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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Clark Howard fires DishNetwork.


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77 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 03:23 PM

A typical Clarke Howard spin, but I'm more inclined to believe that he quit rather than (not then) get fired. He lives in his own frugal little world.

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#52 OFFLINE   bnborg

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 03:30 PM

Broadband home network does not necessarily imply an internet connection, unless it is defined as such in the same contract. My 722 is connected to the same 100 Mb network that my home computers are.

My network is not connected to the internet during Mediacom's frequent service interruptions.
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#53 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 03:42 PM

How about this bit from page six? (Emphasis added.)

B. Additional Tuners and Receivers. We may choose to allow you to place additional receivers on your account. If we allow you to do so, each additional receiver will be authorized to receive the same Services as your initial receiver, subject to the limitations of your television equipment. All of your receivers must be located at the same residence and continuously connected to the same land-based telephone line and/or broadband home network. If you wish to receive Services at two different residential locations, you must open a separate account for each location, unless otherwise specifically authorized by Dish Network. You may not directly or indirectly use a single account for the purpose of authorizing Services for multiple DISH Network receivers that are not all located in the same residence and connected to the same land-based telephone line and/or broadband home network. If we later determine that you did, we may disconnect your Services and, in addition to all other applicable fees, you agree to pay us the difference between the amounts actually received by us and the full retail price for the Services authorized for each DISH Network receiver on your account.

http://www.dishnetwo...s/legal/RCA.pdf

That one is a little more clear but also states what will happen if all receivers are not located at the same location. Im not saying what he did was perfectly correct but this clearly shows that their procedure is outdated. When I recently moved it was going to cost me nearly $200 to have them wire my house for a home phone. No way am I going to do that. Cell phones are the future. With the times being tuff people are not gonna pay for both. I also mentioned earlier didnt E* offer $5 off for additional receivers having phone lines hooked to them? Sounds like a way to entice a customer to do just that. I highly doubt every tech verified a working phone line was active on the account before leaving.

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#54 OFFLINE   ggotch5445

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 03:44 PM

I'm guessing that the multiple receiver part of this, is the main issue here.

When I was considering getting Dish, I was concerned about connecting my main receiver to either a phone line, or the internet, as I did not feel that I had an easy connection to either from my home theater room.

My installer, whom I feel was very up front, and truthful, said that not connecting, to either of these options, would only be a problem if I wanted to order ppv movies, from the receiver, or needed diagnostics done, in real time, by Dish. The only item Dish imposed for not having the connection(s)was the $5 charge for TV2, which was regularly credited by virtue of having the particular package I have.

All that I have heard, or read (including the "encouragement" to get connected to a phone line in my receiver's manual), has suggested that the ethernet/phone connection was not an absolute requirement to be a Dish subscriber.

In any event, if Dish provided my 722 with a wireless LAN adapter, for my home network, I would have no objection to "hooking up". I simply never did it because it wasn't a quick, simple, cost-free task to do.

#55 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 03:51 PM

I'm guessing that the multiple receiver part of this, is the main issue here.

When I was considering getting Dish, I was concerned about connecting my main receiver to either a phone line, or the internet, as I did not feel that I had an easy connection to either from my home theater room.

My installer, whom I feel was very up front, and truthful, said that not connecting, to either of these options, would only be a problem if I wanted to order ppv movies, from the receiver, or needed diagnostics done, in real time, by Dish. The only item Dish imposed for not having the connection(s)was the $5 charge for TV2, which was regularly credited by virtue of having the particular package I have.

All that I have heard, or read (including the "encouragement" to get connected to a phone line in my receiver's manual), has suggested that the ethernet/phone connection was not an absolute requirement to be a Dish subscriber.

In any event, if Dish provided my 722 with a wireless LAN adapter, for my home network, I would have no objection to "hooking up". I simply never did it because it wasn't a quick, simple, cost-free task to do.

Thats the point right there. If you want something like this to be a requirement then give customers a reason to want to do it. In the past it was a $5 discount but that is not worth it to some. Now D* came up with the ultimate way to do it. I bet D* is having more receivers dial in now then ever before and it will only get better with having the MRV option. E* is not overly worried about people watching tv from somewhere other then their home they pay for service or they would not be offering a slingloaded reciever.

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#56 OFFLINE   jadebox

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 04:00 PM

If the unnamed "other provider" he's using now is DirecTV, I hope Howard read their Customer Agreement. :-)

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#57 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 04:34 PM

That one is a little more clear but also states what will happen if all receivers are not located at the same location.

Parse the words correctly ... the receivers must be at the same residential location AND connected to the same phone line. Violate either and one has violated the terms of the contract.

DISH offers a discount to people who have multiple receivers. Instead of having a separate account for each receiver one can (at DISH's option) place additional receivers on one account. Even with the most expensive receivers this discount can save a customer $90 per additional receiver.


I also mentioned earlier didn't E* offer $5 off for additional receivers having phone lines hooked to them? Sounds like a way to entice a customer to do just that. I highly doubt every tech verified a working phone line was active on the account before leaving.

The discount was given if receivers "phoned home". If the dual tuner receivers failed to phone home the discount for each of those receivers would be removed.

Failure to enforce in the past doesn't change the fact the rule exists. As Mr Howard noted, this recent call was his second contact from the audit team. They had enforced the phone line rule on his account before. And there are posts on DBSTalk going back before I joined complaining about the audit team.

The rule is nothing new. The enforcement is nothing new.

#58 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 06:12 PM

The rule is nothing new. The enforcement is nothing new.


I think we are in agreement James. He did violate the terms to a degree and E* verified they have severly oudated terms. I do have to ask though what your thoughts are on this. So he had 5 receivers. Does E* want to flip the bill to run phone lines to all those rooms or ethernet cables? Give some options. Its not cheap to have the phone company do it. Its not cheap to buy wireless phone jacks to do it yourself and its not always easy to just wire it up yourself either. If its a requirement that it has to be done then offer a way to get it done. The only way I currently think E* offers to do that is the wireless phone jacks. Here is the link: http://www.dishnetwo...es/default.aspx

$39.99 for a setup of one receiver. Then you would need the additional add on's for the other 4 receivers. Sounds like alot of customer cost to me. Offer something like MRV for a fee that takes care of it. I also didnt hear a response to E* not being overly concerned about its customers watching tv from somewhere other then their own home since they are now offering slingloaded receivers. Seems a but unfair really. I for one am glad to say that I am not a Dish Network customer!

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#59 OFFLINE   PEARLTONE

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 06:16 PM

That one is a little more clear but also states what will happen if all receivers are not located at the same location. Im not saying what he did was perfectly correct but this clearly shows that their procedure is outdated. When I recently moved it was going to cost me nearly $200 to have them wire my house for a home phone. No way am I going to do that. Cell phones are the future. With the times being tuff people are not gonna pay for both. I also mentioned earlier didnt E* offer $5 off for additional receivers having phone lines hooked to them? Sounds like a way to entice a customer to do just that. I highly doubt every tech verified a working phone line was active on the account before leaving.

thank you sir well said

you cant have a phone line in every room, and some people dont have an internet line in their home, if they own a laptop with wireless service so how the hell are you going to have them hooked up, i have a buddy who gets phone calls about it all the time, all he tells them is "send the phone company here to hook everything up, pay the bill, and i will hook up the line"

#60 OFFLINE   scooper

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 06:29 PM

I object strenously to the "it's too expensive to run phone lines / ethernet to every room I want a receiver in". It is just NOT that hard - because you have to run coax to all those rooms as well. If you don't want to pay the freight - then don't get the extra receivers. Simple.
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#61 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 07:17 PM

I have a phone line and wired ethernet near enough to use at every receiver location. It is possible.

#62 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 07:48 PM

Saying "may result" instead of "will result" allows Dish the leeway to not kick someone off IF that person complies with the audit. Otherwise, there would be no point in an audit, and as soon as you weren't connected to the phone line then Dish would just automatically kick you out.

This means, if your power was out and your phone was out... bye bye Dish.

The "may result" allows for discretion if the person can pass the audit and/or connects the receivers again.

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#63 OFFLINE   scooper

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 08:13 PM

If criminals can be monitored with ankle bracelets I'm sure there is other technology for the providers to use. Part of our monthly fees are used for research and developement. The answer lies there.


I didn't ask "What Dish should do" - I asked "What would YOU DO in this situation". I'm waiting for an answer that doesn't involve phoneline, internet or an audit team like they are doing now, and is readily adaptable / inexpensive to implement to all those legacy receivers.
You CAN put antennas on your owned and/or controlled property...

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#64 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 08:52 PM

Suggestions and company policies are different things. I think you need to learn the difference.



Not me I know the difference that's why all my Dishnetwork receivers are connected.:)

#65 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 09:33 PM

After reading the article again and so many standing firm on what the terms of service are, why does the article say E* reactivated the receivers? If its the rules wouldn't they just say no till he hooked up a phone line? If E* themselves are not gonna uphold the standard why herass people about it then? Sounds like a big waste of time & a great way to tick off a good customer.

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#66 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 01:30 AM

After reading the article again and so many standing firm on what the terms of service are, why does the article say E* reactivated the receivers? If its the rules wouldn't they just say no till he hooked up a phone line? If E* themselves are not gonna uphold the standard why herass people about it then? Sounds like a big waste of time & a great way to tick off a good customer.

Disobeying the contract "may result" in disconnection and/or being charged full price for services. (Yes, if DISH determines that the receivers are in separate locations they can bill for a full price subscription for each receiver.)

DISH is in no way obligated to permanently disconnect the receivers. It is their option.

BTW: How does this affect you? Have you ever had your receivers disconnected by DISH for not being connected to a phone line? As noted in an early post in this thread, I have. (Wiring problems, not non-compliance.) The people in this thread who have accepted the terms of the contract seem to understand what it means.

#67 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 07:34 AM

After reading the article again and so many standing firm on what the terms of service are, why does the article say E* reactivated the receivers? If its the rules wouldn't they just say no till he hooked up a phone line? If E* themselves are not gonna uphold the standard why harass people about it then? Sounds like a big waste of time & a great way to tick off a good customer.



The only way to know, is hope Clark Howard signs up for DirecTV,then we will see what a "good customer" he is.:eek2::rolleyes:

"Uh sorry Mr.Howard you know that DVR we had to replace a few months ago"?."Well it looks like your now under a new 24 month contract"!.:contract:;)

#68 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 07:36 AM

The only way to know, is hope Clark Howard signs up for DirecTV,then we will see what a "good customer" he is.:eek2::rolleyes:

"Uh sorry Mr.Howard you know that DVR we had to replace a few months ago"?."Well it looks like your now under a new 24 month contract"!.:contract:;)


They say sorry now? :hurah:
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#69 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 07:40 AM

They say sorry now? :hurah:



Yea I know I stretched it a bit.;):D

#70 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 12:27 PM

Disobeying the contract "may result" in disconnection and/or being charged full price for services. (Yes, if DISH determines that the receivers are in separate locations they can bill for a full price subscription for each receiver.)

DISH is in no way obligated to permanently disconnect the receivers. It is their option.

BTW: How does this affect you? Have you ever had your receivers disconnected by DISH for not being connected to a phone line? As noted in an early post in this thread, I have. (Wiring problems, not non-compliance.) The people in this thread who have accepted the terms of the contract seem to understand what it means.


You didnt answer the question. If its the rules then why reactivate the receivers? You all were so bent on the fact that Clark violated terms of service agreement. If he did then E* is not putting alot of emphasis on following the rules if they just reactivate them. There seemed to be a constant he didnt follow what the rules are. If you are gonna say he didnt then you have to say E* didnt either.

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#71 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 12:30 PM

The only way to know, is hope Clark Howard signs up for DirecTV,then we will see what a "good customer" he is.:eek2::rolleyes:

"Uh sorry Mr.Howard you know that DVR we had to replace a few months ago"?."Well it looks like your now under a new 24 month contract"!.:contract:;)


A replacement does not start a new 2 year commitment. It does happen by accident from time to time but there is no audit department houding people calling them a thief. If I ever have to have one replaced I will be following up on it within the next week. Any errors will get corrected fast.

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#72 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 12:45 PM

You didnt answer the question. If its the rules then why reactivate the receivers? You all were so bent on the fact that Clark violated terms of service agreement. If he did then E* is not putting alot of emphasis on following the rules if they just reactivate them. There seemed to be a constant he didnt follow what the rules are. If you are gonna say he didnt then you have to say E* didnt either.


You seem to be having a comprehension problem with the terms & conditions.

"Failure to connect may result..." so, Dish has it in their discretion to decide what to do.

IF this was the first time Mr Howard had been found in violation, and he did pass the audit on the phone... then Dish usually reactivates the receivers and drops the issue.

IF it keeps happening, then they would start to suspect something else going on... and likely would not keep reactivating the receivers if they continued to be not-connected to phone lines.

Why do police sometimes issue warnings instead of always writing tickets for moving violations? Because sometimes they pull over a person who isn't a repeat offender, and the person seems to understand the mistake OR be genuinely unaware of the specific violation... and the officer has it in his discretion to apply the law 100% literally, or issue a warning.

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#73 OFFLINE   joshjr

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 12:58 PM

[quote name='Stewart Vernon']You seem to be having a comprehension problem with the terms & conditions.

"Failure to connect may result..." so, Dish has it in their discretion to decide what to do.

[QUOTE]

I would have to say that the agreement terms are also a little wishy washy. That first section says for optimal viewing or something of that nature. Then below it acts as though its required. The point about E* wasnt that they could turn it back on it was that the rule said he needed a phone line. He obviously did not have one on before during and after the call but yet they chose to turn it back on again anyways. I didnt read that it said he was going to add phone lines. If it is against the rules then its against the rules. As for your cop comparison then I would have to say if someone got pulled over for speeding and did or didnt get a ticket either way but got back in their car and the driver sped off again speeding right that second do you think the cop would give them a ticket to enforce their position?

It appeared to me that Clark had no intention of hooking phone lines to the receivers. So its pretty simple E* either accepted that fact and said okay which it appeared they did or they say no and do not reactivate them. What part of that dont you get?

Also if he is a repeat offender for this then why again did they agree to turn the receivers back on. The only reason I jumped on this was all the E* lovers seemed so quick to say that Clark did something wrong. If its wrong then E*'s policy is to say okay and turn them back on? I guess they told him didnt they. They told him what the requirements were and he said im not going to do it and they said okay and reactivated them again.

Edited by joshjr, 05 August 2010 - 01:05 PM.

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#74 OFFLINE   DoyleS

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 01:15 PM

I have 2 connected via internet and 1 connected by phone and 1 not connected at all. No problem with an audit call unless they get my wife instead of me. She would never be able to get the Home Theater fired up to be able to read back the numbers although that receiver is connected via internet. In an audit do they check all receivers or just those not connected?
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#75 OFFLINE   scooper

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 01:44 PM

Your example is why I have it super easy setup for my wife - all she has to do is turn on TV then cycle through the channels until she finds the right one. (and the right remote for that receiver).

Doyle - it would be best to get them all connected somehow, as I think they go through all of them, and they don't give her time to call you . I would also consider doing a setup that she just turns on the TV /satellite receiver and either flips through inputs or changes channels to find that one. IF you can - I'd even consider a Harmony remote that can auto turn on everything needed with an easy to use macro :D

Edited by scooper, 05 August 2010 - 01:51 PM.

You CAN put antennas on your owned and/or controlled property...

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html




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