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DISH Network Announces Conference Call (5/11/09) for 1st Q 2009 Financial Results


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#1 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 12:49 PM

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DISH Network Corporation Announces Conference Call for First Quarter 2009 Financial Results

ENGLEWOOD, Colo., April 27, 2009 /PRNewswire-FirstCall via COMTEX News Network/ -- DISH Network Corporation (Nasdaq: DISH) will host its first quarter 2009 financial results conference call on Monday, May 11, 2009, at noon ET. The dial-in number is (800) 616-6729.

DISH Network's press release about its financial results will be distributed prior to the conference call. The press release will be available on the DISH Network Web site,
www.dishnetwork.com/aboutus.

About DISH Network Corporation
DISH Network Corporation (Nasdaq: DISH) provides approximately 13.678 million satellite TV customers as of Dec. 31, 2008 with the highest quality programming and technology at the best value, including the lowest all-digital price nationwide. Customers have access to hundreds of video and audio channels, the most international channels in the U.S., state-of-the-art interactive TV applications, and award-winning HD and DVR technology including 1080p Video on Demand and the DuoDVR™ ViP® 722 DVR, a CNET and PC Magazine "Editors' Choice." DISH Network is included in the Nasdaq-100 Index (NDX) and is a Fortune 250 company.

Visit www.dishnetwork.com.

SOURCE DISH Network Corporation
http://www.dishnetwork.com
Copyright © 2009 PR Newswire. All rights reserved

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#2 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 01:00 PM

Wouldn't it be nice if they broadcast this as the audio on Channel 212, the Earth Channel.

#3 OFFLINE   jbrooks987

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 04:34 PM

Frankly, I'd prefer the music remain on the Earth channel. I can still lift a finger to push the required 10 buttons on the phone, should I desire.

#4 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 11:49 PM

Yes, but it'd be fun to have something equally interesting to watch.:rolleyes:

#5 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 06:53 AM

Should we start a poll on how many subs they will lose this quarter? ;) I believe this will be the first quarter impacted by the AT&T loss.
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#6 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 29 April 2009 - 09:11 PM

I would expect the trend to reverse as they rolled out their $9.99 promotions which will draw other consumers who can't afford the other services to them and right now those people are becoming the majority in a lot of areas with the economy.

#7 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 30 April 2009 - 12:26 AM

Should we start a poll on how many subs they will lose this quarter? ;) I believe this will be the first quarter impacted by the AT&T loss.

I would expect the trend to reverse as they rolled out their $9.99 promotions which will draw other consumers who can't afford the other services to them and right now those people are becoming the majority in a lot of areas with the economy.

Both of you reflect a reality for Dish. The AT&T loss severely restricts Dish's participation in telecom package deals which alot of people like. On the other hand the economy favors the TurboHD packages.

The real question is how badly Dish was getting hit in the foreclosure situation in the quarter. When a company focuses on selling its service as the least expensive choice, the "Great Recession" as Time labeled it can cause significant customer loss. Every story I've read about the foreclosures in Florida and California talk about vacant houses with satellite TV dishes. And the abandonment of homes frequently means hardware disappears, a loss not easily discerned from the financial statements.

If we don't see a significant customer net loss, my guess is we'll see a jump in average subscriber acquisition costs because of those great new subscriber deals.

#8 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 12:58 AM

Both of you reflect a reality for Dish. The AT&T loss severely restricts Dish's participation in telecom package deals which alot of people like. On the other hand the economy favors the TurboHD packages.

The real question is how badly Dish was getting hit in the foreclosure situation in the quarter. When a company focuses on selling its service as the least expensive choice, the "Great Recession" as Time labeled it can cause significant customer loss. Every story I've read about the foreclosures in Florida and California talk about vacant houses with satellite TV dishes. And the abandonment of homes frequently means hardware disappears, a loss not easily discerned from the financial statements.

If we don't see a significant customer net loss, my guess is we'll see a jump in average subscriber acquisition costs because of those great new subscriber deals.



I'm not sure SAC will rise much. They changed their promotion to be a lot of money off for 6 months rather then a smaller amount for 12 months. It's not much different in terms of cost but it's huge in advertisement. I would venture to say that this Q1 call will show that they're stopping the flood that was happening but it won't show much else positive. ARPU will be less due to the promotion and I still think churn will be higher then they had hoped.

This will also be the first quarter that doesn't have Echostar numbers included as well.

#9 OFFLINE   Kheldar

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 10:11 AM

I'm not sure SAC will rise much. They changed their promotion to be a lot of money off for 6 months rather then a smaller amount for 12 months. It's not much different in terms of cost but it's huge in advertisement. I would venture to say that this Q1 call will show that they're stopping the flood that was happening but it won't show much else positive. ARPU will be less due to the promotion and I still think churn will be higher then they had hoped.


MultiChannel News states:

Dish has been plagued by poor marketing in the past but recently stepped up efforts with a new promotion giving new customers more than 100 channels for $9.99 per month for six months.
...
Dish has struggled of late — it reported its first-ever subscriber loss in the second quarter last year and ended 2008 down 102,000 customers. Dish stock, once one of the high flyers in the satellite industry, was pummeled last year; it finished 2008 down 66.5%. And in contrast to its chief rival DirecTV Group — which arguably had one of its best years ever in 2008 — things don't look like they will get better anytime soon.

Several analysts expect the satellite giant to shed even more subscribers in the first quarter, in part because of the loss of its distribution agreement with AT&T this year. In a research note, Credit Suisse media analyst Spencer Wang predicted Dish would lose about 130,000 subscribers in the period, fueled by indications that its $9.99 promotion has only modestly increased gross additions, a dwindling dealer base, strained relations with existing dealers, complicated installations and repairs and inconsistent marketing.

“Our research finds that it is too early to call a turnaround at Dish,” Wang wrote in a research note.


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#10 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 04:48 PM

Another analyst (can't recall who) predicted a loss of 95,000. I think it will be somewhere between the two numbers... above 100,000 though.
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#11 OFFLINE   WebTraveler

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 08:15 AM

It's not so much poor marketing, its a corporate attitude; Dish was signing up customers in droves years ago. It had focus, it was positioning itself as a solid company. Then something happened. Charlie Ergen started getting in fights with the channel providers and pull channels right and left. He made a conscious decision to not provide the sports packages and instead focus on the low end, very price conscious customer. Sometimes these strategies work. This time they didn't. Dish has differentiated itself from it's direct competitors Directv and the local cable systems by being the provider that doesn't have sports or certain channels, while Directv is clearly the sports leader and has put a prize on marketing that angle.

It's much more than marketing. It's focusing on the low end customer and ignoring completely the high end customer. Those are the customers leaving Dish and signing up for a competitor. Until and unless Dish recognizes this point they will fail....

#12 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 12:45 PM

I'm not sure I follow that logic, because it seems to me Dish built their existing customer base with Charlie doing the same thing (not worrying about sports channels, not trying to get the "high end" user, etc.)... so it doesn't look to me like the strategy has changed.

So I couldn't point to that as the reason why Dish is "failing".... plus I'd be hard pressed to say Dish is "failing" at all. Somehow we've become a country that expects continued growth at increasing rates every year... which ultimately forces companies to do things towards those ends that are counter-intuitive to a company that is doing well without growth.

I read something about Apple where it said their shareholders were "nervous" because Apple had $29 billion in capitol and wasn't actively looking to buy other companies.

When did it become bad to have cash on hand?

Seems like some companies "problems" are really the result of shareholder expectations moreso than company results.

I know Dish has lost customers in recent quarters... but compared to their entire customer base it has been a very small percentage. Granted, DirecTV has not had a net-loss but has in fact lost more customers than Dish. DirecTV has just done a better job at adding more customers during that time.

But numbers can be deceiving and lead to conclusions that might not tell the whole story of what is happening.

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#13 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 01:14 PM

I'm not sure I follow that logic, because it seems to me Dish built their existing customer base with Charlie doing the same thing (not worrying about sports channels, not trying to get the "high end" user, etc.)... so it doesn't look to me like the strategy has changed.

So I couldn't point to that as the reason why Dish is "failing".... plus I'd be hard pressed to say Dish is "failing" at all. Somehow we've become a country that expects continued growth at increasing rates every year... which ultimately forces companies to do things towards those ends that are counter-intuitive to a company that is doing well without growth.

I read something about Apple where it said their shareholders were "nervous" because Apple had $29 billion in capitol and wasn't actively looking to buy other companies.

When did it become bad to have cash on hand?

Seems like some companies "problems" are really the result of shareholder expectations moreso than company results.

I know Dish has lost customers in recent quarters... but compared to their entire customer base it has been a very small percentage. Granted, DirecTV has not had a net-loss but has in fact lost more customers than Dish. DirecTV has just done a better job at adding more customers during that time.

But numbers can be deceiving and lead to conclusions that might not tell the whole story of what is happening.

Two things. First, since the Echostar/Dish split Dish fall into the category of a company that doesn't have sufficient liquid assets (cash) by any reasonable standard. Second, Dish lost more customers than it gained last quarter. No, it wasn't a big net number. It just broke a long, long, long trend. Many expect that to happen this time. If it continues, at some point that could become a trend.

While I share your view that focusing on "growth" and "what did you do for me yesterday" is a bad way to judge a company, the particular numbers about liquidity and the end of a very long subscriber growth trend are things that raise eyebrows. Dish needs to keep focus on the fact that it is no longer a technology development company but rather 100% completely a retail service company in the home entertainment business.

#14 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 05:12 PM

Yeah, I realize my post was a bit of a jumble of mixed things...

I realize Dish doesn't have a lot of cash on-hand, so they are not in good standing with regards to that... and, as you pointed out, when companies split often one of the "new" companies gets the worst of the bookkeeping in the split.

I just read that DirecTV was somewhere around 18 million subscribers... where last I knew Dish was just shy of 14 million.

I agree it is something worth watching to see IF it becomes a trend... but I don't think I could declare DirecTV "perfectly stable" and Dish "in big trouble" based on current numbers for either company.

We'll know more, perhaps, when Dish has their conference call next week.

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#15 OFFLINE   WebTraveler

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 06:47 PM

Directv is probably not perfectly stable, but definately more stable than Dish.

I doubt Dish is plugging merrily along....they just replaced senior managers AGAIN. That is a sign of issues.

What Charlie may have done in the past may not work in the current. He has to be flexible and adapt to a changing marketplace. He is one of the most inflexible people I have ever seen. He also seems to me to be a very uhappy person in his life as he is always fighting with everyone.

I left recently because of Charlie Ergen and the lack of integrity at Dish.....the "corporate attitude" that is pushed now....

#16 OFFLINE   Chihuahua

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 11:39 PM

Directv is probably not perfectly stable, but definately more stable than Dish.

I doubt Dish is plugging merrily along....they just replaced senior managers AGAIN. That is a sign of issues.

What Charlie may have done in the past may not work in the current. He has to be flexible and adapt to a changing marketplace. He is one of the most inflexible people I have ever seen. He also seems to me to be a very uhappy person in his life as he is always fighting with everyone.

I left recently because of Charlie Ergen and the lack of integrity at Dish.....the "corporate attitude" that is pushed now....


Charles' ongoing fight with Fisher Communications is just another in a series of bad programming disputes.

#17 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 12:44 AM

Charles' ongoing fight with Fisher Communications is just another in a series of bad programming disputes.


When your target market is the lower end of the economy scale he has no choice. If he were to have higher price increases or take terms that other companies do he would have to start removing packages that cost money. Then they would lose even more customers. Look what happened when he finally decided to start competing with HD channels. He had no choice but to have record price increase's. I think Charlie is going to pull a sprint soon and decide that the lower economy demographic is not working and that they're going to have to decide that less customers in the short term that are profitable are better than many unprofitable ones.

If it weren't illegal I'd almost say that he's intentionally trying to devalue his stock with these choices so that Dish becomes so cheap someone buys them and he can focus on Echostar.

#18 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 10:24 AM

Well, I have to give Charlie & Company credit. Just ahead of the conference call they:
  • bring Remote Access via the internet and iPhone out of beta
  • added five market-significant HD channels
I guess that means they've determined they need to have some "here's what we're doing" things to talk about.

#19 OFFLINE   BattleZone

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 11:44 AM

I'm not sure I follow that logic, because it seems to me Dish built their existing customer base with Charlie doing the same thing (not worrying about sports channels, not trying to get the "high end" user, etc.)... so it doesn't look to me like the strategy has changed.


The problem there is that the market has changed in big ways since then:

- HD is all but a requirement among higher-end customers, and even down into the middle-income customers. But Dish doesn't market to the upper-end customer, even though they currently offer more HD and certainly have a good product.

- Even lower-end customers often need/want more than 4 TVs. Dish doesn't make that price-effective, driving these customers to competitors.

- Dish used to be the lowest-cost TV provider, where most bargain-conscious customers would end up. But the telecoms, and to a less extent cable, can now offer even lower-cost TV through the use of bundles. They can lose money on TV and make it up on phone and Internet. Lots of the customers that Dish would have normally attracted are now getting a telecom bundle.

- A big percentage of the remaining low-end customers are not able to pay for TV right now due to the economy. The mid- and high-end customers are much less effected.

- The dual-output receiver model is starting to be a problem, because the second output is only SD (and for several reasons, must remain so). As people start replacing their 3rd and 4th TVs with HDTVs, watching SDTV on them is no longer acceptable.

IMO, though, the biggest issue is bad marketing, and failing to focus on the higher-end customers. That's where the growth is. That's who DirecTV markets to, and you can see that it is working well for them. Dish needs to build some good deals for higher-end customers and do some good national advertising to educate their potential customers about what they've got to offer.

#20 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 11:56 AM

r - The dual-output receiver model is starting to be a problem, because the second output is only SD (and for several reasons, must remain so). As people start replacing their 3rd and 4th TVs with HDTVs, watching SDTV on them is no longer acceptable.


I'd say this particular issue is a non-starter, considering that no other provider offers a receiver like Dish does that drives 2 TVs (SD or HD)... Unless and until a competitor offers a receiver that can output to two HD TVs with unique channel-viewing experiences, Dish has nothing to worry about in this particular area.

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