Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

Does E* have a working receiver???


  • Please log in to reply
51 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   TulsaOK

TulsaOK

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 3,469 posts
Joined: Feb 23, 2004

Posted 01 May 2008 - 09:51 PM

If it had gone bad, it would stay bad. However when something works fine then doesn't and then does again, its not me, its something in the machine.


Or it could be moisture in your grounding block causing a short circuit or anywhere else. Moisture does dry out from time to time. That would cause intermittent problems. Just exploring the possibilities.
<span style='font-size: 10px;'>“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.”<br /> - John Wayne</span><br /><br />Avatar: Tanner 1992 - 2009

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#42 OFFLINE   tm22721

tm22721

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 248 posts
Joined: Nov 08, 2002

Posted 03 May 2008 - 01:51 PM

Do yourself a favor and purchase a good ups system ( battery backup ). Do not plug it into plug strip. Make sure you plug it directly into the wall outlet. Also check posts for solvng heat problems.

I would go beyond that. As a test, get off the grid for a few weeks until you prove it's power related or not.

Get yourself a large lead acid battery like a Sears Die Hard and a 12 Volt inverter.

Every night, completely disconnect and recharge the battery.

If your receivers still misbehave then your problem is not power related.

#43 OFFLINE   BNUMM

BNUMM

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,079 posts
Joined: Dec 23, 2006

Posted 03 May 2008 - 08:26 PM

They are not on the grid. They said they have regulators and have checked the power.

#44 OFFLINE   HobbyTalk

HobbyTalk

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,659 posts
Joined: Jul 14, 2007

Posted 03 May 2008 - 09:31 PM

We know how much power each appliance draws, in what useage mode. We know the wave form of each of our inverters, and which appliance likes which waveform.


It could be that the 622/722 does not "like" the waveform you are feeding it. Have you tried to put it on other inverters?

#45 OFFLINE   scoobyxj

scoobyxj

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 253 posts
Joined: Apr 15, 2008

Posted 04 May 2008 - 08:48 PM

Something to remember is the 622 & 722 are Dish Pro+ receivers. If your old receiver was a only a Dish Pro it could live quite happily on substandard cable. DPP equipment needs Rg-6 rated to 3GHz (most is not rated to 3GHz). It is quite possible that is your problem. Also don't forget any barrel connectors, and ground blocks need to be 3GHz rated. My father was once having a problem with a 301 that kept going stupid. *E kept sending him replacements.I think it was after the third, or fourth one they finely sent a tech to check over the system. It turned out to be a faulty DP34 switch when it seemed it was receiver problem.

#46 OFFLINE   whatchel1

whatchel1

    Hall Of Fame

  • No PM's
  • 1,086 posts
Joined: Jan 10, 2006

Posted 05 May 2008 - 02:33 AM

We have 722 on the way-we were going to go with 211, but with DVR Advantage, there is no DVR charge, so fees would be the same. And, tech sort of hemmed and hawed when we asked how problem free the 211 is.

Lots said about power. I guess the feeling is that with solar power, 'anything' can happen. This is really the most reliable power setup I have ever experienced. Literally, everytime we 'power up', we are checking power available. We know how much power each appliance draws, in what useage mode. We know the wave form of each of our inverters, and which appliance likes which waveform. You do not take your power lightly while living comfortably using solar power. Retiring from engineering, we know how to setup the power, how to test it, etc. We have the equipment to test power: meters, scopes, spectrum analyzer, etc. We don't have 'brown outs' because we are in control of our own system and don't abuse it (and, yes, test it constantly). We don't have surges or spikes for the same reason. Our power for the whole house is from regulated sources. We do not have any problems with other appliances or electronics. We had Dish since 1998 with no problems. We had our first 622 for 6 months before the first problems. We are totally frustrated with this issue and have racked our brains and lost sleep trying to figure what the problem is and if it is caused by us. We have gotten up at 3am (when we hear the receiver rebooting in the middle of the night) trying to figure it out. I would be like others and question our setup, but it is really a simple setup in a quite regulated environment. It is a setup that has worked for years. We actually know what we are doing, and we don't have to contend with many of the electrical 'irregularities' that you often have to living in today's complex world. We have a daily renewable electrical supply with a 24/7 battery backup. And, when those batteries are low (12.26v under load-you thought I didn't know), everything gets turned off 'til the sun comes up. And, yes, we are grounded. And, we don't schedule much to record. Why would we? We keep loosing our recordings.

Sorry, I get wordy when I don't have TV.


Others have mentioned dirty power. I guess they mean DC slipping thru into the AC. But I'm going to suggest something completely different. Have you checked to see that the inverter is keeping the frequency at 6o HZ? If it is varying to below 6o it could be the culprit. Is it possible that it is closer to 50 Hz like Europe uses than to 60 which we use. Maybe the inverter is shifting the freq with the load. So see what is going on with the freq and let us know.

#47 OFFLINE   phrelin

phrelin

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 13,375 posts
  • LocationNorthern California Redwoods
Joined: Jan 18, 2007

Posted 05 May 2008 - 12:25 PM

Here's the kind of thing that can happen.

Our ISP is Comcast. Three weeks before Christmas we started losing our connection just after dusk. After Comcast replacing my modem, me disconnecting all my Christmas decorations, and following similar complaints from neighbors, despite the fact that it wasn't affecting TV a Comcast crew started testing their system segment by segment. We are in a rural area with lots of lines heading off in different directions so this is time consuming and they had to pull off because of storm damage in nearby communities.

The second weekend after Christmas the problem stopped. They don't know why. The best guess is someone had some electronic decorations on a timer that sent some unknown intermittent pulse signal through their house into the Comcast system that disconnected everyone behind some piece of Comcast equipment. It's likely that the problem will start up again next Christmas season.

Who knows what actually is affecting some particular location. In another rural home that was self-contained for power, I had to filter all equipment to try to prevent "interference" going back into the system. Here, where I have that "reliable and regulated" power grid, PG&E voltage varies significantly at times and it is obvious they adjust it during those California summers of rolling blackouts and not so rolling brownouts. (Yes, I monitor it.) Everything electronic we own is behind relatively expensive UPS's but that doesn't prevent my occasional panic during some wild power fluctuations in storms. Luckily my 8-month-old 722 hasn't done anything odd that I couldn't explain to myself. But I really believe it is luck....

"In a hundred years there'll be a whole new set of people."
"Always poke the bears. They sleep too much for their own good."

"If you're good enough, they'll talk about you." - Tom Harmon
A GEEZER who remembers watching TV in 1951 and was an Echostar customer from 1988 to 2008, now a Dish Network customer.
My AV Setup
My Slingbox Pro HD Experience
My Blog: The Redwood Guardian


#48 OFFLINE   bonipie

bonipie

    Mentor

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 44 posts
Joined: Feb 09, 2006

Posted 09 May 2008 - 07:44 PM

New (to us) 722 up and running since Monday.

We do have several inverters. Two primary, one a true sine wave. We have no difference between the sine wave and modified sinewave as far as receivers are concerned. When the receiver is working, it works on the sine wave or modified sine wave. When the receiver is not working, it will not work on either inverter or generator power or shore power. We have some items that will not work as well as we like on the modified sine wave-hp all in one printer, computerized sewing machine, ac electric razor, some of our fans. Those items are on the sine wave inverter, and often the receiver is also on the sine wave inverter when we are troubleshooting. Usually, when the tv and receiver are on, there isn't much chance of 'electrical interaction' between other items on same circuit. We have everything in mh unplugged (not just turned off) that we are not using. So, usually tv and receiver and our computer (not printer and other periferials unless we need them at the time) are the only things on the circuit. Dish techs never question power related issues, installation is a simple 1 tv/receiver setup, provided cable was used for installation, tech says heat is not really an issue (and we do what we can to keep heat down), no switch is used. Guess we are just lucky.
:D Boni

VIP722
Dish 1000

#49 OFFLINE   ebaltz

ebaltz

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,432 posts
Joined: Nov 23, 2004

Posted 10 May 2008 - 01:02 AM

Or it could be moisture in your grounding block causing a short circuit or anywhere else. Moisture does dry out from time to time. That would cause intermittent problems. Just exploring the possibilities.


well I live in PHoenix, so moisture isn't a problem. Hasn't rained here in 4 months. :-)

From all I have read, Dish acknowledges there is a problem with the software and the machines, but they don't know what it is/can't figure out the connection to the issue.
Dish HD w/ 1 Hopper and 3 Joey, PS3, Sony HN1000 Receiver and Sony Bravia HX800 3D TV

#50 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

Cap'n Preshoot

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 452 posts
Joined: Jul 16, 2006

Posted 16 May 2008 - 04:18 AM

Something to remember is the 622 & 722 are Dish Pro+ receivers. If your old receiver was a only a Dish Pro it could live quite happily on substandard cable. DPP equipment needs Rg-6 rated to 3GHz (most is not rated to 3GHz). It is quite possible that is your problem. Also don't forget any barrel connectors, and ground blocks need to be 3GHz rated. My father was once having a problem with a 301 that kept going stupid. *E kept sending him replacements.I think it was after the third, or fourth one they finely sent a tech to check over the system. It turned out to be a faulty DP34 switch when it seemed it was receiver problem.

I don't mean to sound authoratative here but in my experience (recently retired broadcast engr) there is really no such thing as RG-6 coaxial cable that is "rated" to 3 ghz unless it has actually been sweep-tested and comes with a certificate attached to the spool attesting to this. What there is, however, is some RG-6 coax around that has been marked/labelled as 3,000 Mhz (3 Ghz) cable, ostensibly for marketing purposes. That having been said, there is good coax and there is bad. At a frequency of 3 Ghz all RG6 (both good and bad) is going to exhibit very similar (if not identical) signal propagation and loss (attenuation) characteristics unless the cable is in some way physically damaged. RG6 Quad Shield cable is very good for use in cable TV systems where ingress radiation (ghosting) is a problem and is considered by some as a more ruggedized version of RG6 (it is after all larger), but otherwise there is no use or requirement for it in DBS (satellite) distribution systems.

The coax coming off the spool in the E* service van is very likely to be better quality than what you'll find at your local Radios Hack store and certainly a properly installed connector (including snugging down the threads) has more to do with the quality and dependability of your installation than the quality of the RG6. To that extent I have been somewhat appalled at the lack of attention to detail in this facet of installation in our own home. Connectors were properly cut-on to the cable but not a single one was more than finger snug and none of these guys have ever heard of using a little silicone grease on the threads; God forbid anyone think far enough ahead to proactively do something to thwart corrosion. Believe it or not there are actual torque specifications (30 inch-pounds) though of course you cannot do that directly onto the back of the receiver else you'll damage it. Still there's no excuse for loose connectors at the LNBF or diplexors, matrix switches, etc. If you can unscrew it with your fingers, then it was loose. A tight connector is a happy connector and a happy connector often begets a happy customer.

All in all, in reviewing this thread from its beginning I think what we see here indicates to me more of a component failure (and quality control) issue than a software one. I myself am on my 3rd VIP722 since last December (5 months ago). My current one was fine for the first month or so, but recently has begun to completely lose the output signal to the TV, on all outputs (Component, HDMI, 2nd room, etc). No, the IRD itself isn't rebooting spontaneously, the output signal to the display device(s) is dropping out (the TV indicates a loss of input). You can wait 5 minutes or so and it might come back or you can force-reboot it and also wait 5 minutes and it will come back. In the last week we've had to reboot 5 or 6 times.

This brings us full circle back to the original poster's original question. Does E* actually have a receiver that works dependably?
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#51 OFFLINE   phrelin

phrelin

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 13,375 posts
  • LocationNorthern California Redwoods
Joined: Jan 18, 2007

Posted 16 May 2008 - 11:15 AM

Heat. Late last summer when I got my 722, I watched it carefully. While the numbers indicated it was running quite warm, it was not out of bounds and the numbers are still within bounds. But...

Last summer and fall I rarely heard the fan running when the 722 wasn't "On" which means it was in standby mode.

Now we are having a bit of a "heat wave" meaning mid 80's max in the theater room. During late afternoon yesterday the fan was running at high speed and the top of the 722 was extremely hot, too hot to leave my hand on it. So in a panic, because it would soon actually start recording something, I put a couple of cool gel packs on top, which cooled it down some but not the point the fan stopped running on high speed before it started recording.

This morning when the room was in the low 60's the fan was running on low speed while the 722 had been in "standby" for over 6 hours.

What I know from years of building my own computers is that the fans running aren't an necessarily an indication of a problem, but in standby mode, fans running and a box too hot to keep your hand on it is an indication of a design problem. A "standby mode" that doesn't let the ViP receivers run cool in an 85 degree environment even with the fans on is not a minor issue.

"In a hundred years there'll be a whole new set of people."
"Always poke the bears. They sleep too much for their own good."

"If you're good enough, they'll talk about you." - Tom Harmon
A GEEZER who remembers watching TV in 1951 and was an Echostar customer from 1988 to 2008, now a Dish Network customer.
My AV Setup
My Slingbox Pro HD Experience
My Blog: The Redwood Guardian


#52 OFFLINE   HobbyTalk

HobbyTalk

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,659 posts
Joined: Jul 14, 2007

Posted 16 May 2008 - 01:24 PM

Standby mode on the VIP series is nothing more then running the screen saver. Some members here have put watt meters on the AC line and the amp draw while in standby is the same as when "on".




spam firewall