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Guest Message by DevFuse

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DirecTV’s HD tuner set to debut with Windows 7?


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119 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 01:33 PM

Right.
But then I don't understand your concern about one MCE per display.
It's one per per PC, is it not?


1 MCE per TV

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#27 OFFLINE   russdog

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 01:45 PM

1 MCE per TV

Didn't know that. Thanks.

That's very unfortunate.

#28 OFFLINE   Jeremy W

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 02:11 PM

Didn't know that. Thanks.

That's very unfortunate.

How is it unfortunate? Do you think that the TV will somehow magically be able to access the content from Media Center? Obviously an Extender will be needed.

#29 OFFLINE   russdog

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 02:27 PM

How is it unfortunate? Do you think that the TV will somehow magically be able to access the content from Media Center? Obviously an Extender will be needed.

It's unfortunate if one is required to purchase multiple licenses for a single product running on a single machine to serve multiple TV's, i.e. 1 per TV rather than 1 per PC.
Not sure if that will be the case or not, but that's what I meant.

#30 OFFLINE   Steve

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 02:30 PM

Would rather spend the extra and go with the PS3, combine that with the new netflix interface and sitting pretty. If the PS3 is not needed the Linksys DMA2100 ad the DMA2200 come in a hot second.

Currently running a custom Vista Ultimate 64 bit, 8GB memory, mirrored 320 GB boot drives, a Esata 15 drive raid external array, 1 PS3, 3 DMA2200's - now if the directv would interface 100 percent I will dump all my DVR's both Directivo and HR2X's and come out ahead.

Ya, but for me, that would cost anywhere from $1200-1500 for 6 MCE's, plus the cost of several DirecTV tuners for the MC PC (I'd want at least 3 or 4, to avoid conflicts).

That said, I guess you can't take it with you. :lol: /steve

PS: IIRC, there used to be a limit of 3 or 4 MCE's per MC server. Is that still true?
/steve

#31 OFFLINE   Ken S

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:27 PM

Would rather spend the extra and go with the PS3, combine that with the new netflix interface and sitting pretty. If the PS3 is not needed the Linksys DMA2100 ad the DMA2200 come in a hot second.

Currently running a custom Vista Ultimate 64 bit, 8GB memory, mirrored 320 GB boot drives, a Esata 15 drive raid external array, 1 PS3, 3 DMA2200's - now if the directv would interface 100 percent I will dump all my DVR's both Directivo and HR2X's and come out ahead.


Why spend extra for the PS3? The XBox360 will do NetFlix and is a true Media Center Extender. Certainly the PS3 can play video, etc...but in some households the consider Media Center interface is important.
Not arguing XBox vs. PS3...just suggesting a low-cost MCE that has some nice capabilities.

#32 OFFLINE   Ken S

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:30 PM

Ya, but for me, that would cost anywhere from $1200-1500 for 6 MCE's, plus the cost of several DirecTV tuners for the MC PC (I'd want at least 3 or 4, to avoid conflicts).

That said, I guess you can't take it with you. :lol: /steve

PS: IIRC, there used to be a limit of 3 or 4 MCE's per MC server. Is that still true?


Steve,

I think that limit would be based more on network capacity than the actual number you could have connected. I don't think there's any limitation on how many MCEs you can have on the network...just how many that could be hitting the server at the same time.

#33 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:43 PM

It's unfortunate if one is required to purchase multiple licenses for a single product running on a single machine to serve multiple TV's, i.e. 1 per TV rather than 1 per PC.
Not sure if that will be the case or not, but that's what I meant.


MCE is a piece of hardware not software.

#34 OFFLINE   Steve

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:45 PM

Steve,

I think that limit would be based more on network capacity than the actual number you could have connected. I don't think there's any limitation on how many MCEs you can have on the network...just how many that could be hitting the server at the same time.

Gotcha. It may have been an XP MC limit. I browsed the new Vista MC site and saw no limit on extenders, but did see a limit of 2 HD tuners and 2 SD tuners max. That could be a non-starter for me, because I'd want at least 3 HD tuners to resolve prime-time conflicts. /steve
/steve

#35 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:53 PM

Steve,

I think that limit would be based more on network capacity than the actual number you could have connected. I don't think there's any limitation on how many MCEs you can have on the network...just how many that could be hitting the server at the same time.


Have 6 running at the office on a single Vista Ultimate box, but it is basicly a full blown server.

#36 OFFLINE   carl6

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:54 PM

I tend to want to agree with the KISS crowd (keep it simple stupid). TV is TV, computers are computers. Each have their uses. Among the average person paying DirecTV varying amounts of $$$ per month, there is no interest in merging the two, and no need to do so.

For the small percentage of users who want the ability to totally integrate everything, great. I hope the hardware and software to support that comes along. But please don't expect me to help subsidize the cost of doing so in what I pay, as I have no interest or need in those capabilities. I like the direction I have seen DirecTV moving, and think they are on track to please the great majority of their customers.

#37 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 03:56 PM

Gotcha. It may have been an XP MC limit. I browsed the new Vista MC site and saw no limit on extenders, but did see a limit of 2 HD tuners and 2 SD tuners max. That could be a non-starter for me, because I'd want at least 3 HD tuners to resolve prime-time conflicts. /steve


There is a 3rd party patch that allows more turners, take a look at the green button or the Australian Media center site for the patch. I believe the new "service pack" the MS reeleased to OEM builders native support more then the unenhanced version

#38 OFFLINE   1948GG

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 04:53 PM

I undertand your concern.
In a sense that is what we are testing, yes we are using pcs as the reciever , and with media share the sender, but in the end, the whole MRV should be transparent to the average subscriber; maybe Dtv will provide the needed wirless units and set them up just like they do with the HR units.
MRV won't need pcs; and those with Windows7, hopefully it will be a plug-n-play.


OK, so explain to me how that qualifies you to talk about UPnP/DLNA, DTCP, and the other technologies that go into MRV. Because it sounds to me like you were in the game 25+ years ago, got out of it, and somehow still think that you're qualified to talk about the new stuff that you really don't know anything about.


I thought about putting this in another thread, probably would have been a better thing to do. But maybe I can get the 'two birds with one stone' explaining a bit, and perhaps explaining a bit about project management as well.

I simply think (I may be wrong, won't be the first time!), that they (DirecTV) is going about this 'ass-backwards'. They have this neat plan to have all this networked stuff going along, and oh, by the way, the MRV component of it is simply this 'module' hanging off to the side over there.

Okay... But perhaps we should review some history (usually not a bad idea at any time) of just exactly how networks evolved in the first place. All this multi-machine, multi-protocol stuff didn't simply leap from the 'brow of zeus', so to speak. What exactly was the first networks, what did they do, and what was the goal? x machines in some homogeneous network sharing anything in a complex client/server or peering system?

Wow, far from it. The first networks were for PRINT sharing, nothing more. Printers were VERY expensive, particularly laser ones, circa late 70's. So of course were hard discs, but hold on a sec, lets get printing working first. Later would come 'true' client-server networks that would integrate printer/file sharing, in fact, doing that efficiently and cost effectively was the whole basis behind this small company in Utah, Novell. They held onto the top dog status for a good decade.

Microsoft and others were (as usual?), late to the game. Others were the trailblazers. As others have pointed out, the MRV part has been in existence on other DVR machines as we speak, and in fact, existed several years ago. Hmm, are we trying to re-invent the wheel?

So, the project manager comes out. Do we want to develop a supersonic jet transport before doing, say, a bi-plane..? In fact, if one looks back at the development of heavier-than-air aircraft, that's just about exactly what a LOT of folks tried to do up until (and past!) the turn of the 20th Century. Then these two brothers from Dayton, OH, thought jeez, lets get the wheel invented first before we leap off the cliff!

In my mind, DirecTV is trying to develop the supersonic jet transport FIRST, and do the 'simple stuff' later. Good Luck!

I wish them luck. So far, the track record is not good; any project manager worth their salt would say if the basics aren't proven and the foundation not set within around 6 months of kickoff, then your initial plan is suspect. DirecTV has been going at this for what, at least six years...?

As far as the 'technology changing' and some particular part of it being different than, say, 25+ years ago, then I guess anyone can't follow any new thoughts or advances about anything.

Here's an example; do you think any Physicist from, say, the 1930's (pre atom bomb) would not understand pretty quickly exactly what Oppenheimer and friends came up with circa 1945? Or say, going back to my airplane analogy, that the Wright brothers would understand within a couple of minutes (seconds?) how a 747 flies?

One of the greatest challenges in any career is keeping up. The biggest thing to learn as an undergraduate is.... to learn how to learn.

The basic rules of physics don't change; although my 'atom bomb' example is a bit of a stretch, as those folks were rewriting a lot of the textbooks of the era.

But the basics of project management don't change, whether we're talking about an 8-lane superhighway or a rocket to the moon. Wernher von Braun wasn't just a genius rocket designer, he was a suburb project manager. He had a rocket pre-Sputnik ready to go, but the DOD wanted a different rocket to go, which wasn't ready. 'Politics'.

I don't think this question may ever get answered, but I wonder what 'politics' at DirecTV is pushing the Supersonic Transport part of MRV before the simple biplane...? Oh well....

As an aside, my 'hero for the ages' is this guy, Leslie R. Groves. A lowly brigadier general (MG at the end of the war), running the BIGGEST (certainly the most expensive) government/military project of WW2. The Manhattan Project. A 'simple' Corps of Engineers branch graduate of West Point, he didn't know SQUAT about the physics of how Oppenheimer was going to accomplish his feat, but he knew how to manage the 130,000 people and $24B (in 2008 dollars) to support that effort to it's positive conclusion.

#39 OFFLINE   Jeremy W

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 06:55 PM

If you had anything in that novel you wanted me to address, I would suggest posting it separately. Because I'm not reading all of that.

#40 OFFLINE   LarryFlowers

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 07:21 PM

If you had anything in that novel you wanted me to address, I would suggest posting it separately. Because I'm not reading all of that.


Don't worry about it Jeremy.. I read it and it lacks any content of importance to us.. he doesn't like DirecTV's development process.. thinks he could manage it better.. thinks they are incompetent... made a comparison to the Manhattan Project ???... completely off topic...

Lets cheer the fact that there is actually a driver in existence for the HDPC-20, which is way more than we have ever had before!!!
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#41 OFFLINE   dave29

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 07:38 PM

Lets cheer the fact that there is actually a driver in existence for the HDPC-20, which is way more than we have ever had before!!!


too bad there isnt a driver in vista sp2, anyway i cant wait for the hdpc20 to come out. i have already built a machine for it:p

#42 OFFLINE   Jeremy W

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Posted 09 November 2008 - 08:51 PM

Lets cheer the fact that there is actually a driver in existence for the HDPC-20, which is way more than we have ever had before!!!

Definitely. It's going to get here eventually.

#43 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 05:37 AM

If you had anything in that novel you wanted me to address, I would suggest posting it separately. Because I'm not reading all of that.


QFT - will stay with ARPNet (or maybe MilNet) for the first external network use and a IBM 360 series with 327X green screens for the internel data network

#44 OFFLINE   Greg Alsobrook

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 10:24 AM

http://www.engadgeth...p-20-usb-tuner/
Opinions expressed by me are my own and do not necessarily reflect
those of DBSTalk.com, DIRECTV, Dish Network, or any other company.

#45 OFFLINE   LarryFlowers

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 10:48 AM

http://www.engadgeth...p-20-usb-tuner/

\
That's what I'm talking about... Party!!!:D
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#46 OFFLINE   swans

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 11:04 AM

Don't worry about it Jeremy.. I read it and it lacks any content of importance to us.. he doesn't like DirecTV's development process.. thinks he could manage it better.. thinks they are incompetent... made a comparison to the Manhattan Project ???... completely off topic...

Lets cheer the fact that there is actually a driver in existence for the HDPC-20, which is way more than we have ever had before!!!


I work with computers all day long. I don't want to sit at home in front of a computer to do my TV viewing. This development was something that you guys placed some greater importance over. For most of the common people they would rather have MRV from DVR to receiver/DVR.

#47 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 12:14 PM

I work with computers all day long. I don't want to sit at home in front of a computer to do my TV viewing. This development was something that you guys placed some greater importance over. For most of the common people they would rather have MRV from DVR to receiver/DVR.

I'm either missing your point or you seem to be mixed up.
DirecTV2PC requires [in the simplest form] "sitting" in front of a computer.
HDPC-20 would be used with an HTPC which [normally] would be connected to an HD TV.
Would more customers be using HD DVRs and MRV? This would be my guess.
Are there some that would rather have their HTPC as a central server? "I think so".

Should DirecTV only work/develop "options" that I want/would use?
Isn't this a bit self centered?
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#48 OFFLINE   xzi

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 12:22 PM

Right.
But then I don't understand your concern about one MCE per display.
It's one per PC, is it not?


I think the confusion here (at least for me) is the terminology.

MCE = Media Center Edition, and typically refers to the PC iteself, of which you only need 1.

MCX = Media Center Extender, and is what you need at each TV. They can be as cheap as $150 now (Linksys and DLink) and you can have as many as you'd like connected to the MCE.

#49 OFFLINE   dave29

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 12:23 PM

I work with computers all day long. I don't want to sit at home in front of a computer to do my TV viewing. This development was something that you guys placed some greater importance over. For most of the common people they would rather have MRV from DVR to receiver/DVR.


"most" of us that want this, have pc's and htpc's hooked up to large hdtv's. its not like we will be sitting in front of 19'' computer monitors to watch tv from the hdpc20. right now, i use directv2pc as a mrv solution on my 2 main tv's with pc's hooked up to 2-62" dlps.

#50 OFFLINE   Ken S

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 12:25 PM

I tend to want to agree with the KISS crowd (keep it simple stupid). TV is TV, computers are computers. Each have their uses. Among the average person paying DirecTV varying amounts of $$$ per month, there is no interest in merging the two, and no need to do so.

For the small percentage of users who want the ability to totally integrate everything, great. I hope the hardware and software to support that comes along. But please don't expect me to help subsidize the cost of doing so in what I pay, as I have no interest or need in those capabilities. I like the direction I have seen DirecTV moving, and think they are on track to please the great majority of their customers.


Carl,
Nowadays the computers are DVRs and the DVRs are computers. The TV is a computer and the computer is a TV. It will get simple...as the computer just takes more and different forms. You think that cellphone you use is a phone or a computer? :)

So, yes many don't want to built an HTPC or even buy one...but they wouldn't think twice about buying a new A/V Receiver with all sorts of new functionality...or a "whole home DVR", etc. It's a question of interface and packaging.




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