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HD Upgrade ?'s (equipment/contract related)


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#1 OFFLINE   cozdabuch

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Posted 18 October 2010 - 01:57 AM

Basically I am doing a self upgrade of my "travel" dish.
We have all SD equipment at home, and for my travel dish, I want an HD setup (for which I want to get a HD DVR).

I have a few ?'s:

1) We have 2 DTV SD Tivos, and 2 R10's. I want to replace one of the SD Tivos with an HD DVR. What is the best way to go about this? I own all the equip we have now. Is there a way to get new equip that I would own or is it all leased. I do not have the PP so, weigh in, should I add it for a "defective" equip swap? (owned for owned).. If not, do I just have to buy an Older model say HR20, 21 rather than what I want, an HR24.

2) I live in the south western CT area, (near Danbury), but my travel dish is most often located in NYC. What type of dish should I get, a Slimline 3lnb or 5? and should I go for SWM or not? (I know about needing b-band with the non SWM, no need to reference it), but I ask this based on the above question about receivers. I know the older receivers can't support SWM, so the questions go hand in hand.


Basically I want an HR24, how do I get an owned one, and what dish should I pickup? If this is not possible, what are my closest options?

Also, since I havent done anything with my setup in a long time, I'm not familiar with D* leasing. What's the deal, do you pay a lease cost on top of the $5 addt'l receiver fee per month? If not, what is the disadvantage of owned vs leased? Is it just a commitment issue, etc??

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#2 OFFLINE   The Merg

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Posted 18 October 2010 - 05:30 AM

:welcome_s to DBSTalk.

1) A defective swap-out will only get you a SD-DVR and not a HD-DVR. In order to get a HD-DVR, you will need to upgrade, in essence, add an HD-DVR to your account and then deactivate one of your SD-DVR's.

2) A Slimline 3LNB should work fine as long as you are not getting any international programming.. As for SWiM vs. non-SWiM, if you are using an HD-DVR, all of them are SWiM compatible.

As for getting a receiver that is owned vs. leased, the one may advantage is that you can deactivate an owned receiver and not need to send it back to DirecTV. Any receiver that you get from a retailer or DirecTV will be a lease. You need to pay an up-front lease fee (up to $199 for a HD-DVR) and then you pay the monthly lease fee of $5/month after the first receiver on your account. Any time an additional receiver is activated that is a lease, it will reset your commitment to 2 years.

If you want to find an owned receiver, check on ebay or CraigsList. Before purchasing, get the RID and check with the Access Card Team of DirecTV to verify the receiver is owned and that it could be activated on your account if purchased.

- Merg

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom


#3 OFFLINE   BattleZone

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Posted 18 October 2010 - 10:48 AM

There are only 4 sources that I know of for OWNED DirecTV HD-DVRs:

- Buying from DirecTV directly (gets you the latest model, but you'll pay MSRP).
- Buying an HR21 Pro from a retailer.
- Buying a used HR2x from a DirecTV employee (their receivers become owned).
- Buying a used HR2x from eBay or somewhere that was a replacement for an owned HD-DVR (usually HR10-250 Tivo swaps).

Monthly cost for a leased receiver is the same as owned ($5/receiver per month for allr eceivers beyond the first receiver on the account) to mirror programming.

Leased receivers come with the following restrictions/liabilities:

- 24 month commitment or pay pro-rated ETF.
- Can't travel with it.
- Can't open/modify it.
- Can't deactivate it without returning it.

The advantage of leased receivers is, of course, the lower up-front cost ($199 to lease vs. $499 to own), and the $199 upfront lease price is often further discounted. Most folks don't want to pay money up-front.

#4 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 18 October 2010 - 10:51 AM

You will only get an owned for owned equipment swap if you have the protection plan. If you don't have the PP and something goes out, it will get replaced with leased equipment and a commitment extension since you are basically just leasing another box.

When you calling about RIDs, make sure to only talk to the access card distribution team about it. Info from any other department (for the most part) is probably not accurate.

Edited by matt, 18 October 2010 - 10:51 AM.

Slimline 5 with SWM-16
Wireless DECA
HR34-700!
R22-200 Leased
Owned H25-700 and H24-700 off and packed for the move.

DIRECTV subscriber since Nov. 2009

#5 OFFLINE   cozdabuch

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 01:02 AM

Leased receivers come with the following restrictions/liabilities:

- Can't travel with it.


What do u mean? Will it not function if it does not receive the local stream or something like that? Or does DTV just say you're not allowed. I want to use this while on the road, the whole point of me getting the HD DVR is to have in the camper for when traveling/tailgating, and ability to record something we want to.

Edited by cozdabuch, 20 October 2010 - 01:03 AM.


#6 OFFLINE   Richierich

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 04:57 AM

You are not allowed technically to travel with it unless you have an RV Waiver but RVers do it all the time. There is no way Directv would know where your DVR is located.

However, if your travel outside of your Local Station's Spotbeam you will lose your local stations. But you can buy an AM21 Tuner and hook it up via an OTA Antenna and get locals wherever you are.

Edited by Richierich, 20 October 2010 - 04:58 AM.

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#7 OFFLINE   Joe C

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 05:02 AM

What do u mean? Will it not function if it does not receive the local stream or something like that? Or does DTV just say you're not allowed. I want to use this while on the road, the whole point of me getting the HD DVR is to have in the camper for when traveling/tailgating, and ability to record something we want to.


Some people get caught up in the Trems of Service, its the Bible to them. The TOS says you can not have recievers from the same account active in 2 different locations at the same time, like a hunting lodge and your main residence for example. People do it every day and life goes on, don't worry about it. Only programing caveat would be if you would get your local channels at the temporary location, that is determined if you are still in the spot beam.

#8 OFFLINE   cozdabuch

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 10:27 PM

Only programing caveat would be if you would get your local channels at the temporary location, that is determined if you are still in the spot beam.


Ok, basically, does anyone know if the NY city spot beam would cover up to just south of Waterbury CT? (Middlebury 06762).
I ask because up there, we get the Hartford local channels and I know down in the city, the Hartford spot beam doesn't make it down.
If I switched the address for the account to NYC would I be able to have a box located up there receive (NYC) locals rather than the way it is now?

By the way, coming clean, it's not for an RV setup, I live in NYC, parents are in CT. I'm a mooch. I've been doing this from CA and AZ (all SD, hence the HD related ?'s) when I was there, I'm just far closer to where they are located and hence the ?'s about locals.
I didn't say anything before, being new to this board, I didn't know how the mods deal with this. I'm on a couple other forums for other stuff where the MODs are really nazi's about what gets talked about.

Does anyone have a map of the spot beam boundaries?

Edited by cozdabuch, 20 October 2010 - 10:28 PM.


#9 OFFLINE   matt

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 12:10 AM

Mod approval or not (and it's not, btw), I wouldn't openly admit here you are account stacking. D* is (not visibly) active here. They have ways of finding you.
Slimline 5 with SWM-16
Wireless DECA
HR34-700!
R22-200 Leased
Owned H25-700 and H24-700 off and packed for the move.

DIRECTV subscriber since Nov. 2009

#10 OFFLINE   Mark L

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 01:39 AM

Some people get caught up in the Trems of Service, its the Bible to them. The TOS says you can not have recievers from the same account active in 2 different locations at the same time, like a hunting lodge and your main residence for example. People do it every day and life goes on, don't worry about it. Only programing caveat would be if you would get your local channels at the temporary location, that is determined if you are still in the spot beam.


Yes


Finally someone says it.

In my opinion, as long as the bill is being paid, the consumer should be able to take their box wherever they want to. Especially if it's under "owned status".

I'm tired of these greedy corporations saying what we can and cannot do.

DirecTV customer since October 2002, 5 LNB Slimline Dish, SWiM 16, Premiere package, HD package

9 receivers: (3) HR20-700s *2 Owned, (1) HR21-700, (1) HR22-100, (1) HR23-700, (1) HR24-200, (1) H21-700, (1) H24-100


#11 OFFLINE   The Merg

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 01:56 AM

Some people get caught up in the Trems of Service, its the Bible to them. The TOS says you can not have recievers from the same account active in 2 different locations at the same time, like a hunting lodge and your main residence for example. People do it every day and life goes on, don't worry about it. Only programing caveat would be if you would get your local channels at the temporary location, that is determined if you are still in the spot beam.


Yes

Finally someone says it.

In my opinion, as long as the bill is being paid, the consumer should be able to take their box wherever they want to. Especially if it's under "owned status".

I'm tired of these greedy corporations saying what we can and cannot do.


When you signed up with DirecTV you agreed to use their service under certain conditions. If you don't agree with the terms, don't use the service.

And the Equipment Lease Addendum does not mention anything about using receivers in two locations at once. It specifically states:

You shall have no right to sell, give away, transfer, pledge, mortgage, remove, relocate, alter or tamper with the DIRECTV equipment at any time.


Now as I just stated, that is located in the Equipment Lease Addendum. If you own the receiver, you are not subject to that clause.

However, the Customer Agreement refers to how all receivers need to be connected to the same phone line to have your subscription package mirrored to the additional receivers. The Customer Agreement also specifically states how receivers in RV's are not eligible to be mirrored. Now while I do agree that the reference to phone line is now out of date, it seems that DirecTV seems to consider the home network a viable alternative.

Do I consider these documents to be the Bible? No, but I did agree to use DirecTV's service according the conditions they set forth. If you don't want to follow those conditions, go ahead. I just think it says a lot about someone who agrees to do something and then doesn't. So, if you happen to be the one person who DirecTV decides to cancel service on for violating their terms, don't start posting about how unfair it is.

- Merg

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom


#12 OFFLINE   Mark L

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 02:00 AM

When you signed up with DirecTV you agreed to use their service under certain conditions. If you don't agree with the terms, don't use the service.

And the Equipment Lease Addendum does not mention anything about using receivers in two locations at once. It specifically states:


Now as I just stated, that is located in the Equipment Lease Addendum. If you own the receiver, you are not subject to that clause.

However, the Customer Agreement refers to how all receivers need to be connected to the same phone line to have your subscription package mirrored to the additional receivers. The Customer Agreement also specifically states how receivers in RV's are not eligible to be mirrored. Now while I do agree that the reference to phone line is now out of date, it seems that DirecTV seems to consider the home network a viable alternative.

Do I consider these documents to be the Bible? No, but I did agree to use DirecTV's service according the conditions they set forth. If you don't want to follow those conditions, go ahead. I just think it says a lot about someone who agrees to do something and then doesn't. So, if you happen to be the one person who DirecTV decides to cancel service on for violating their terms, don't start posting about how unfair it is.

- Merg



The whole point of that Lease Addendum is so people will be forced to either A) open up another account, or B) pay for RV service....... thus creating more revenue for DirecTV

Driving up their stock price is the most important thing to them.

Last I checked, my bill was nearly $175 a month, sorry but that's all they're gonna get out of me.

DirecTV customer since October 2002, 5 LNB Slimline Dish, SWiM 16, Premiere package, HD package

9 receivers: (3) HR20-700s *2 Owned, (1) HR21-700, (1) HR22-100, (1) HR23-700, (1) HR24-200, (1) H21-700, (1) H24-100


#13 OFFLINE   The Merg

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 02:08 AM

The whole point of that Lease Addendum is so people will be forced to either A) open up another account, or B) pay for RV service....... thus creating more revenue for DirecTV

Driving up their stock price is the most important thing to them.

Last I checked, my bill was nearly $175 a month, sorry but that's all they're gonna get out of me.


Actually, it's the Customer Agreement that causes you to get another account. And some people have gotten an RV waiver that allows them to use their main account with a receiver that is specified for their RV, thus not forcing you to create a new account.

The main purpose is to prevent people from having service in two different locations. And while most people who set up their vacation home with service will not be using it there and at home at the same time, there are plenty of people that would. If you are going to have service in multiple locations, you should have multiple subscriptions.

- Merg

Edited by The Merg, 21 October 2010 - 02:08 AM.

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom


#14 OFFLINE   Joe C

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 05:03 AM

And some people have gotten an RV waiver that allows them to use their main account with a receiver that is specified for their RV, thus not forcing you to create a new account.

The main purpose is to prevent people from having service in two different locations. And while most people who set up their vacation home with service will not be using it there and at home at the same time, there are plenty of people that would. If you are going to have service in multiple locations, you should have multiple subscriptions.

- Merg



Tell that to every tailgater in this country, they need a seperate account to tailgate with. I really don't see a problem with members of the same household using different recievers in different locations on a temporary basis. Account stacking is wrong. But if you or Directv expect all TVs in the house to be of while someone is standing Giants Stadium parking lot with a DVR from thier acct publicly displaying a coprighted broadcast of a NFL game without expressed writted permission from the NFL your both nuts.

#15 OFFLINE   The Merg

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 06:23 AM

Tell that to every tailgater in this country, they need a seperate account to tailgate with. I really don't see a problem with members of the same household using different recievers in different locations on a temporary basis. Account stacking is wrong. But if you or Directv expect all TVs in the house to be of while someone is standing Giants Stadium parking lot with a DVR from thier acct publicly displaying a coprighted broadcast of a NFL game without expressed writted permission from the NFL your both nuts.


I don't necessarily expect it myself and don't necessarily agree with it. I'm stating with DirecTV expects and what the customer agrees to when signing up for service.

The issue is what makes setting up a tailgate party at the stadium any different than bringing your receiver over to your buddy's house so that you can watch the football game on his big screen projector. You're temporarily using the service there. It's no different. According to DirecTV, once the line is crossed it starts to get too gray. It's easier for them to just make it black and white.

- Merg

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom


#16 OFFLINE   Richierich

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 08:01 AM

Here is a Link to the Spot Beam Map.

http://www.dbstalk.c...ers#post2473023

Edited by Richierich, 21 October 2010 - 08:04 AM.

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#17 OFFLINE   Joe C

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 08:11 AM

I don't necessarily expect it myself and don't necessarily agree with it. I'm stating with DirecTV expects and what the customer agrees to when signing up for service.

The issue is what makes setting up a tailgate party at the stadium any different than bringing your receiver over to your buddy's house so that you can watch the football game on his big screen projector. You're temporarily using the service there. It's no different. According to DirecTV, once the line is crossed it starts to get too gray. It's easier for them to just make it black and white.

- Merg


I think they make black and white to satisfy the lawyers. Think about it, if you were truly forbiden from using a receiver in a portable application why do they market dish tripods, Sat Go's and the like ?

#18 OFFLINE   Richierich

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 08:15 AM

I think they make black and white to satisfy the lawyers. Think about it, if you were truly forbiden from using a receiver in a portable application why do they market dish tripods, Sat Go's and the like ?


EXACTLY!!! I think Directv could stop you but in the case of Tailgating or RVing I just don't think Directv considers it Abusive Behavior and I don't know of anyone who has been disciplined but I know of over one hundred RVers who carry their DVR with them and no one has a problem.

It is kind of like the Army's Policy of "Don't Ask and Don't Tell!!!".
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#19 OFFLINE   Beerstalker

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 01:27 PM

In my opinion I really don't think DirecTV cares all that much about people who tailgate, take their recievers with them in their RV, to their hunting cabin, ice fishing shack, vacation home, etc.

What I think they really don't want happening, and they will try to bust you for is using your equipment in two locations at the same time permanently. For example if I were to order 8 receivers on my account, and then take 4 of those receivers to my parents house and set them up there and leave them there so my parents didn't have to get their own account.

#20 OFFLINE   The Merg

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 07:27 PM

It is kind of like the Army's Policy of "Don't Ask and Don't Tell!!!".


:lol:

In my opinion I really don't think DirecTV cares all that much about people who tailgate, take their recievers with them in their RV, to their hunting cabin, ice fishing shack, vacation home, etc.

What I think they really don't want happening, and they will try to bust you for is using your equipment in two locations at the same time permanently. For example if I were to order 8 receivers on my account, and then take 4 of those receivers to my parents house and set them up there and leave them there so my parents didn't have to get their own account.


I agree with that analysis. I was just pointing out what the text actually says compared to what people imply it means.

- Merg

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom





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