Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo

Echostar buys XM debt. Potential control move?


  • Please log in to reply
129 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   MRinDenver

MRinDenver

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 195 posts
Joined: Feb 03, 2003

Posted 07 February 2009 - 12:02 PM

So, now that Charlie has purchased XM, I wonder how that will change DirecTV's music offering?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man’s religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -- Mark Twain

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#2 OFFLINE   boba

boba

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 5,580 posts
Joined: May 23, 2003

Posted 07 February 2009 - 12:27 PM

Are you jumping the gun in declaring DISH the owner of XM?

#3 OFFLINE   Tom Robertson

Tom Robertson

    Lifetime Achiever

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 20,250 posts
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 07 February 2009 - 12:29 PM

That seems a bit strong of a statement. All that I can find is that Echostar has purchased some of the debt, leading to speculation they might be making a play for control.

Without government approvals, I don't think they can actually take control should they acquire enough of the debt later on.

Cheers,
Tom

Go Packers!

My real treasures: 5 Grandchildren - S, D, M, M, C ; Now 5! Great-Grandtibbers - B, H, J, A, and M (Born 7/31/2011)


#4 OFFLINE   Grentz

Grentz

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 5,916 posts
Joined: Jan 10, 2007

Posted 07 February 2009 - 12:31 PM

This is purely speculation as they have not purchased it yet, but if Dish does purchase them I would think that the contracts in place would play out.

There is no saying that it could not be run as a separate company anyways and Directv would just continue buying access as they do now.
-Grentz
Subscriber since Oct. 1996
HR21-700, HR22-100, H24-100 (SWM)
~Detailed Setup~

Directv Signal Strength Posting Tool - Excel Ver. Web Ver.

#5 OFFLINE   denvertrakker

denvertrakker

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 136 posts
  • LocationColorado
Joined: Feb 05, 2009

Posted 07 February 2009 - 12:36 PM

Since the OP is in CO, as am I, I presume he saw the same story I did, in Friday's Rocky Mountain News.

The subhead was "Douglas County giant buys satellite radio firm's debt in possible takeover strategy." The operative word here is possible. Charlie ain't got nuttin' so far but a note for <$300 million. OTOH, that debt matures on the 17th of this month. If SiriusXM can't pay, then we'll see...

Edited by denvertrakker, 07 February 2009 - 12:38 PM.
(Sp)

Big TV/Two smaller TVs/Two DVRs and a box/Big grey dish facing south

#6 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    I used to be a rocket scientist

  • Registered
  • 12,059 posts
  • LocationMiddle Tennessee
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 07 February 2009 - 01:15 PM

Well, even if Charlie manages to obtain control, he has to purchase liabilities, assets AND existing contractual relationships. If he tries to cut Directv out of their existing contract without abiding by any pre-negotiated termination clauses, he'll be in breach of contract. Further more, under the laws of some states, even if he's willing to pay the damages for breach of contract, he might be subject to "exemplary damages" provisions - sort of like punitive damages for commercial and consumer protection - especially since he owns Directv's most-direct competitor.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#7 OFFLINE   Tom Robertson

Tom Robertson

    Lifetime Achiever

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 20,250 posts
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 07 February 2009 - 01:17 PM

Title changed

Go Packers!

My real treasures: 5 Grandchildren - S, D, M, M, C ; Now 5! Great-Grandtibbers - B, H, J, A, and M (Born 7/31/2011)


#8 OFFLINE   bwaldron

bwaldron

    Impossible Dreamer

  • Registered
  • 5,517 posts
Joined: Oct 24, 2005

Posted 07 February 2009 - 02:15 PM

Are you jumping the gun in declaring DISH the owner of XM?


No kidding!

HR23-700 --> Samsung UN65F6350AF LCD
HR23-700 --> JVC JLC47BC3002 LCD
H24-200 -->
Panasonic TH-50PX60U plasma


#9 OFFLINE   Ken S

Ken S

    RIP

  • Registered
  • 6,201 posts
Joined: Feb 12, 2007

Posted 07 February 2009 - 03:23 PM

It's very possible that Echostar has no interest in the Sirius XM service and is just looking to gain control of their assets in a bankruptcy proceeding. The satellite slots, bandwidth, terrestrial repeaters, etc. have value...and that may be the target now the actual service.

#10 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    I used to be a rocket scientist

  • Registered
  • 12,059 posts
  • LocationMiddle Tennessee
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 07 February 2009 - 03:48 PM

It's very possible that Echostar has no interest in the Sirius XM service and is just looking to gain control of their assets in a bankruptcy proceeding. The satellite slots, bandwidth, terrestrial repeaters, etc. have value...and that may be the target now the actual service.


They only have value for direct-to-user satellite audio use, per their FCC license. Even if they buy Sirius XM to gain those slots, etc., they still have to use those assets in the manner for which they are licensed.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#11 OFFLINE   MRinDenver

MRinDenver

    Legend

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 195 posts
Joined: Feb 03, 2003

Posted 07 February 2009 - 04:57 PM

Well, I say if you own a man's debt, you can call his tune. Or tunes, as the case may be.

Tell me why he wants the debt, if not to exercise eventual control?

This discussion is why I started this thread.

Nothing in Charlie's background indicates he is a passive owner of anything.

That isn't a judgement, just an observation.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man’s religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -- Mark Twain

#12 OFFLINE   techntrek

techntrek

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 298 posts
Joined: Apr 26, 2007

Posted 07 February 2009 - 05:29 PM

They only have value for direct-to-user satellite audio use, per their FCC license. Even if they buy Sirius XM to gain those slots, etc., they still have to use those assets in the manner for which they are licensed.


No they dont. The government can change the licenses if requested. I think hes after more HD bandwidth to catch up with Directv and cable.
How do I enable DLB for my life?

#13 OFFLINE   Jason Nipp

Jason Nipp

    Analog Geek in a Digital World

  • Super Moderators
  • 10,040 posts
  • LocationNorthern Illinois
Joined: Jun 10, 2004

Posted 07 February 2009 - 05:47 PM

So, now that Charlie has purchased XM, I wonder how that will change DirecTV's music offering?

I wouldn't expect it to.. Charlie is more than willing to make money even if it means the fees are being paid by a competitor.

Frankly I don't think it much different than Comcast providing sports channels to Dish and Direct. It's only a subscription.

#14 OFFLINE   Herdfan

Herdfan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 5,978 posts
Joined: Mar 18, 2006

Posted 07 February 2009 - 06:19 PM

Well, even if Charlie manages to obtain control, he has to purchase liabilities, assets AND existing contractual relationships. If he tries to cut Directv out of their existing contract without abiding by any pre-negotiated termination clauses, he'll be in breach of contract.


No he does not.

If there is a default on the debt, he can force XM into default. After that he can take control of the ASSETS as he pleases. He assumes no liability for any other XM liabilities.

This assumes the debt he has bought is senior debt and not subordinated to other debt.

This is the same as the mortgage company taking back a house. In doing so they do not assume liability for a car payment.

#15 OFFLINE   denvertrakker

denvertrakker

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 136 posts
  • LocationColorado
Joined: Feb 05, 2009

Posted 07 February 2009 - 07:56 PM

It's very possible that Echostar has no interest in the Sirius XM service and is just looking to gain control of their assets in a bankruptcy proceeding. The satellite slots, bandwidth, terrestrial repeaters, etc. have value...and that may be the target now the actual service.


From the same article I quoted earlier:

"The Wall Street Journal reported Sirius and EchoStar have "differently designed satellite systems that could be difficult to combine," but that Sirius has some facilities on the ground that could be beneficial to EchoStar."

I'm just waiting for the throwdown between Ergen and Malone...:D
Big TV/Two smaller TVs/Two DVRs and a box/Big grey dish facing south

#16 OFFLINE   JLucPicard

JLucPicard

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 3,983 posts
Joined: Apr 26, 2004

Posted 07 February 2009 - 10:01 PM

I am by no means a rocket scientist (which I'm sure will be evident when you read the rest of the post :)), but my initial thought when reading posts about the speculation of Dish doing this as a lead-in to gaining their satellites, two things crossed my mind.

1) Are the satellites that Sirius/XM have in orbit even usable for satellite television broadcast, and is the current in/on home dish/receiver system capable of using signals from those sats? and

2) Seems to me when I was researching Sirius versus XM years ago when I first bought in, Sirius used what was referred to as a 'figure 8' kind of thing where the sats weren't really geo-stationary like the TV service sats are. XM's was geo-stationary, Sirius was not. I wound up going with XM for that reason, as well as the fact that Sirius had Stern and XM had MLB.

#17 OFFLINE   scottchez

scottchez

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 926 posts
Joined: Feb 04, 2003

Posted 07 February 2009 - 11:43 PM

Did I read that DirecTV just turned off 3 XM Sirus channels? Is this related some how?
"We need more power Scotty" Kirk

#18 OFFLINE   denvertrakker

denvertrakker

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 136 posts
  • LocationColorado
Joined: Feb 05, 2009

Posted 07 February 2009 - 11:49 PM

Did I read that DirecTV just turned off 3 XM Sirus channels? Is this related some how?


Nope. The provider (NOT XM) ceased providing them to XM, so they are no longer available to D*.
Big TV/Two smaller TVs/Two DVRs and a box/Big grey dish facing south

#19 OFFLINE   prushing

prushing

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 459 posts
Joined: Feb 14, 2007

Posted 08 February 2009 - 12:28 AM

It would mean nothing to me, I can't remember the last time I listened to one of the channels. It probably would mean nothing to the majority of the DTV subscribers if they were cut off. Maybe an issue only at the holidays?

#20 OFFLINE   wilbur_the_goose

wilbur_the_goose

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 4,396 posts
Joined: Aug 16, 2006

Posted 08 February 2009 - 06:53 AM

These channels were internet only. They haven't been on XM for many months, even pre-merger




spam firewall