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Guest Message by DevFuse

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neighboring channels: HD?

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15 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Shawn17

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 01:20 PM

I live in the New Haven (CT) area and receive three channels from NYC as neighboring channels. Glad to get them but they're only coming through in SD.

I'd like to get them in HD. Naturally, they're transmitted in HD (by D*) to NYC subscribers -- and they're being sent here -- although blacked out -- as the national feeds for CBS, NBC and FOX.

Any reason why local channels that are available in HD (to D* local subscribers) aren't sent to neighboring areas in HD?

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#2 OFFLINE   raoul5788

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 01:48 PM

I live in the New Haven (CT) area and receive three channels from NYC as neighboring channels. Glad to get them but they're only coming through in SD.

I'd like to get them in HD. Naturally, they're transmitted in HD (by D*) to NYC subscribers -- and they're being sent here -- although blacked out -- as the national feeds for CBS, NBC and FOX.

Any reason why local channels that are available in HD (to D* local subscribers) aren't sent to neighboring areas in HD?


Because they aren't. I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but it's true. I have read a few posts about this, and no one seems to have a reason why. BTW, we used to get WNBC in hd, since WVIT is an O&O station, but not any more.

#3 OFFLINE   BattleZone

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 02:04 PM

DirecTV doesn't make the rules; they have to abide by the FCC, who implemented the DMA (Designated Marketing Area) system. Your zip code determines which locals you get (except for OTA signals, which are available anywhere you can receive them).

#4 OFFLINE   sum_random_dork

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 02:36 PM

Wow, I just wish I could get my Significantly Viewed Channels....at this point could care less if they were in SD.

#5 OFFLINE   Tom Servo

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 12:59 AM

DirecTV doesn't make the rules; they have to abide by the FCC, who implemented the DMA (Designated Marketing Area) system. Your zip code determines which locals you get (except for OTA signals, which are available anywhere you can receive them).

DMAs don't differ between HD and SD versions of a channel.

I wish I could get locals at my Mississippi location. Cable carries channels from three (er, two now) markets to fill out the slots but DBS services don't have that luxury. I was beginning to think the neighboring channels thing wasn't implemented at all by DirecTV; this is the first I've heard of someone getting channels from another market through the significantly viewed thing so far.

#6 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 01:05 AM

Local stations will fight tooth and nail to keep neighboring DMA's HD channels off line. People will watch the neighboring DMA for things like news and maybe sports if the teams change. However given the HD option people will watch their favorite shows on those channels. That means higher ad revenue. If HD was offered people would just choose whichever they wanted to watch their news and sports by default and remove the other channel.

#7 OFFLINE   Tom Servo

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 05:19 AM

I disagree with that logic. The vast majority of folks just want their local channels with local news. But there's a lot of people in more rural areas where DMAs have an incomplete slate of networks, and siginificantly viewed/neighboring channels are important to flesh out the lineup.

I suppose the Shades' arguement holds up though if a neighboring station has good quality HD and the local station doesn't, though. I know of a few smaller market stations (in Little Rock and Birmingham, for example) that routinely fail to ‘flip the HD switch’ and having an adjacent market option would mean another HD choice.

I just know there's a lot of folks in my particular boat. When I'm in Birmingham, there's a station for every network, even America One! But here in Mississippi, my DMA only has PBS, ABC and CBS, with Fox on a digital SD only subchannel. Via cable my town gets NBC, MyNTV, CBS again, Fox again and The CW from the neighboring market. And until recently cable subs got CBS and NBC from Memphis, 100 miles away.

I understand the rules, restrictions and whatnot, as well as why the local stations don't want the same network on another channel available… But it flummoxes me to no end that cable gets one lenient set of rules but DBS services get stricter rules.

If cable had to play by the same rule, my town would lose NBC and the lesser networks and I am sure there would be an uproar. But with D* or Dish, “that's just the way it is” and that's why dishes are very very rare here.

As far as I'm concerned DBS and cable alike should be allowed to get channels from any adjacent market to fill out the SD lineup, and again for HD even if it means getting national DNS channels from NY or LA because the local affiliate doesn't offer any HD at all (like my local Fox on a subchannel, or my market's CBS affiliate which apparently passes through ZERO HD at all. Not that I can get them with their weak signal.)

#8 OFFLINE   Msguy

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 07:03 AM

In my area I am a perfect example of this. My local cable company has two NBC stations that they currently can show. One is from Tupelo, Mississippi and the other one is from Memphis, Tennessee. I live right in the middle of both areas. I receive my Local Channels all from Memphis on DirecTv, But DirecTv cannot also let me view the Tupelo Channel all because of dumb FCC So Called Broadcast Rules for DBS Providers. I think this is a bunch of Balogna and someone needs to stand up to the FCC and the NAB and get these dumb rules changed. There is no logic at all why Satellite Customers should be able to subscribe to other Local Channel Markets. We Should be able to subscribe to Distant Networks if we want to. I hope that the Obama administration will change these rules somehow someway. I would love to be able to subscribe to other out of market Local Stations simply because they are nice for when the times your local market pre-empts national programs for local programming. And I do not think that is right. What they should force ALL major networks to do is carry all national programming if a station wants to remain an affilliate of ABC, CBS, FOX, or NBC. They should not be allowed to pre-empt national programming at any time unless for bad weather or emergency situations. That is my 2 cents on this issue.

#9 OFFLINE   MIKE0616

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Posted 08 May 2009 - 07:43 AM

Have a question for folks who are able to pick up more than one DMA in HD at home:

Does D* allow you to view the schedule and record (currently have HR20-700s) shows from multiple markets? Reason I am asking is that we are moving to an area where will be picking up more than one DMA and none are what I call complete (as compared to where we now reside) in coverage by OTA offerings. I still want to receive the non-major channels (THIS, RTN, et. al.) as they have some good programming and some of these will be in varying DMAs. I know I will have to install a complete antenna system with rotor, amp, tower, etc. to receive all these DMAs, and am well prepared to do that to get decent coverage (we are moving from major metro to the boonies, think 2 million to 2 thousand) and although I am wanting to keep D* (like the sports coverage) and wanting to be able to record what I want to be able to view when I wish. (Been spoiled by having DVRs for too long.)

Anyone have any experience with this? THANKS!

#10 OFFLINE   REDSKINSFAN47

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Posted 11 May 2009 - 06:08 PM

Have a question for folks who are able to pick up more than one DMA in HD at home:

Does D* allow you to view the schedule and record (currently have HR20-700s) shows from multiple markets? Reason I am asking is that we are moving to an area where will be picking up more than one DMA and none are what I call complete (as compared to where we now reside) in coverage by OTA offerings. I still want to receive the non-major channels (THIS, RTN, et. al.) as they have some good programming and some of these will be in varying DMAs. I know I will have to install a complete antenna system with rotor, amp, tower, etc. to receive all these DMAs, and am well prepared to do that to get decent coverage (we are moving from major metro to the boonies, think 2 million to 2 thousand) and although I am wanting to keep D* (like the sports coverage) and wanting to be able to record what I want to be able to view when I wish. (Been spoiled by having DVRs for too long.)

Anyone have any experience with this? THANKS!


with hr20 you will be able to enter 1 zip code other then your own,your guide will give you info on those channels if you can pick up channels in that city from your antenna you will be able to dvr sd and hd from that zip that you can pick up.
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#11 OFFLINE   CHDinCT

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 10:06 AM

I live in the New Haven (CT) area and receive three channels from NYC as neighboring channels. Glad to get them but they're only coming through in SD.

I'd like to get them in HD. Naturally, they're transmitted in HD (by D*) to NYC subscribers -- and they're being sent here -- although blacked out -- as the national feeds for CBS, NBC and FOX.

Any reason why local channels that are available in HD (to D* local subscribers) aren't sent to neighboring areas in HD?


I'm also in CT and like Shawn17, get the NYC locals in SD via D* except ABC. I know that D* has been retransmitting a digitized version of the NYC analog feeds into this market, and I'm happy for that, BUT, what happens after Friday when analog is shut down? Seems D* could only retransmit the digital channels. At that point, I'm hoping we'll get HD when the NYC locals have HD programming, but who knows. Is there a reason D* would down rez HD to SD when the originating programming is in HD?? Or am I missing something else completely?

#12 OFFLINE   litzdog911

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 10:09 AM

..... Is there a reason D* would down rez HD to SD when the originating programming is in HD?? Or am I missing something else completely?


Yes, there's a reason .... To maintain compatiblity with the millions of customers that don't have any HD equipment. Downrezzed local SD stations will likely remain on both Cable and satellite for many more years.
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#13 OFFLINE   CHDinCT

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 10:13 AM

Yes, there's a reason .... To maintain compatiblity with the millions of customers that don't have any HD equipment. Downrezzed local SD stations will likely remain on both Cable and satellite for many more years.


Damn. I had a feeling I was missing something in this equation. So, D* will have to provide an SD and HD feed for the NYC LIL market. Why not make the HD feed available to neighboring markets that are now getting the SD feed for those of us that have HD equipment? From what I've read so far, there is no regulation restricting that, is there? (I guess this is basically the OP's question.)

#14 OFFLINE   raoul5788

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 02:08 PM

Yes, there's a reason .... To maintain compatiblity with the millions of customers that don't have any HD equipment. Downrezzed local SD stations will likely remain on both Cable and satellite for many more years.


What CHDinCT is asking is why don't we as hd customers get WNBC and the others in hd if we get them in sd as sv channels. It has nothing to do with the sd only customers.

#15 OFFLINE   davring

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 02:17 PM

Tom Servo stated, earlier in this thread, tha SD and HD DMA's are the same. I don't beleive that is the case. That adds to the confusion. Makes no sense to me, but I am sure there is money involved in the equation.
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#16 OFFLINE   raoul5788

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 06:59 PM

Tom Servo stated, earlier in this thread, tha SD and HD DMA's are the same. I don't beleive that is the case. That adds to the confusion. Makes no sense to me, but I am sure there is money involved in the equation.


I don't know if the sd and hd dma's differ, but here in CT we get Hartford locals in sd and hd, but the sv channels we get from the NY dma are in sd only. We used to get WNBC in hd, but it was turned off a while ago.




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