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Directv... "buy" the receiver and its actually leased?


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45 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   MizzouTiger

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 07:51 AM

This topic seems to keep getting re-hashed over the last few years. There is really no difference from what you would have paid a few years ago before they started their "lease" model. When I first changed to DirecTv from Dish in 2004, I bought my 3 receivers from Circuit City - yes I owned them outright. I still paid a $5/month mirroring fee for the 2nd and 3rd receivers. I then upgraded to HD in 2007. Now those original receivers are sitting in a pile in my basement - what good are those "owned" receivers doing me now? If you leave DirecTv, what good are their receivers to you then - you can't use them with another provider. Some would say that they think they should be able to sell them on their own and recoup some of their money. Well, I guess you could. But if you leave when you are out of committment, then your receivers are at least 2 years old. It seems that DirecTv has been releasing new receivers on a fairly regular basis and the newer ones seem to be what everyone wants - e.g., people with Hx20's are wanting the new Hx24's because they're faster and have DECA built in. Also, as others have mentioned, if you truly want to "own" your receivers, then your upfront cost is going to be significantly more.

I don't know. I just think they people blow this whole "leased" receiver thing way out of proportion.:confused:
<p>HR44-700 Toshiba 55SV670U | HDMI to Denon AVR-1909| Native On | All Resolutions Selected | DD On | DECA | SWiM | Harmony One | HR24-100 Philips 37PFL5322D/37 | HDMI to TV | Native on | All resolutions Selected | DD Off | DECA | SWiM | Harmony 880 | HR24-100 Sony KDL40V2500| HDMI to TV | Digital Optical Audio out to Yamaha HTR-5490| Native On | All Resolutions selected | DD | DECA | SWiM | Harmony 880

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#27 OFFLINE   Hutchinshouse

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:07 AM

But what about the guy who bought your HR10-250 first, who probably paid somewhere between $850 and $1,000, and sold it for $160? He took a hit. You got a great deal and even made some money because you bought used.

People on this list are often early adopters. I know I am. If this was the old days, I'm sure the satellite gear I'd want to buy would be new, cutting edge and expensive. Yes, I could sell it but I'd take a huge hit, like I did with my $800 Beta Hi-Fi video recorder, $700 LaserDisc player, or even my $600 Dolby Stereo (ooooohh!) Akai portable VHS recorder.

For early adopters, the lease program can work in your favor. Buying the cutting edge DVR right now would cost me $199 plus shipping. Yes, I don't get my $199 back, but then, I also don't take the depreciation.


:lol: Yup, $1000 a little steep for a DVR. I hear what you're saying, I did have a good deal. $800 Beta Hi-Fi video recorder? :eek2: Crazy!

#28 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:26 AM

that would be good. I looked on ebay, but it didnt look like there were that many.. any other places to look? Also, when buying used, is there anything i need to be careful of?

If someone is selling a DirecTV receiver, it's supposed to be owned. You can't sell a lease.

Make sure the seller gives you the RID and verify the receiver status with DirecTV before you buy it.

Keep in mind if you purchase an owned receiver it will be owned by you but you'll still pay the "additional receiver" versus the “lease fee”...unless it's your only receiver, in which case it will be listed as the primary and there will be no fee leased or not.

If it’s owned they will not replace it for free if it dies. You’ll have to bear that cost.

If you purchase an owned receiver you’ll likely have to get a new access card. You would do that through DirecTV.

Just because the seller tells you it is and owned receiver (not a lease) doesn’t mean it actually is. The most important thing is to verify it with DirecTV.

Mike

µß
Since it costs 1.66¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 3.32¢ worth.  That 3.32¢ is my own and not the 3.32¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#29 OFFLINE   carl6

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:29 AM

Here is another way to look at the lease with 2 year commitment.

Purchase to own cost: $499
Up front lease cost: $199
Early termination fee: Prorated $20/month

Owning:
If you buy to own, regardless of when you stop service your total cost is $499

Leasing:
If you begin service and stay for 24 months, your total cost is $199
If you begin service and stay for 10 months, your total cost is $199 + $300 = $499
From month 11 on, your total cost is lower.

These figures do not count for monthly charges that will be the same regardless if you own or lease.

So, if you plan on keeping service for at least 10 months, then it will cost you less to lease than to own. If you don't plan on keeping service for at least 10 months, then DirecTV probably doesn't want you as a customer to start with.

#30 OFFLINE   evan_s

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:32 AM

I have to admit it was a little weird when I was first thinking about subscribing to DirecTV. 200$ + a monthly fee for the box and you didn't own it. It does seem like a complete scam at first. The reality is that it actually ends up being much better for most people.

#1. The cost per month is the same for leased vs own boxes. It is 5$ either way it's just called a different thing on the bill.

#2. The cost per month in #1. is much lower than pretty much any other provider I've checked for an HD DVR. Dish is currently at 12$ per month for a single tv HD DVR (17 if you have 2 a tv unit) and Comcast in this area is like 16$. This means that over the 24 month commitment that comes with the HD-DVR from directv the total cost is cheaper than the alternatives and is much cheaper long term. It also isn't any higher for a HD-DVR than it is for a basic receiver so it makes HD and Dvr's every much more appealing.

So yeah, you are paying a little bit to get the boxes in the first place but once you've got them it is much cheaper long term than any other provider I've seen and it's how some of the members here have half a dozen or more HD DVRs.

#31 OFFLINE   Wisegoat

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:33 AM

The other thing that makes it a winning proposition for me is that, with cable, you are paying a lot more per month, per box.

Where I live, TimeWarner charges $30/month per HDDVR. I have 3 HDDVR's, which means my cable bill would be $90 before I pay for a lick of programming. With DirecTV's model, if I amortize that $200 acquisition fee over 8 months, once the 9th month starts, I am saving $25 monthly per box over cable ($200 divided by $25, which is the difference between a cable and DirecTV box).

We are paying a little bit more upfront for cheaper monthly costs over the long run. That is what makes it worth it to me.

That and I can't take a cable box to the river or the desert in my trailer!

#32 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:54 AM

I can buy an owned HR20/21/22/23 for under $100 on regular occasion. I just sold an owned HR21 on ebay for $200.

The HR20 I use in the living room was basically free. There was a lot of 4 receivers on craigslist for $40 including two HD DVRs. I sold the two R15s and other HR20 and kept this one, putting a nice chunk of change in my pocket along with it.

I don't understand the lease idea. I can buy an HR so cheap, then when it breaks, sell it for parts, which brings about $75 usually, and buy another cheap. I can open it and put my own hard drive in and I can shut it off and turn it on as I please. Why shell out $200 you will never see again?

#33 OFFLINE   evan_s

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 09:24 AM

I can buy an owned HR20/21/22/23 for under $100 on regular occasion. I just sold an owned HR21 on ebay for $200.

The HR20 I use in the living room was basically free. There was a lot of 4 receivers on craigslist for $40 including two HD DVRs. I sold the two R15s and other HR20 and kept this one, putting a nice chunk of change in my pocket along with it.

I don't understand the lease idea. I can buy an HR so cheap, then when it breaks, sell it for parts, which brings about $75 usually, and buy another cheap. I can open it and put my own hard drive in and I can shut it off and turn it on as I please. Why shell out $200 you will never see again?


Trying to buy a used owned receiver isn't for everyone. You have to be careful to avoid people who have leased units but think they are owned and then make sure to get them activated properly so they show up as owned. Beyond that you have to be able to self install them since you aren't getting a DirecTV install along with them.

If you can deal with all that and can find the right units to by then that's great.

#34 OFFLINE   Michael H..

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 10:19 AM

There's been ample dialogue in this and previous threads regarding the buy vs. lease pros and cons, so I'll refrain from putting in my $0.02.

The one thing I haven't seen in this thread is:

When you purchase a used receiver from a private party, not only do you need to verify with DTV that it is an "owned" and not a "leased" unit (yes, it is shocking the number of subs who don't actually know that they don't own the receiver), but just as important is to verify that there are no outstanding charges on that receiver. I'm not talking about the card. You will have to order a new card from DTV to activate the service in another (your) name, but DTV will not activate a receiver with outstanding charges to it from the previous account. Unless the previous owner uses the cash you gave him for the receiver to pay off that account, you will have to.

A couple of points:

Someone will want to comment that this isn't the case because they didn't have to, under these same circumstances. As with all things DTV, they are consistent about being inconsistent, and there are many instances where they have deviated from (DTV told me this is their) policy. Things being what they are, you can go ahead and buy, and cross your fingers.

The second is with the advent of online pay-per-view ordering, one benefit is that the program can be viewed on all of the receivers on the account, whereas when you order through the receiver via remote, the program can be viewed only on the receiver the remote is tied to. The question being, how is a receiver from that account, the one you just bought, affected. Over the years, I've given away a few receivers, all SD's, but now contemplating giving away my H10 (the remainder are HD-DVR's), now that DTV has shutoff the Ku HD programming (the RVer's know all about this... and are really pissed off). I asked DTV about this and was told that any charges tied to the receiver in question, and that would include online PPV ordering, as long as the receiver was activated on the account at the time of order, would require that account to be current, in order for another to activate that receiver. Ugh!

... exercise caution.

#35 OFFLINE   johns70

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 10:43 AM

OP - My last D* purchase was a $999 HR10-250 in 2001. I much prefer the current way of doing things.


Some people really got ripped when they bought the HR10-250. It only received about 5 or so DIRECTV HD channels, plus whatever local OTA channels they could get. A few years later when the DIRECTV HR20 and MPEG4 DIRECTV HD channels came out they couldn't use the HR10-250 for DIRECTV HD.

#36 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 11:00 AM

Allright I will type it all again:

When buying a used receiver, you have to talk to the access card distribution team NOT A FRONT LINE CSR and check THREE things.

-The receiver must be owned
-The receiver must be disconnected
-The receiver must be tied to an account in good standing, not in collections.

It doesn't matter about pay per view and a balance pending on the card. The card gets replaced, that is what holds the charge. There is a way to reuse the card, but if you are dumb enough to hook it to a phone line or internet after using that method, you will get billed for any balance on the card. It is much less of a headache just to spend the $20 for the card.

Once you are ready to activate it with your new card, ignore the paper about the automated number, call D*, and politely but firmly insist on having the access card department activate it. Don't let a front line CSR activate it. If you follow the paper and use the automated number, it has been my experience that the automated system can't handle owned receivers and it transfers you to a front line CSR. In every case, a front line CSR, called either directly or sent from the automated system has only been able to add a receiver as leased, which messes everything up.

If there is an issue like a small past due balance or something like that where the ACDT rep tells you they can make an exception and go ahead and activate it for you, my best advice is to just walk away. In all cases, when calling to confirm it can be added to your account as owned, politely ask them to notate your account and copy/paste all the information into your notes so it is ready for when you order the card. They have been doing that automatically now lately, but it is always good to ask. It has been my experience that it is helpful to get their employee ID as well, in case there is an issue later.

As mentioned by me and others, buying a used owned receiver is not for everyone. You do have to call and jump through a few hoops. You do have to know how to install it. To me personally, a few minutes on the phone is worth the $199. For others, it may not be worth it.

#37 OFFLINE   Blaze

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:04 PM

that would be good. I looked on ebay, but it didnt look like there were that many.. any other places to look? Also, when buying used, is there anything i need to be careful of?


Buy the Receiver from here then you own it..........

http://www.solidsign... Receivers&sku=

#38 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:10 PM

No, Blaze, it's leased.

Click on the Specifications tab on the linked page and you will find this in red:

As of 3/1/06 DIRECTV® now requires a 24 month commitment and all equipment must be returned to DIRECTV® if customer cancels service with DIRECTV®


hangin' with the bros at 40 Eridani A

#39 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:16 PM

Everyone needs to understand that if you purchase a DirecTV receiver from an online or brick-n-mortar retailer IT IS A LEASE.

You don't have to guess, there is no owning, it is without a doubt a lease. I'm not saying it can't be converted, although I don't know how, but once purchased from a retailer it's a lease.

The only caveat is if the receiver is an HR21Pro. That would be owned.

Mike

µß
Since it costs 1.66¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 3.32¢ worth.  That 3.32¢ is my own and not the 3.32¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#40 OFFLINE   Blaze

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:20 PM

No, Blaze, it's leased.

Click on the Specifications tab on the linked page and you will find this in red:


OK thanks for pointing this out.......

The $5 lease fee is just like a Mirror fee nothing more.

#41 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:21 PM

OK thanks for pointing this out.......

The $5 lease fee is just like a Mirror fee nothing more.

Yeah, on our bill it's either a "lease fee" or an "additional receiver fee".

Mike

µß
Since it costs 1.66¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 3.32¢ worth.  That 3.32¢ is my own and not the 3.32¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#42 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:30 PM

Yeah, on our bill it's either a "lease fee" or an "additional receiver fee".

Mike


If the bill says additional receiver then that's a purchased box.

See post My Setup for configuration info.


#43 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 05:52 PM

If the bill says additional receiver then that's a purchased box.

Yes, an important point that I left out. :D

Mike

µß
Since it costs 1.66¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 3.32¢ worth.  That 3.32¢ is my own and not the 3.32¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#44 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 08:38 PM

...I'm not saying it can't be converted, although I don't know how...


I called once before I knew all the steps I posted above and checked a RID with a front line CSR. She didn't even look it up I don't think, she just told me what I wanted to hear, that is was owned. She noted my account that I had called to check owned status on a box and noted the RID but didn't write the final conclusion.

Of course when I got it, they told me it was leased. I asked them to check the notes, I had called and check and was told it was owned. Since they couldn't find the final result they had told me, they gave me the benefit of the doubt and actually swapped it from leased to owned.

Skip ahead a little while and I get a hold of a better receiver and it is time to say goodbye to that one. I call and shut it off, and confirm that it is owned, no recover kit would be sent, and that I would not receive a non-returned equipment fee. They confirmed all of that. I put the thing on ebay, and here come the emails "D* is saying it is leased. What's the deal?" basically.

I call the ACDT. The lady is very very nice. You know how you get those friendly ones that are having a good day. :) She tells me right off it is leased. I tell her the story above and ask her to dig in my notes, and I have the badge ID of the employee and supervisor that authorized the change if needed. She very politely insists that they NEVER change it, so I ask her again to basically humor me and check the notes. We sit there silent for a minute, then she puts me on hold. Finally, like 10 minutes later, she comes back. She is no longer polite, and has a totally different tone in her voice. "Sorry for the wait, it's owned" very short and obviously not sorry. :grin: I question her more on the NR fee and recovery kit and she confirms very shortly and annoyed like that I would receive neither and that I am fine to sell it. I think she got a good chewing out or something, she was not happy.

Since then, the receiver has sold, he got a card for it, and all is well. All that to say good luck getting anything that has already been activated as a leased box ever switched over to owned. I am sure it is different for a brand new one bought as an authorized replacement for an owned box, but just keep that in mind when going the route of possibly buying one and getting a credit for it with a PP claim or something.

#45 OFFLINE   sunfire9us

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Posted 11 June 2010 - 01:17 AM

I outright purchased a HR22-100 from directv a couple years ago. I only did it to avoid being in a contract with them, I hate being in a contract with any company. When I called them to buy one I was given the option of which receiver I wanted to buy, and the HR22 being the newest at the time it is the one I chose. I have to agree with you even though I bought one, there really isn't any big advantage to owning one. Plus it cost me $499 to own it.:nono2:


How did you get lucky getting to pick which one you wanted??? Last year I also wanted to upgrade to the newest dvr yet a NEW one NOT a refurbished one. I was also like you and not interested in getting trapped in a two year contract BUT they couldnt promise I would get a new one or the new model. Paying FULL price they could atleast make it where you can get a NEW one and not some refurbished one. So I reluctantly bought a leased model. Just wished now I could call DTV and pay the $300 difference to get it changed over to a owned box. Atleast I know its a new one since I got it at BB myself. This is something DTV needs to change concerning people who do wish to buy instead of lease.

#46 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 11 June 2010 - 05:02 AM

Some people really got ripped when they bought the HR10-250. It only received about 5 or so DIRECTV HD channels, plus whatever local OTA channels they could get. A few years later when the DIRECTV HR20 and MPEG4 DIRECTV HD channels came out they couldn't use the HR10-250 for DIRECTV HD.


Some will disagree - bleeding edge technology is always in demand. not only becasue it is bleeding edge but the basic human nature of being able to brag - Lok what I got and you don't!

Gues you can say the same thing about thost that adopted the Model T over a horse drawn cart, a few years later something better, bigger and faster came out. Same with everyting




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