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DirecTV & Dish Network HD Channel Lineup Comparison


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352 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   Syzygy

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 09:51 AM

I've appended a link to this table to 3 of my sigs: here, AVS and TiVoCommunity.
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DirecTV & Dish HD Channel Spreadsheet
DirecTV & Dish HD Channels Listed by Package

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#52 OFFLINE   pfp

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 09:55 AM

I'm having a difficult time seeing which channel goes with the results. It may help to have alternating background color on the channel names to make it easier. Alternatively, placing the results before the channel name would probably work just as well too.
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#53 OFFLINE   allargon

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 10:18 AM

Might you rename Cinema HD to PPV? The name Cinema implies a linear movie channel which PPV clearly is not.

#54 OFFLINE   la24philly

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 10:41 AM

espn full court is on directv you have it on your list as not carried its on their site.

#55 OFFLINE   QuickDrop

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 10:56 AM

Since you include PPV, Part-time RSNs, and RSN alternatives, doesn't it also make sense to include the 57 1 movie HD channels that E* counts as well as DirecTV's equivalent selection?

Many providers use "On-Demand" not linear channels to provide most of their PPV content. If you want to be fair across the board it seems only right to include them.

#56 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 11:02 AM

espn full court is on directv you have it on your list as not carried its on their site.


Yes, but is it in HD? It's not about whether or not they have it at all, but if they carry it in HD. Full Court is not something I am very familiar with. So, if both DirecTV and Dish customers can confirm if Full Court is available in HD...we'll get it right on the list.
DTV = Digital Television

#57 OFFLINE   dcowboy7

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:14 PM

Arent we only counting full time channels ?

So to me combining the fulltime/parttime RSNs in 1 line is confusing.

Also the final total # doesnt match when adding the columns #s then.

#58 OFFLINE   ShawnL25

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:18 PM

Since you include PPV, Part-time RSNs, and RSN alternatives, doesn't it also make sense to include the 57 1 movie HD channels that E* counts as well as DirecTV's equivalent selection?

Many providers use "On-Demand" not linear channels to provide most of their PPV content. If you want to be fair across the board it seems only right to include them.


But then what do you say. Directv has 500 HD VOD selections, Dish has 502 HD VOD Selections. Both providers have lots of programming in HD. If you factor in Comcast they say they have 10,000 choices. You them come to find out that sme of them are 2 min. clips. Best to just leave out VOD all together.

#59 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:19 PM

Missing Channels:
Univision HD
Telefutura HD
(These are national HD feeds along with Galavision in DISH's "AT200" package.)
Also - DISH has a HD Sports PPV channel and Hustler TV HD.

Have I missed the post that explains the math?
65+24+30+29+37+3+1=189 not 161 (28 channels)
78+27+26+10+21+1=163 not 128 (35 channels)

#60 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:40 PM

Missing Channels:
Univision HD
Telefutura HD
(These are national HD feeds along with Galavision in DISH's "AT200" package.)
Also - DISH has a HD Sports PPV channel and Hustler TV HD.

Have I missed the post that explains the math?
65+24+30+29+37+3+1=189 not 161 (28 channels)
78+27+26+10+21+1=163 not 128 (35 channels)


It is in the process of being fixed.
DTV = Digital Television

#61 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:02 PM

Arent we only counting full time channels ?

So to me combining the fulltime/parttime RSNs in 1 line is confusing.

Also the final total # doesnt match when adding the columns #s then.


Well, as of right now, we are going to count both full-time and part-time. If it is available in HD, we'll count it. We'll color code them differently based on full-time/part-time. Of course, this is all subject to change based on feedback.
DTV = Digital Television

#62 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:04 PM

BTW...I have fixed the majority of the math in the master copy (has not been posted yet, so the one in the first post is still wrong). The grand totals are correct in my copy, but not the category totals. The formulas were shifted as some point when I was making formatting changes. I just have to go through and correct those. That will come later.

So, until I post the correct version the one listed in the first post has fuzzy math.
DTV = Digital Television

#63 OFFLINE   QuickDrop

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:45 PM

Thank you !... The AVS "policy" to exclude these type of National HD Networks makes no sense in today's multi-distribution landscape....And thus, results in an incomplete/misleading look at national HD distribution...

ESPN Monday Night Football games get broadcast/over-the-air affiliates' distribution every week in the 2 teams home markets, yet I don't see AVS excluding ESPN from their List....I'm sure there are many other examples out there....


It makes sense in that:

a.) They are not intended as national channels. They are local channels offered nationally by one provider.

b.) They are full time channels only if the one subscribes to at least three separate sport packages and even then some NFL related programming get blacked out. Imagine if you subscribed to HBO or Showtime and then found out you had to pay $450 more per year to get their best original programming.

c.) Except for a subset of DirecTV subscribers, very few pay television subscribers think of them when the phrase "National HD" is used.

d.) They are better included as it relates to individual MLB, NBA, and NHL packages and how many HD games each provider has.

#64 OFFLINE   QuickDrop

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:55 PM

But then what do you say. Directv has 500 HD VOD selections, Dish has 502 HD VOD Selections. Both providers have lots of programming in HD. If you factor in Comcast they say they have 10,000 choices. You them come to find out that sme of them are 2 min. clips. Best to just leave out VOD all together.


That's my point though. He's already counting part time channels as channels. Also this whole idea got started because the OP thought RSNs chould be counted as national channels at AVS Forum, saying cable could offer them if they wanted. The same logic should then apply to PPV. Different providers offer PPVs differently; DirecTV shouldn't get extra-credit for offering them in a way that counts as linear channels.

#65 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:58 PM

One of the goals I had when I started my list a couple of years ago was in explaining the count given by the providers ... I'd like people to look at the list and be able to say "oh, that is where they are getting that number". It gets difficult when providers claim different numbers for each other's services so I've broken away from that a little and gone on a "like channel" comparison.

All the channels in AT250 vs all the channels in Choice Ultimate (both packages being the highest basic package before adding all the premium movie channels) seems to be a fairly good place to draw the "Standard HD" line ... even though TMC and Encore are offered at that level they are offered equally so it really doesn't make that much difference.

All the channels in AEP (America's Everything Package) vs all the channels in Premier brings in the premium channels and on DirecTV the sports package channels.

Then I list the Platinum HD and Extra HD packages ... they are mostly basic channels but could be considered premiums. For 10 months DISH included their Platinum HD with regular HD service ... now it is separate again. I suppose they could go into a "Plus" category but I don't like putting them into the "Standard HD" category. They are separate enough that they need recognition.

And that is usually where I draw the line ... PPVs come after that and part-times. Since DirecTV pulls counted PPV channels to create part-time sports channels their PPV (DirecTV Cinema) count changes on a daily basis. Are there 37 PPV Cinema channels on DirecTV today? Probably not. So instead of changing the count every time Sixto notes a PPV channel being assigned to or from sports I leave them all counted as PPV channels. DISH does not reduce their PPV (DISH Cinema) channels for their part-time sports. They have dedicated channels set aside for that content. Unfortunately they only have 12 channels set aside for their 26 RSNs and any other part-time sports content so from a "bandwidth" standpoint I can't count all of their 26 RSNs ... but they claim them so going back to the first rule (explaining what channels the providers are counting) I list them with the capacity note.

Alternate channels. That's the real mess. If you add DirecTV's alternate channels into a count without reducing their PPV count I would consider it misleading. The same would go for DISH as their alternate sports channels are the same 12 channel max capacity listed for RSNs. DirecTV has wisely chosen not to count those channels so I'll follow their lead. (The exception would be the Sports PPV channel, which shares space with DISH's channel 101.)

Sports packages ... good to note but don't change the counts. They are mirrors of other channels not separate channels.

Channels neither provider carries. I don't see the point. If it is a channel that IS carried in SD then listing it makes some sense as people may look for their favorite channel and want to see it listed - even if it is only in red. But channels not carried on either provider in SD? I probably wouldn't bother.

#66 OFFLINE   dcowboy7

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:59 PM

Well, as of right now, we are going to count both full-time and part-time. If it is available in HD, we'll count it. We'll color code them differently based on full-time/part-time. Of course, this is all subject to change based on feedback.


Yep im just saying that instead of having 1 line say ft/pt rsns=30 i would have 1 line be ft rsns=27 & a 2nd line pt rsns=3 instead of lumping them all in together....kinda like how the alternates have a seperate line to themselves.


edit:
yep the topbox #s -- u got it good now -- thx.

Edited by dcowboy7, 27 August 2010 - 02:38 PM.


#67 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:07 PM

Yep im just saying that instead of having 1 line say ft/pt rsns=30 i would have 1 line be ft rsns=27 & a 2nd line pt rsns=3 instead of lumping them all in together....kinda like how the alternates have a seperate line to themselves.


Do you mean a separate line at the top...where the totals are? I could separate full-time and part-time there and just keep them combined in the list.
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#68 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:11 PM

Channels that are available, but not carried by either provider will remain in the list. They will serve as reference for what is still out there waiting to be picked up by either carrier. Upcoming (not yet launched) channels will also remain in the list as well. I think people like to know that channel XYZ has announced a future HD launch.
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#69 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:21 PM

I just posted another updated. I have not yet added Univision HD, Telefutura HD, Galavision, the DISH HD Sports PPV channel, Hustler TV HD. Those will come in the next update.

Am I missing anything else?

Dcowboy7...I changed the top of the list to include those separate lines.

Also, the last few updates have incorporated a two-tone color scheme for blue, red, and green to give them a bit more pop.
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#70 OFFLINE   QuickDrop

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:22 PM

Channels neither provider carries. I don't see the point. If it is a channel that IS carried in SD then listing it makes some sense as people may look for their favorite channel and want to see it listed - even if it is only in red. But channels not carried on either provider in SD? I probably wouldn't bother.


Assuming that the hope of this list is to accurately describe to potential satellite subscribers what each provider offers, I think it's a good idea to include the status of channels neither provider has. People might have read about them somewhere and are interested. A definitive "NO" on the chart is better than having it missing altogether. That way they don't have to wonder whether something was missed.

#71 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:23 PM

It makes sense in that:

a.) They are not intended as national channels. They are local channels offered nationally by one provider.

More than one provider offers them nationally ... but they are intended for regional audiences - just like regional affiliates of broadcast networks are intended for their own markets.

b.) They are full time channels only if the one subscribes to at least three separate sport packages and even then some NFL related programming get blacked out. Imagine if you subscribed to HBO or Showtime and then found out you had to pay $450 more per year to get their best original programming.

IIRC the channels themselves are still blacked out and one must find the games on channels dedicated to the sports package in question. So to watch all of the content on a distant RSN one would have to find it across several channels that would change on a daily basis.

c.) Except for a subset of DirecTV subscribers, very few pay television subscribers think of them when the phrase "National HD" is used.

True. Everyone who does a fair count creates a special place for them. The argument is over whether or not they count. I don't recall anyone listing them all as "Standard HD" channels like ESPN. Even those who count them count them with an asterisk.

d.) They are better included as it relates to individual MLB, NBA, and NHL packages and how many HD games each provider has.

Which puts them in a category to be noted but not counted.

The primary issue to remember with the AVS list is that it is not focused on satellite. Satellite companies DO carry RSNs nationwide. I won't fault a person without satellite for not considering RSNs as nationwide carried channels. But I will remain cautious in how I count them.

#72 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:25 PM

They count on the list here. AVS can choose not to count them. They are national channels featuring regional sports. There is much more to offer from RSN's beyond professional sports.
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#73 OFFLINE   woj027

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:41 PM

Maybe CSN Philadelphia and CSN Northwest (possibly others) should be added (neither carries at this point).


Yea these two RSN's are out there, just not on DirecTV or Dish.

#74 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:48 PM

They count on the list here. AVS can choose not to count them. They are national channels featuring regional sports. There is much more to offer from RSN's beyond professional sports.

Agreed ... and that's why I put them in with the premiums where DirecTV places them instead of as a complete footnote. Full time channels "counted".

#75 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:51 PM

Maybe CSN Philadelphia and CSN Northwest (possibly others) should be added (neither carries at this point).

Yea these two RSN's are out there, just not on DirecTV or Dish.

Those two may be the only truly "regional" sports networks until the FCC forces them to allow carriage. They may end up being offered like SportsSouth or Cox Sports New Orleans.




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