Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

DIRECTV HD Channel Anticipation (Official Q4 2010 Thread)


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
4033 replies to this topic

#2226 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 32,430 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 09 November 2010 - 10:00 AM

Peerhaps on November 17.

Thanks.

If so....we should be seeing Sixto "signs" soon (say that fast 3 times). :D
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

...Ads Help To Support This Site...

#2227 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,617 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 November 2010 - 10:16 AM

1440x1920 is only a video format used for some recording devices. Regardless how a program was filmed on video, network feeds themselves are either 1280x720 or 1920x1080. The actual ATSC standards are what matter here. The ATSC digital television standard for 1080i is defined as 1920x1080.

http://www.atsc.org/...x.php/standards

The Advanced Television Systems Committee, Inc., is an international, non-profit organization developing voluntary standards for digital television. The ATSC member organizations represent the broadcast, broadcast equipment, motion picture, consumer electronics, computer, cable, satellite, and semiconductor industries.

Specifically, ATSC is working to coordinate television standards among different communications media focusing on digital television, interactive systems, and broadband multimedia communications. ATSC is also developing digital television implementation strategies and presenting educational seminars on the ATSC standards.

ATSC was formed in 1982 by the member organizations of the Joint Committee on InterSociety Coordination (JCIC): the Electronic Industries Association (EIA), the Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers (IEEE), the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB), the National Cable Telecommunications Association (NCTA), and the Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers (SMPTE). ATSC members represent the broadcast, broadcast equipment, motion picture, consumer electronics, computer, cable, satellite, and semiconductor industries.


HD-Lite is the downsampling of an HD feed. All 1080i feeds received by Dish Network are 1920x1080. They choose to downsample them to 1440x1080, compress them to a greater degree than DirecTV, and ramp that bitrate down...all of which results in degraded PQ.

Now that we have settled that...back to anticipating.
DTV = Digital Television

#2228 OFFLINE   ejjames

ejjames

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 896 posts
Joined: Oct 02, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 10:22 AM

!280x720 is progressive, this 1440i is hogwash! Why we ever approved any interlaced standard in this day and age is beyond me. However, that's a topic for another day.
Former USSB uplink operator.

USSB from '95 to '99

DirecTv since '95

#2229 OFFLINE   MysteryMan

MysteryMan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 7,370 posts
  • LocationUSA
Joined: May 17, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 10:28 AM

:sleeping:
DIRECTV customer since 1995.

#2230 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 32,430 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 09 November 2010 - 10:31 AM

:sleeping:

Yup.

Perhaps one more try... :shrug:

:backtotop
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#2231 OFFLINE   domingos35

domingos35

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 536 posts
Joined: Jan 11, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:31 AM

Dish does what? I didn't know Dish had any channels broadcast in 1920x1080 resolution...SD+ doesn't count as HD.


Does care about what customers want:lol:

#2232 OFFLINE   domingos35

domingos35

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 536 posts
Joined: Jan 11, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:33 AM

I am sure enjoying espnu.


and i am enjoying BBC HD ,AMC HD, NATGW HD :D

#2233 OFFLINE   sigma1914

sigma1914

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,405 posts
  • LocationAllen, TX
Joined: Sep 05, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:36 AM

Does care about what customers want:lol:


and i am enjoying BBC HD ,AMC HD, NATGW HD :D


Posted Image
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#2234 OFFLINE   domingos35

domingos35

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 536 posts
Joined: Jan 11, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:37 AM

Wrong. Dish Network picture quality suffers not only from HD-lite, but heavier compression and lower bitrates as well.


and this coming from a fanboy!!! funny:rolleyes:

#2235 OFFLINE   Hutchinshouse

Hutchinshouse

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 4,632 posts
Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:39 AM

and i am enjoying BBC HD ,AMC HD, NATGW HD :D


Oh yeah, we have more PPVHD channels than you. :P :bang

Wanna trade? I’ll give ya 41 PPVHD channels for those 3 HD channels. :lol:

#2236 OFFLINE   ccsoftball7

ccsoftball7

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 354 posts
Joined: Apr 02, 2003

Posted 09 November 2010 - 12:36 PM

Oh yeah, we have more PPVHD channels than you. :P :bang

Wanna trade? I’ll give ya 41 PPVHD channels for those 3 HD channels. :lol:


I already have them too..at least 2 of them (via TWC). ;)

#2237 OFFLINE   Tulsacoker

Tulsacoker

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 91 posts
Joined: Jun 01, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:07 PM

Good, maybe we can put this HD-lite BS to bed. :bang

If 1280x720 is HD, how the heck can 1440x1080 not be HD? :shrug:

It’s all about clarity.


1440x1080 = 1,555,200 (pixels)
1280x720 = 921,600 (pixels)

If 1280x720 is HD, how can 1440x1080 not be?


The 1080 is interlaced, where only half the pixels are shown (755k) where as 720p all 921k pixles are shown at once. That's why 1920 x 1080i is the HD format (1,037k pixels are shown at any given moment)
DirecTV subscriber since June 1996

#2238 OFFLINE   Curtis0620

Curtis0620

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,473 posts
Joined: Apr 22, 2002

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:14 PM

and i am enjoying BBC HD ,AMC HD, NATGW HD :D


Nothing on any of those channels worth losing ESPNU, ESPNNEWS, DISNEY, ABC FAM, & full time HD RSN's

#2239 OFFLINE   Alan Gordon

Alan Gordon

    Chancellor

  • Registered
  • 9,081 posts
  • LocationDawson, Georgia
Joined: Jun 07, 2004

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:23 PM

Nothing on any of those channels worth losing ESPNU, ESPNNEWS, DISNEY, ABC FAM, & full time HD RSN's


To each their own....

I'd swap ESPNU, ESPN News, Disney Channel, and full time HD-RSNs for AMC HD and BBC America HD in a heartbeat... :)

~Alan

#2240 OFFLINE   cypherx

cypherx

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,169 posts
  • LocationPA - Berks County
Joined: Aug 27, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:41 PM

The 1080 is interlaced, where only half the pixels are shown (755k) where as 720p all 921k pixles are shown at once. That's why 1920 x 1080i is the HD format (1,037k pixels are shown at any given moment)


I know what your saying about it being interlaced, but the screen is drawn so fast, how can the human eye perceive a lesser quality image from 1440x1080 vs 704x480 (SD) ?

Even 3D looks pretty convincing, because each eye is blanked out so fast in the shutter glasses, that your brain just morphs them together. Also look at a light bulb. It's actually turning on and off 60 times a second due to 60 Hz AC wave. I bet it looks like a steady glow of light to your eyes, I know it does to mine.

#2241 OFFLINE   Tulsacoker

Tulsacoker

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 91 posts
Joined: Jun 01, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:51 PM

I know what your saying about it being interlaced, but the screen is drawn so fast, how can the human eye perceive a lesser quality image from 1440x1080 vs 704x480 (SD) ?

Even 3D looks pretty convincing, because each eye is blanked out so fast in the shutter glasses, that your brain just morphs them together. Also look at a light bulb. It's actually turning on and off 60 times a second due to 60 Hz AC wave. I bet it looks like a steady glow of light to your eyes, I know it does to mine.


One should see a better image on the 1440 x 1080i vs. the 704 x 480i in your analogy. Yes the "screen is drawn" very fast but where you can tell the difference is in the details. Especially on larger displays.
DirecTV subscriber since June 1996

#2242 OFFLINE   lparsons21

lparsons21

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 3,686 posts
  • LocationHerrin, IL
Joined: Mar 04, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:54 PM

Wrong. Dish Network picture quality suffers not only from HD-lite, but heavier compression and lower bitrates as well.


All nice technical reasons. But I've had both D* and E* and while I can tell the difference, I would be hard pressed to say one was better than the other, and even then it would be minimally better.

Lloyd
Receiver/Provider: Tivo Roamio Plus/Mediacom
HDTV : Mitsi WD-73742 73" 3D DLP
Surround: Denon AVR-2113ci 7.1 Setup

 


#2243 OFFLINE   Jason Whiddon

Jason Whiddon

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,282 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:02 PM

It's fairly easy for me to tell the difference, and Directv does look better. Why is this being discussed here again?
65" VT50 / BDP-S7200
Denon AVR-4520CI
Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
Directv HR44-200 / HR24-500

 


#2244 OFFLINE   sigma1914

sigma1914

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,405 posts
  • LocationAllen, TX
Joined: Sep 05, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:26 PM

It's fairly easy for me to tell the difference, and Directv does look better. Why is this being discussed here again?


I think it's due to continued trolling by some Dish subs.
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#2245 OFFLINE   Jason Whiddon

Jason Whiddon

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,282 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:30 PM

Man, I sure hope the time around 11/17 at least brings some news. Luckily, I just bought a Roku XDS, so Im enjoying Luther, Top Gear and Walking Dead in nice HD.
65" VT50 / BDP-S7200
Denon AVR-4520CI
Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
Directv HR44-200 / HR24-500

 


#2246 OFFLINE   mdavej

mdavej

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,286 posts
Joined: Jan 30, 2007

Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:53 PM

It's fairly easy for me to tell the difference, and Directv does look better. Why is this being discussed here again?

I can't tell any difference on my 60" screen from 10'. HD-lite is a non-issue for me because it beats the heck out of SD and is indistinguishable from full HD (to my middle-aged eyes anyway). The fact remains that Dish has many of the most anticipated channels with excellent PQ. If those are more important to you than certain RSN's and ST, then you should switch.

Die-hard D* loyalists are never going to be swayed no matter how much Dish subs gloat about having all the channels they want (call it trolling if you wish). So it's really pointless to keep posting about it in this thread.

I guess we keep rehashing it because there's not much else to talk about. What I don't understand is why those who are perfectly content with their D* channel lineup continue to post in this thread. They have nothing to anticipate.

#2247 OFFLINE   DaveC27

DaveC27

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 266 posts
Joined: Apr 14, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:55 PM

Man, I sure hope the time around 11/17 at least brings some news. Luckily, I just bought a Roku XDS, so Im enjoying Luther, Top Gear and Walking Dead in nice HD.


Being a week away tomorrow hopefully we might see some testing, but SR's silence I suspect not :confused:

#2248 OFFLINE   Jason Whiddon

Jason Whiddon

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,282 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 03:00 PM

For me, it's like comparing mpeg4 sat locals on Directv vs OTA. Directv looks good, but I can see a softness when comparing to OTA. Same goes for Dish vs Directv. As soon as I hit 50"'s, it started getting easier for me to see. At Satguys, the huge pro Dish site, many of the old timers that have recently switched have noted the same thing. I've been arguing the point for 2 years now, and it's good to see that others are starting to speak up.


Anyways, Ill listen to my recommendation and drop the subject. Cmon Satracer, give us some news!
65" VT50 / BDP-S7200
Denon AVR-4520CI
Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
Directv HR44-200 / HR24-500

 


#2249 OFFLINE   Jason Whiddon

Jason Whiddon

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,282 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2006

Posted 09 November 2010 - 03:00 PM

Being a week away tomorrow hopefully we might see some testing, but SR's silence I suspect not :confused:



He's been VERY quiet.
65" VT50 / BDP-S7200
Denon AVR-4520CI
Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
Directv HR44-200 / HR24-500

 


#2250 OFFLINE   georule

georule

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 1,602 posts
Joined: Mar 31, 2010

Posted 09 November 2010 - 03:47 PM

1440x1920 is only a video format used for some recording devices. Regardless how a program was filmed on video, network feeds themselves are either 1280x720 or 1920x1080. The actual ATSC standards are what matter here. The ATSC digital television standard for 1080i is defined as 1920x1080.


So by that arguement 1080p sucks because it isn't an ATSC standard. DirecTV sucks because they don't use ATSC to deliver content.

Or, maybe, ATSC has a specific use (broadcast) and getting outside that context using ATSC as a reference is arguing over which oranges make the best vegetable.

Somewhere I recall reading that the "HD" standards had been defined for various uses where only lines of vertical resolution would be counted, and DISH was not the only one to take advantage of that fact.

Which doesn't make their implemention as good as a higher-res implemention.

Edit: Btw, DISH customers don't get a special DISH-supplied TV with their sub, do they? Because if not, clearly a standard is being successfully met to allow a wide range of consumer sets to show their picture.

Edited by georule, 09 November 2010 - 03:52 PM.





Protected By... spam firewall...And...