Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

Experimental Small Slimline3 Dish


  • Please log in to reply
462 replies to this topic

#401 OFFLINE   cabletech

cabletech

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 258 posts
Joined: Jan 20, 2011

Posted 06 September 2011 - 05:03 PM

if you set up the dish to lock on the 101, 110, 119, you should be able to recieve the 99, 103, with no problem with the sl3 head. If you are useing the old phase3 3lnb then you will not see the 99, 103 under any circumstance. I know, been there done that.

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#402 OFFLINE   isutailgator

isutailgator

    New Member

  • Registered
  • 3 posts
Joined: Sep 06, 2011

Posted 06 September 2011 - 09:21 PM

Thanks Matt.

Having tilt to receive. 99 and 103 is sinking in I promise. But, what about adding the large slimline dish (22.5 x 32.5) to my crank up... then would possible to receive them without a tilt adjustment?

Changing the reflector on the crank up is relatively easy, getting it to adjust at a tilt will take quite a bit more fabrication.

#403 OFFLINE   schneid

schneid

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 312 posts
Joined: Aug 13, 2007

Posted 06 September 2011 - 09:47 PM

The Slimline's must have the Tilt set and tweaked to get the birds so there is NO reason to believe there is a way not to set the Tilt. You would also have to use a Slimline Mast Assembly/Backplate/Arm or you would be hopelessly lost trying to nail three to five birds. You are dealing with arm length and alignment to nail the focal point. Mounting the Slimline assembly to your crank up sounds very tough. It may not remain on the roof at highway speeds either. I imagine it is pretty aerodynamic. Ask Winegard. They do it for $1,600.

I use a TV4RV HD Tripod and started with a Slimline with an SL5 until coming here. I then went to a Phase III with and an SL3 and then to a "Dish" 1000.2 with an SL3 which required lots of trial and error and reading here to get things lined up. I now use the 1000.2 and a SWM SL3. ALL require the Tilt to be set for the geographic location or the 99 and 103 will NOT be obtained. They are tough with the Tilt set.

You just aren't going to be able to cheat on this. In 402 posts, no one has done it yet. But never say never.

#404 OFFLINE   Relativity

Relativity

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 81 posts
Joined: May 28, 2011

Posted 07 September 2011 - 05:13 PM

This is a cool project. Just a question , if using the SL-5 or SL-3 non-SWiM LNBs , can you just do a direct connect 2 cable lines to a DVR receivers dual sat tuner ports? with B-Band Converters?

#405 OFFLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 11,148 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 07 September 2011 - 05:40 PM

This is a cool project. Just a question , if using the SL-5 or SL-3 non-SWiM LNBs , can you just do a direct connect 2 cable lines to a DVR receivers dual sat tuner ports? with B-Band Converters?


Yes. The LNB works the same regardless of what dish it is mounted to (providing of course you can align it properly to get all signals).

#406 OFFLINE   Relativity

Relativity

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 81 posts
Joined: May 28, 2011

Posted 08 September 2011 - 08:48 AM

Yes. The LNB works the same regardless of what dish it is mounted to (providing of course you can align it properly to get all signals).


ok assuming a simple temporary setup using a Phase III with SL3 or SL5 (non-SWiM LNB) correctly aligned:

2 wires from the 4 port LNB (which ones? or does it matter?)
and on the DVR receiver side, 2 BBCs connected to sat in ports.

#407 OFFLINE   schneid

schneid

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 312 posts
Joined: Aug 13, 2007

Posted 08 September 2011 - 09:06 AM

Two wires for both tuners of a DVR. Only need one if you intend on just watching/recording one channel. Any of the four leads can be used. Makes no difference.

I think the HR23 does NOT require BBC's. Sat Setup will tell you whether they are needed or not. Hr20's and HR24's do. There is a chart for that somewhere.

Solid Signal says, "Enables H20 H24, HR24 and HR20 receivers to receive upcoming HD programming.".

Edited by schneid, 08 September 2011 - 09:12 AM.


#408 OFFLINE   BennyGregg

BennyGregg

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 156 posts
Joined: Jul 17, 2009

Posted 18 September 2011 - 03:05 AM

I've been using a Phase III with an SL3 (non-swm) for RV use for a couple of years. I use an Acutrac III+ to aim it.

My set-up procedure is to very carefully peak 101, and then adjust the tilt to balance the meter readings between 99 and 103. In general, the meter readings on 103 have to be about 10% to 20% higher than on 99 to get acceptable strength on 103. Have others found this to be true? The tilt I end up with using this procedure has no relationship to the "official" tilt given for a location.

Balanced as above, the readings on 99 and 103 are usually between 65 and 80; reception has been reliable. Are these the sort of readings that others that use this set up usually get? Is there a more accurate way to aim this dish?

#409 OFFLINE   Matt9876

Matt9876

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,006 posts
Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 05:12 AM

I've been using a Phase III with an SL3 (non-swm) for RV use for a couple of years. I use an Acutrac III+ to aim it.

My set-up procedure is to very carefully peak 101, and then adjust the tilt to balance the meter readings between 99 and 103. In general, the meter readings on 103 have to be about 10% to 20% higher than on 99 to get acceptable strength on 103. Have others found this to be true? The tilt I end up with using this procedure has no relationship to the "official" tilt given for a location.

Balanced as above, the readings on 99 and 103 are usually between 65 and 80; reception has been reliable. Are these the sort of readings that others that use this set up usually get? Is there a more accurate way to aim this dish?


Your aiming procedure sounds good to me, I get 101 as strong as possible,balance 99 & 103 even if the signal is a bit low at this point than peek the signal on 103 than check the fourteen/sixteen transponder groups for 99 & 103 to make sure all are above 70, 72-89 is normal for the phase III conversion.

#410 OFFLINE   schneid

schneid

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 312 posts
Joined: Aug 13, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 07:44 AM

That is what I see. 101 in the 90's with the 99 and 103 in low 80's. Get's worse the farther north I am. Always good enough.

#411 OFFLINE   Matt9876

Matt9876

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,006 posts
Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 01:42 PM

Get's worse the farther north I am. Always good enough.


Nice to know it works up north,How far north are we talking about ?

#412 OFFLINE   BennyGregg

BennyGregg

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 156 posts
Joined: Jul 17, 2009

Posted 18 September 2011 - 01:56 PM

I noticed a drop off in signal going from east Texas to Denver; but even near Denver, the signal was strong enough for a reliable picture. It didn't rain while we were there, but if it had I think our picture would have gone away quickly.

Is there any new poop on DTv making a dish optimized (and smaller) for an SL3? It sure would be nice to have a dish designed to do what we are making the Phase III do; it's designed to receive signals along the arc from from 101 to 119. It must be that the signal quality of a dish the size of the Phase III but shaped for the arc from 99 to 103 would be quite good.

Anybody ever given any though to bending a Phase III in the hope of improving the signal?

#413 OFFLINE   Matt9876

Matt9876

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,006 posts
Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 03:12 PM

Anybody ever given any though to bending a Phase III in the hope of improving the signal?


Any installer will tell you nothing is worse than a bent dish, The phase III actually does a good job for it's size 18" X 20", If you need more gain just move up to a larger oval multi-sat dish reflector.

I honestly believe the phase III dishes wide look angle actually helps the HD signals, an experiment with a dish 500 reflector with a smaller look angle did not net any better signal strengths.

Edited by Matt9876, 18 September 2011 - 03:30 PM.


#414 OFFLINE   schneid

schneid

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 312 posts
Joined: Aug 13, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 03:23 PM

Nice to know it works up north,How far north are we talking about ?


Carson City and Steamboat Springs.

#415 OFFLINE   schneid

schneid

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 312 posts
Joined: Aug 13, 2007

Posted 18 September 2011 - 03:25 PM

Any installer will tell you nothing is worse than a bent dish, The phase III actually does a good job for it's size 18" X 20", If you need more gain just move up to a larger oval multi-sat dish reflector.


That's why I am using a Dish 1000.2 now. Does better on the 99 and 103 and the bolt pattern matches the Phase III. You do have to lengthen and raise the arm.

See previous posts above.

#416 OFFLINE   BennyGregg

BennyGregg

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 156 posts
Joined: Jul 17, 2009

Posted 18 September 2011 - 03:56 PM

As a theoretical question, consider two satellite dishes, both of which are being used to get signals from 99, 101, and 103. Both are 18"x20". One is designed to look at a satellite arc from 101 to 119; another is designed to look at a satellite arc from 99 to 103.

Is it (or isn't it) true that the dish designed to look at the smaller arc would get more signal?

Open your bluebooks, answer in ink, and take all the time you need...

#417 OFFLINE   Davenlr

Davenlr

    Geek til I die

  • Registered
  • 9,090 posts
Joined: Sep 16, 2006

Posted 18 September 2011 - 04:07 PM

Depends on the illumination pattern of the LNB on the dish. I know using an LNB designed for 99,101, and 103 on a 90cm x 100cm offset dish results in much better signal, while using the same LNB with an older AT9 reflector results in less signal, with the slimline reflector as a baseline.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#418 OFFLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 11,148 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 18 September 2011 - 08:43 PM

Nice to know it works up north,How far north are we talking about ?


My experience has been that it is very difficult to align a Phase III dish with a Slimline LNB and get usable 99/103 levels in Seattle. I'm about 47d 43m north latitude. I did get it to work (barely), but it wasn't worth the time and effort. So much easier to just do a slimline.

The northern most point in Texas is about 36d 30m, and the northern point in Nevada is about 42d. I'm easily 500 or miles north of where most of the success stories have been using the Phase III dish.

#419 OFFLINE   Matt9876

Matt9876

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,006 posts
Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Posted 20 September 2011 - 06:02 PM

I did get it to work (barely),

The northern most point in Texas is about 36d 30m, and the northern point in Nevada is about 42d. I'm easily 500 or miles north of where most of the success stories have been using the Phase III dish.


Good to know this information, we have many success stories from the New York area, just curious how far north it really works.

#420 OFFLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 11,148 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 20 September 2011 - 09:51 PM

Well, NY runs from roughly 42deg to 45deg north latitude. That puts me anywhere from 200 to 400 miles farther north.

I would think that longitude might also play an important factor, as the farther east or west you are, the more tilt/skew you will need, which is probably less easily accomplished with the Phase III dish. When you combine my location being both fairly far north, and fairly far west, I guess it is not surprising I had as much difficulty as I did trying to use the Phase III reflector with an SL5 LNB.




Protected By... spam firewall...And...