Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo

DirecTV Satellite Discussion (D14 up next)


  • Please log in to reply
1475 replies to this topic

#381 OFFLINE   cypherx

cypherx

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,733 posts
  • LocationPA - Berks County
Joined: Aug 27, 2010

Posted 02 December 2011 - 12:05 AM

Huh ?
The 8PSK modulation already in use those Ka bands off 99W and 103W clusters.


Oh I thought DirecTV was only using QPSK 3/4 FEC on Ka. I was wondering if they would use 8PSK Turbo FEC.

I'm just curious if there will be a throughput improvement on these new birds. Squeezing every last drop of efficiency out of each transponder, like how some birds out there are getting 8 HD channels on one tp or 70mbps. (Not DirecTV).

- > Link to my setup thread< -

My  DirecTV HD WISHLIST:  NickJR, Nicktoons, Revolt.TV, FXM, We, Oxygen, The Hub, Fuse, GSN, Sprout, GAC, Esquire, MTV2, BBC World News, Ovation, Reelz , Sundance, Up, Music Choice Play HD (formerly SWRV), Al Jazeera America, Military Channel, NASA

My DirecTV SD WISHLIST: MTV Hits, MTV Jams, Music Choice, Youtoo TV

 

---
HR24-200
H24-200


...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#382 OFFLINE   P Smith

P Smith

    Mr. FixAnything

  • Registered
  • 19,727 posts
  • LocationBay Area
Joined: Jul 25, 2002

Posted 02 December 2011 - 12:52 AM

"8PSK Turbo FEC" is proprietary dish modulation; DTV is using DVB-S2D QPSK and 8PSK modulations for Ka band [99W and 103W].

BTW, we discuss with Sixto different modulation using by DTV (here or in his main thread), so you should remember that fact].

#383 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,043 posts
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 02 December 2011 - 06:55 AM

This thread is (mostly) for talk, informed speculation and FCC filings regarding the Directv satellite constellation itself - modulation schemes are really kind of secondary to that, except the to extent that it affects overall working bandwidth and load-balancing around the fleet.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#384 OFFLINE   cypherx

cypherx

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,733 posts
  • LocationPA - Berks County
Joined: Aug 27, 2010

Posted 02 December 2011 - 09:29 AM

This thread is (mostly) for talk, informed speculation and FCC filings regarding the Directv satellite constellation itself - modulation schemes are really kind of secondary to that, except the to extent that it affects overall working bandwidth and load-balancing around the fleet.


I guess what I'm asking is that the modulation rate is completely independent of the bird going up.. correct? It can be changed at a moments notice?

So with that being said, I was curious if the new birds had better signal to noise and perhaps more power output that could, with more reliability sustain a higher order modulation while maintaining target rain fade and signal loss specifications.

- > Link to my setup thread< -

My  DirecTV HD WISHLIST:  NickJR, Nicktoons, Revolt.TV, FXM, We, Oxygen, The Hub, Fuse, GSN, Sprout, GAC, Esquire, MTV2, BBC World News, Ovation, Reelz , Sundance, Up, Music Choice Play HD (formerly SWRV), Al Jazeera America, Military Channel, NASA

My DirecTV SD WISHLIST: MTV Hits, MTV Jams, Music Choice, Youtoo TV

 

---
HR24-200
H24-200


#385 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,043 posts
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 02 December 2011 - 09:35 AM

So with that being said, I was curious if the new birds had better signal to noise and perhaps more power output that could, with more reliability sustain a higher order modulation while maintaining target rain fade and signal loss specifications.


That's not really known yet. The most recent filings are for "RB-1" and "RB-2", Directv's name for the BSS-band payloads on future satellite vehicles. Whether those payloads end up on dedicated BSS satellites or as secondary payloads on planned future Ka and/or Ku satellite vehicles is not known at this time.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#386 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,043 posts
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 06 December 2011 - 04:31 PM

Looks like Directv has applied for permission to move D1R from its current 72.5W slot to the nominal 110W slot in order to serve out its life as an on-orbit spare. Probably a good use for the old workhorse (it's over 12 years old now and definitely on it's last legs - comsats generally have 12 - 15 year design lives).

http://licensing.fcc...ment_key=928940

Edited by LameLefty, 06 December 2011 - 05:25 PM.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#387 ONLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,746 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 07 December 2011 - 10:10 PM

Probably also part of their backup plan for d10. I haven't even looked in a while if they are broadcasting anything at 110 anymore. With them canceling d13 and no new announcement of any birds to go there, its almost like they are just sitting on it to use as trade bait, or to lease it to someone else someday.

#388 OFFLINE   Davenlr

Davenlr

    Geek til I die

  • Registered
  • 9,089 posts
Joined: Sep 16, 2006

Posted 07 December 2011 - 10:14 PM

Kinda would have liked to see them use those 3 KU transponders for mpeg4 HD of the (10?) most popular HD channels, since the rainfade is much less on KU. Once they started selling the SL3's though, I figured they would never use that slot for CONUS anymore.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#389 OFFLINE   evan_s

evan_s

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,136 posts
Joined: Mar 03, 2008

Posted 07 December 2011 - 10:57 PM

Probably also part of their backup plan for d10. I haven't even looked in a while if they are broadcasting anything at 110 anymore. With them canceling d13 and no new announcement of any birds to go there, its almost like they are just sitting on it to use as trade bait, or to lease it to someone else someday.


D10 is at 103. D5 is the sat currently at 110 that was due to be replaced by the canceled D13. While both sats are already pretty old the 3 conus TPs isn't the most demanding task for a sat so they can probably cover things for a while to come.

I don't think there is anything currently on 110 but I agree that we won't see any core programing, HD included, coming from there. The SL3 pretty much seals that. I am kinda surprised that they haven't put it to use for something like international programing.

#390 OFFLINE   Davenlr

Davenlr

    Geek til I die

  • Registered
  • 9,089 posts
Joined: Sep 16, 2006

Posted 07 December 2011 - 11:06 PM

Could they use the 3 transponders there to provide LIL spotbeams to new, small markets? Or does the satellite there/moving there, not have that capability?

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#391 OFFLINE   P Smith

P Smith

    Mr. FixAnything

  • Registered
  • 19,727 posts
  • LocationBay Area
Joined: Jul 25, 2002

Posted 07 December 2011 - 11:12 PM

Current channels on 110W:
Network 2

"*DTV" 9831 8|00 - 008C 008D - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9831"
"*DTV" 9827 8|00 - 0064 0065 - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9827" "444"
"*DTV" 9828 8|00 - 006E 006F - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9828"
"*DTV" 9829 8|00 - 0078 0079 - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9829"
"*DTV" 9830 8|00 - 0082 0083 - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9830"
"*DTV" 999 8|00 - 0096 0097 - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9832"
"*DTV" 9825 8|00 - 0050 0051 - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9825"
"*DTV" 9826 8|00 - 005A 005B - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9826"
"*DTV" 9824 8|00 - 003C 003D - - "WB3 Test MPEG2" "WB3 Test MPEG2 Channel 9824"
"DTV" 9512 10|00 - 03DE 03DF - - "Satellite Test Channel, 110" "Satellite C Test Channel 110" "tv:dtv494.ch"
"*DTV" 9885 10|00 - 0014 0015 - - "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9885" "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9885" "tv:2977.ch"
"*DTV" 9886 10|00 - 000A 000B - - "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9886" "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9886" "tv:2978.ch"
"*DTV" 9889 12|00 - 000A 000B - - "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9889" "D5 110 Slide Ch. 9889" "tv:2981.ch"



#392 ONLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,746 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 08 December 2011 - 12:40 AM

D10 is at 103. D5 is the sat currently at 110 that was due to be replaced by the canceled D13. While both sats are already pretty old the 3 conus TPs isn't the most demanding task for a sat so they can probably cover things for a while to come.

I don't think there is anything currently on 110 but I agree that we won't see any core programing, HD included, coming from there. The SL3 pretty much seals that. I am kinda surprised that they haven't put it to use for something like international programing.


My point is simply if d10 where to full on fail before they get the new birds launched, they may be able to shuffle some programing to a sat at 110. Not hd, but maybe margin programing channels. Hopefully, we will never find out.

#393 OFFLINE   harsh

harsh

    Beware the Attack Basset

  • Registered
  • 18,353 posts
  • LocationSalem, OR
Joined: Jun 14, 2003

Posted 08 December 2011 - 09:02 AM

My point is simply if d10 where to full on fail before they get the new birds launched, they may be able to shuffle some programing to a sat at 110. Not hd, but maybe margin programing channels.

Pray you're within the margin.

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. -- JFK


#394 OFFLINE   evan_s

evan_s

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,136 posts
Joined: Mar 03, 2008

Posted 08 December 2011 - 03:48 PM

Could they use the 3 transponders there to provide LIL spotbeams to new, small markets? Or does the satellite there/moving there, not have that capability?


As far as I know neither the existing sat or the new sat being sent there have any spotbeam capabilities. The one they are moving was used to provide locals for the east coast but they are actually conus tps.

Should d10 fail completely prematurely I'm sure DirecTV has plans in place. I don't know how much of a role the sat(s) at 110 would play in that given the fact that what ever ended up there wouldn't be available to all the customers with SL3's but when you are suddenly short a lot of bandwidth I suppose any additional bandwidth you can manage is a good thing.

#395 ONLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,746 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 08 December 2011 - 04:15 PM

As far as I know neither the existing sat or the new sat being sent there have any spotbeam capabilities. The one they are moving was used to provide locals for the east coast but they are actually conus tps.

Should d10 fail completely prematurely I'm sure DirecTV has plans in place. I don't know how much of a role the sat(s) at 110 would play in that given the fact that what ever ended up there wouldn't be available to all the customers with SL3's but when you are suddenly short a lot of bandwidth I suppose any additional bandwidth you can manage is a good thing.


I'm thinking channels like the NASA channel, and some shopping channels and other hi 300 channels. Haven't looked in a while, but if there are any Spanish channels on 101, 103, 99 they could go there temporarily too, among other things.

The sad thing is we have to wait so long for a new sat to launch.

#396 OFFLINE   evan_s

evan_s

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,136 posts
Joined: Mar 03, 2008

Posted 08 December 2011 - 04:56 PM

While you and I might not place too much value on the shopping channels I doubt they'd be moved to 110 with the limited number of subs that can get that sat. Most, if not all of them, pay Directv to carry the channel so DirecTV doesn't want them on a sat few people can get.

For the public access/edu type channels there are actually requirements that you must carry so many of them and they can't be thrown off on a sat no one can get.

#397 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,043 posts
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 08 December 2011 - 06:51 PM

The sad thing is we have to wait so long for a new sat to launch.


Well it's not like you can just run down to Best Buy or Fry's and pick up a spare, you know. :P They take a couple years to build once you have regulatory approval, cost on the order of a quarter of a billion dollars to build and launch, and there are only a handful of launch providers who can put it up for you. And those folks are booked up a couple years in advance anyway.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#398 OFFLINE   harsh

harsh

    Beware the Attack Basset

  • Registered
  • 18,353 posts
  • LocationSalem, OR
Joined: Jun 14, 2003

Posted 08 December 2011 - 07:04 PM

Well it's not like you can just run down to Best Buy or Fry's and pick up a spare, you know. :P

Apologist rhetoric aside, construction began in Spring 2010 and launch was originally planned for Summer 2013 and was pushed out many months.

It seems like DIRECTV banked some emergency launch karma with their delayed launch last year.

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. -- JFK


#399 OFFLINE   LameLefty

LameLefty

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,043 posts
Joined: Sep 28, 2006

Posted 08 December 2011 - 07:28 PM

Apologist rhetoric aside, construction began in Spring 2010 and launch was originally planned for Summer 2013 and was pushed out many months.


Are you delusional? There was nothing either apologetic or rhetorical in my comment. Perhaps if YOU were an aerospace engineer, you might know that. As it is, you know apparently very little about the aerospace industry.

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"
Directv since 1997
Will Work for Beer


#400 ONLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,746 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 08 December 2011 - 07:58 PM

Well it's not like you can just run down to Best Buy or Fry's and pick up a spare, you know. :P They take a couple years to build once you have regulatory approval, cost on the order of a quarter of a billion dollars to build and launch, and there are only a handful of launch providers who can put it up for you. And those folks are booked up a couple years in advance anyway.


What! Why not! !rolling




spam firewall