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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Watching OTA during rain fade


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18 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   festivus

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 05:45 AM

Seems that during a storm my 622 doesn't allow me to watch an unlimited amount of OTA. We've had a couple of lengthy storms the last few days. When I get the lost signal screen I can usually go to the menu, guide, and pick an OTA channel to watch. But after a period of time the guide goes away and it seems that I can no longer watch OTA. Anyone know why this happens? Is the 622 "pinging" the network and if there is no return the guide disappears? I'm guessing that I can watch about 20 min or so of OTA before it goes away.

I have my OTA input split so that I can always switch to watch through my TV but then I don't get dvr capability of course.
Panasonic TCP50S1 50 inch plasma in great room, Dish VIP622, Pioneer Surround System

Sanyo PLV-Z5 Projector in basement, 106 inch gray screen, 2nd Dish VIP622. LG Surround System

db2 antennna in attic for both VIP622s

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#2 OFFLINE   4bama

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 06:49 AM

We have frequent heavy thunderstorms here too and I have always been able to use the menu/guide method to select an OTA channel (622) without limits on how long it stays on. I can also record an OTA during Dish weather outages.

I'm always in single mode...not sure if that would make a difference, though it should not.
Dish 622 DVR, B'ham locals via Dish, Montgomery locals OTA, Winegard on 70' tower + CM7777 preamp

#3 OFFLINE   GrumpyBear

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 11:00 AM

Thats a strange one. I use OTA alot both here in So cal and up North in the Pacific Northwest. Up North, use OTA, just to make sure I can watch or record via rain fade times, and never had a problem like that.

Do you do a nightly updates on your system, or do you have nightly updates turned off?

#4 OFFLINE   TulsaOK

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 03:07 PM

Once the EPG is lost, there's no way to tune to any channel.
<span style='font-size: 10px;'>“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.”<br /> - John Wayne</span><br /><br />Avatar: Tanner 1992 - 2009

#5 OFFLINE   festivus

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 05:53 AM

Once the EPG is lost, there's no way to tune to any channel.


Makes sense, but why is the EPG lost? What scheduled process causes the EPG to go away? Like I noted, it's OK for a while then mysteriously goes away.
Panasonic TCP50S1 50 inch plasma in great room, Dish VIP622, Pioneer Surround System

Sanyo PLV-Z5 Projector in basement, 106 inch gray screen, 2nd Dish VIP622. LG Surround System

db2 antennna in attic for both VIP622s

Time Warner Roadrunner

We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. ~Carl Sagan

#6 OFFLINE   TulsaOK

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 07:16 AM

One way it will be lost is if the receiver resets with no satellite signal. I'm not sure what other events would trigger it though.
<span style='font-size: 10px;'>“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.”<br /> - John Wayne</span><br /><br />Avatar: Tanner 1992 - 2009

#7 OFFLINE   SaltiDawg

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 07:21 AM

Makes sense, but why is the EPG lost? What scheduled process causes the EPG to go away? Like I noted, it's OK for a while then mysteriously goes away.

Are you sure the guide is "lost?" If you try to return to the Guide, what do you see.

What may be happening is as follows. You lose the Sat signal and the error message appears. You select Guide and choose to watch an OTA station. While watching that OTA station, the Sat signal is regained (unknown to you.) You again lose the Sat signal and the error message again appears.

Is this scenario possible?

#8 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 10:42 AM

Are you sure the guide is "lost?" If you try to return to the Guide, what do you see.

What may be happening is as follows. You lose the Sat signal and the error message appears. You select Guide and choose to watch an OTA station. While watching that OTA station, the Sat signal is regained (unknown to you.) You again lose the Sat signal and the error message again appears.

Is this scenario possible?

Yes.

We had a very severe thunderstorm go through last night that knocked out service for about 5-10 minutes. I was watching an OTA weather sub-channel and had no interruptions until I chose to see if I had a satellite signal. Without a recording or TV2 running the receiver didn't seem to care. Previous times when I had recordings scheduled or in progress the receiver nagged more.

#9 OFFLINE   GrumpyBear

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 11:18 AM

Yes.

We had a very severe thunderstorm go through last night that knocked out service for about 5-10 minutes. I was watching an OTA weather sub-channel and had no interruptions until I chose to see if I had a satellite signal. Without a recording or TV2 running the receiver didn't seem to care. Previous times when I had recordings scheduled or in progress the receiver nagged more.


Wonder what the threshold time is then. Up North we gets lots of rain, but I don't ever remember losing the guide data, during a rainfade period. Granted I haven't ever lost signal for 5 straight min's either though.

#10 OFFLINE   Ivtec

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 06:17 PM

Wonder what the threshold time is then. Up North we gets lots of rain, but I don't ever remember losing the guide data, during a rainfade period. Granted I haven't ever lost signal for 5 straight min's either though.




That's true when you loose signal from the sat than you also loose the Epg,
that would happen with a VIP211 that I've owned,it doesn't happen with a receiver that i use for FTA linear Sat's and also has OTA,but it has separated tuner and if i loose sat i go to the Ota and have Epg,

#11 OFFLINE   SaltiDawg

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 06:26 PM

That's true when you loose signal from the sat than you also loose the Epg, ...

This is not correct as far as my 622 and 722k receivers. I lost Sat for about five minutes this afternoon during a thunderstorm. I pressed Menu and 1 to call up the Guide and then I selected an OTA channel to view. At the end of the five minutes, the Sat was reacquired and I still had the Guide.

#12 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 09:51 PM

This is not correct as far as my 622 and 722k receivers. I lost Sat for about five minutes this afternoon during a thunderstorm. I pressed Menu and 1 to call up the Guide and then I selected an OTA channel to view. At the end of the five minutes, the Sat was reacquired and I still had the Guide.


You are only talking about 5 minutes though... It has been a while, but I too remember a time when an extended storm-related outage eventually resulted in the EPG going kablooie. It might take something more like 15-30 minutes of outage to become a problem.

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#13 OFFLINE   festivus

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 10:17 AM

My outage on Saturday was over 30 min. I'm envious of those of you that have never had an outage over 5 min.:nono:

When the outage first happened I hit the menu then the guide and selected an OTA. Worked great for a while. Some time later, 15 to 20 min I think, all programming was gone. I did not try to go back to guide nor did I try to tune to a sat channel during the 15 to 20 min. I had nothing until the storm left the area. About 35 minutes start to finish.

It's aggravating that the guide seems to go away after a given amount of time causing OTA capability to go away. IMO OTA should never go away.
Panasonic TCP50S1 50 inch plasma in great room, Dish VIP622, Pioneer Surround System

Sanyo PLV-Z5 Projector in basement, 106 inch gray screen, 2nd Dish VIP622. LG Surround System

db2 antennna in attic for both VIP622s

Time Warner Roadrunner

We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. ~Carl Sagan

#14 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 10:38 AM

My outage on Saturday was over 30 min. I'm envious of those of you that have never had an outage over 5 min.:nono:

Any longer outages for me would have been during a "southwest corner of basement" moment. Watching TV becomes irrelevant when the storm is bad enough to send me running. I'm on eastern arc so any interference from electrical activity in the sky is usually after the storm.

If it helps sooth the envy the five minutes mine goes out is usually the most critical. The last five minutes of a drama, for example. Sometimes I don't find out who done it. :(

I have not tested in a while but the last time I blocked my DISH to see if OTA would last I gave up before the 30 minute mark. The guide data should stay in the receiver until it is rebooted. Losing the ability to view OTA shouldn't happen in 20 minutes.

#15 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 01:11 PM

I wonder if it is a combination of things... I agree with James that the EPG should not just die during an extended outage... but what if the EPG data is already outdated?

Say, if your receiver is not getting its nightly "fix" update to the EPG refresh... that might make your situation more susceptible to losing the EPG during a storm.

-- Respect the S.H.I.E.L.D.


#16 OFFLINE   TulsaOK

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 01:14 PM

Losing the ability to view OTA shouldn't happen in 20 minutes.


Or ever.
<span style='font-size: 10px;'>“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.”<br /> - John Wayne</span><br /><br />Avatar: Tanner 1992 - 2009

#17 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 01:29 PM

Or ever.

Ever is a long time. Since the DISH receivers get their EPG via satellite (even for OTA locals) some satellite connection is needed to maintain that data. And since DISH requires subscription to locals to get EPG out of that data when the subscription information in your receiver gets stale I'd expect the EPG to go away.

At best I would expect a couple of days ... but until the nightly reboot (or next reboot) is the most I would look forward to. Obviously the time frame is shorter than I would expect.

#18 OFFLINE   TulsaOK

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 02:51 PM

Ever is a long time. Since the DISH receivers get their EPG via satellite (even for OTA locals) some satellite connection is needed to maintain that data. And since DISH requires subscription to locals to get EPG out of that data when the subscription information in your receiver gets stale I'd expect the EPG to go away.

At best I would expect a couple of days ... but until the nightly reboot (or next reboot) is the most I would look forward to. Obviously the time frame is shorter than I would expect.


As old as I am, a couple of days could be "ever". :)
<span style='font-size: 10px;'>“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.”<br /> - John Wayne</span><br /><br />Avatar: Tanner 1992 - 2009

#19 OFFLINE   BarryG

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Posted 08 June 2010 - 05:17 AM

This is not correct as far as my 622 and 722k receivers.

I've seen it happen on my 722K.




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