 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 07 March 2008 - 02:35 AM

It is undisclosed.

#58 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 07 March 2008 - 11:27 AM

It is undisclosed.

So we don't know if they paid anything or just agreed to carry the channels?:grin:

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#59 OFFLINE   jal

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 07:37 PM

You will like Directv. I was with dish for about 9 years, then made the switch. One of the reasons was the jacked up hd fees, among other things.

#60 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 09 March 2008 - 08:09 AM

So we don't know if they paid anything or just agreed to carry the channels?:grin:

If they didn't pay anything and simply agreed to carry the channels in exchange for 20% of the company Voom wouldn't still be here.
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#61 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 09 March 2008 - 12:53 PM

From the tea leaves we have:

DISH agreed to carry the Voom HD channels for 15 years with the understanding that ...
1) Cablevision/Voom would spend $100 million per year on programming.
2) DISH would own 20% of Voom until Voom spent $500 million on programming.

If Cablevision/Voom fails to spend $100 million per year DISH can walk away any time ... the failure of Voom to spend the money on programming releases DISH from the contract.

If Cablevision/Voom spends $500 million total DISH is locked in for the full 15 years and they are "bought out" of their 20% ownership. (DISH will no longer own a portion of the Voom channels.)

If Cablevision/Voom reduces the number of channels offered they can reduce the money they spend per year ... the $500 million is not reduced. If Cablevision/Voom reduces the number of channels to zero (no longer offering the service) the contract ends.

That's the tea leaves. I expect that DISH is paying Cablevision/Voom per subscriber for use of the Voom HD channels ... we have no 'tea leaves' pointing to a cash down payment by DISH. DISH bought a satellite and licenses from Cablevision, and the consumation of that deal was required for the Voom programming contract to take effect, but the contract for the Voom HD channels is separate from the satellite purchase.

#62 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 12:11 PM

FYI: The temporary restraining order request remains open in this case.

Trial is April 1st at 9:30am

#63 OFFLINE   cforrest

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 01:51 PM

FYI: The temporary restraining order request remains open in this case.

Trial is April 1st at 9:30am



It's a PC for 4/1, not a trial yet! I am sure after the PC the judge will either set a trial date or another conference hearing.

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#64 OFFLINE   Spaz007

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 02:41 PM

Here is a easy fix to the problem drop VOOM and add GOOD channels. I would pay extra fees for a few months if needed to get rid of it.

#65 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 03:04 PM

Here is a easy fix to the problem drop VOOM and add GOOD channels. I would pay extra fees for a few months if needed to get rid of it.

Just as I would pay to keep VOOM on and keep channels I have no interest in (oh, maybe SciFi and USA) off. Comments like this do no good on either side of the conflict. Please refrain from such comments.
The Pump Don't Work 'cause the Vandals Took the Handles.

#66 OFFLINE   FTA Michael

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 04:11 PM

FTA Michael's Second Law of Programming: Any channel you don't watch is a worthless waste of bandwidth, but any channel you watch is essential. Except that it also applies to that guy next to you. ;)
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#67 OFFLINE   Yes616

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 04:13 PM

Voom really does need to spend more money on new programming. The repeats are now beyond serious! All I see are just a couple of new movies on MonstersHD every few months and this 2 or 3 movies per day over and over all day is terrible. I used to love that channel but now it just makes me mad.

I have a great idea for RaveHD. They need to get involved with a venue not far from me and I will bet many would like this if it ever happened. Bethel Woods Center for the Arts
Look at what they have so far this year. Look at last year. And yes, it is really at the site of the original Woodstock Music & Arts Festival in 1969.

These concerts televised in HD would be a real treat for everyone.

Just an idea or two since the Voom programming & marketing depts. seems to be out to lunch. I hope someone there is looking.

#68 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:35 PM

Mr. Yes, I agree with you. I love Rave, and have been one of their biggest supporters here, BUT I, also, am getting very tired of having minimal new programming there. As for the Bethel Woods situation, there are festivals like this all over the country during the summer. They could do a GREAT programming series doing a tour of the various festivals. An old friend/co-worker put this little gathering together in 1983: http://www.wefest.com/2008/index.html and it is still going strong. I'm not a country fan, but this festival along with some programming from your place could make for some interesting additions to the programming.

The problem is that I don't believe that Rave has ever produced any original programming. They buy programming from around the world, a large portion coming from England and some more from Canada, along with the programming from here. Now that MTV has their HD channel I can't help but wonder how much Rave programming is going to migrate to there and disappear from Rave. Obviously MHD has wider distribution. Rave needs to do something.
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#69 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 11:11 AM

Mr. Yes, I agree with you. I love Rave, and have been one of their biggest supporters here, BUT I, also, am getting very tired of having minimal new programming there. As for the Bethel Woods situation, there are festivals like this all over the country during the summer. They could do a GREAT programming series doing a tour of the various festivals. An old friend/co-worker put this little gathering together in 1983: http://www.wefest.com/2008/index.html and it is still going strong. I'm not a country fan, but this festival along with some programming from your place could make for some interesting additions to the programming.

The problem is that I don't believe that Rave has ever produced any original programming. They buy programming from around the world, a large portion coming from England and some more from Canada, along with the programming from here. Now that MTV has their HD channel I can't help but wonder how much Rave programming is going to migrate to there and disappear from Rave. Obviously MHD has wider distribution. Rave needs to do something.



All VOOM does is buy programming. Therefore they don't seem to have the cash to spend, or want to....

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#70 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 24 March 2008 - 06:16 PM

Well, it appears that Voom is starting to produce some original programming. I noticed on the show "From the Basement" that it is available "Only on Voom HD". Additionally, they have a feature length film coming next month called: "Meatloaf: In Search of Paradise" that is a Voom HD original production. This flick will be shown in theaters on March 31 and then start on Voom on April 4. There may be some hope. I am sure the Meatloaf thing has been in production for quite some time along with From the Basement since these kinds of things can't be done overnight. Which raises the question as to whether Dish jumped the gun a bit or has other motives. I am sure that "From the Basement" production costs are very minimal, but I suspect the Meatloaf flick cost a bit to produce.
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#71 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 24 March 2008 - 06:20 PM

http://www.fromtheba...01&page=welcome
Oh well.... .it appears that "From the Basement" is another import from England.
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#72 OFFLINE   jgoggan

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Posted 25 March 2008 - 09:22 AM

I admit that I abused VOOM as much as I could originally. Back when it was it's own entity offering their own service, I signed up purposely just before it all fell apart. I did it to get a decent OTA tuner for cheap. :) I actually signed up for VOOM, got my install, and it was less than 2 weeks later that they announced that they were closing up shop. I got a letter apologizing for the situation and telling me to just keep my VOOM box to get rid of it as I pleased.

Which was exactly what I was hoping for -- it actually happened a bit faster than I expected. In the end, I paid for less than a month of service. :)

All that being said, I haven't done VOOM on Dish yet. But it will still be interesting to see how this lawsuit goes.

- John...

#73 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 25 March 2008 - 10:09 AM

Trial is April 1st (no fooling). I hope DISH wins.

If DISH loses they basically lose their $10 Essentials package.

#74 OFFLINE   cforrest

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 11:45 PM

Looks like the PC was adjourned to May 13th! Still no trial yet. Wonder if E and Rainbow are working on a settlement, while the litigation is ongoing, since the PC was adjourned.

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#75 OFFLINE   fredpb

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Posted 17 April 2008 - 11:36 PM

Well now that we are in the rant mode, drop 'em all and make room for the nationals...Comcast is kicking *** this year, D* has made their statement by action, Dish needs to set it....and forget it!


I like the voom channels. I rarely watch the network channels.

MORE VOOM... NO NBC ABC OR CBS :)
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