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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Onsite CES Report: Wrap-up PART TWO


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#1 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 10 January 2011 - 07:28 AM

CES Report – Post-Show Wrap-up and additions

Toshiba (and other manufacturers) Glasses-free 3D HD (see photos) – as stated previously....3D was anything but dead at CES 2011. In fact the visibility of 3D-related products and technology was triple what was seen last year at CES.

What was new and expanded was not only the shear numbers of providers featuring 3D HD units and related content, but also 3D rolled out on new platforms (laptops, iPads, etc.), as well as delivery channels. (see photos)

The Toshiba booth featured glasses-free 3D HD demos on multiple screen sizes and also a laptop setup. What was key was the angle/position where you stood or would sit to the screen. This was only 1 of multiple technologies supporting glasses-free viewing.

The stated delivery was late 2011 or early 2012. I suspect there may be multiple forms of this technology, as well as price points based on screen size. We were told the costs would actually be closer to conventional HD, as the technology itself was lower than glasses-based hardware.

RVU Alliance Hardware - there were a number of manufacturers showing off RVU-based technologies at CES 2011. Since DirecTV is a member of this Alliance, seeing Samsung and others actually present demos with this platform standard was both interesting and promising. The concept of reducing and/or eliminating remote room hardware while delivering quality HDTV content is gaining in adoption. Look for more RVU-based HDTV's and related equipment later in 2011 and beyond.

Conclusion - It is always a great opportunity to attend CES, and having done it for 3 straight years...you can see progress on many technology fronts, as well as the introduction of new things all the time.

This year was particularly enjoyable, with more DBSTalkers onsite at CES than any time in recent years. Sharing time to meet DirecTV tech partners, as well as booth demos and discussions, as well as a DBSTalk dinner gathering made this one memorable for a long time. There are many more photos to go through...but having been on the other side of the fence in the past...I know some folks are anxious to see pix ASAP...so the 20-25 I shared in reports should satisfy those appetites a bit. It also gave me a chance to give my new Canon Powershot S95 a good "out in the field workout".

Thanks to my fellow onsite DBSTalk associates - I look forward to reading your content and reports as well. On a personal note - thanks to Doug Brott - DBSTalk Moderator, for his onsite guidance, wisdom, and friendship.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Toshiba 3D HD Glasses Free 1.jpg
  • Toshiba 3D HD Glasses Free 2.jpg
  • Toshiba 3D HD Glasses Free 3.jpg

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#2 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 10 January 2011 - 08:27 AM

Interesting point of view on 3D. Of course what the manufacturers choose to show and what the public chooses to buy are two different things.
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#3 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 10 January 2011 - 08:32 AM

Interesting point of view on 3D. Of course what the manufacturers choose to show and what the public chooses to buy are two different things.

Absolutely.

With more than one approach shown at CES, and 3D HD overall in general still in "mainstream year 2" maturity...plenty can still change over the next year.
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#4 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 10 January 2011 - 09:03 AM

In the end I can't help but wonder if the 3D technology will just be cheap enough that it gets put in the majority of TVs, whether or not people use it.
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#5 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 10 January 2011 - 09:05 AM

In the end I can't help but wonder if the 3D technology will just be cheap enough that it gets put in the majority of TVs, whether or not people use it.

That's somewhat the same dialog heard at CES.

The answer to that question was heard to be both yes and maybe. ;)
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#6 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 07:32 AM

Since this is my last wrapup post....

Start filling those piggy banks... ;)

I'll leave folks with this...see ya there...

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  • 2012 Banner.jpg

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#7 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 08:23 AM

Noticed that they moved it a week further out next year. That's interesting.
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#8 OFFLINE   bidger

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:04 AM

We were told the costs would actually be closer to conventional HD, as the technology itself was lower than glasses-based hardware.


Can you give specifics on the bolded text?

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#9 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:09 AM

Noticed that they moved it a week further out next year. That's interesting.

Indeed - likely due to the Hall scheduling somehow...there were mumblings out in the hallways about some road construction in the area at the end of this year...maybe they just wanted to play it safe.

Can you give specifics on the bolded text?

Not really...just in general...the glasses-free technology would result in less manufacturing cost, and therefore likely less retail prices than current 3D HD...or so we were told.
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#10 OFFLINE   NR4P

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:20 AM

Comment on the Toshiba Glasses free 3D TV's.

When I asked about marketing dates, I was given a cryptic answer "Fiscal 2011".
I asked the Toshiba rep when does fiscal 2011 end, he said he didn't know.
I then asked the rep, since its Jan 2011 now, is it Toshiba's Fiscal 2010 or 2011?
He said they are still in Fiscal 2010.

Therefore, that means Calendar 2012 for seeing these in the market.

#11 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:50 AM

Comment on the Toshiba Glasses free 3D TV's.

When I asked about marketing dates, I was given a cryptic answer "Fiscal 2011".
I asked the Toshiba rep when does fiscal 2011 end, he said he didn't know.
I then asked the rep, since its Jan 2011 now, is it Toshiba's Fiscal 2010 or 2011?
He said they are still in Fiscal 2010.

Therefore, that means Calendar 2012 for seeing these in the market.

2012 is correct.
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#12 OFFLINE   bidger

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:51 AM

Can you give specifics on the bolded text?


Not really...just in general...the glasses-free technology would result in less manufacturing cost, and therefore likely less retail prices than current 3D HD...or so we were told.


Comment on the Toshiba Glasses free 3D TV's.

When I asked about marketing dates, I was given a cryptic answer "Fiscal 2011".
I asked the Toshiba rep when does fiscal 2011 end, he said he didn't know.
I then asked the rep, since its Jan 2011 now, is it Toshiba's Fiscal 2010 or 2011?
He said they are still in Fiscal 2010.

Therefore, that means Calendar 2012 for seeing these in the market.


Thanks to both of you.

Is Toshiba once again alone on an island, i.e.- HD-DVD, or did another CE company demo glasses-free technology at CES?

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#13 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:53 AM

Thanks to both of you.

Is Toshiba once again alone on an island, i.e.- HD-DVD, or did another CE company demo glasses-free technology at CES?

Not this time...saw 3 different "solutions" for glasses free from 3 different companies...
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#14 OFFLINE   bidger

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 11:15 AM

Again, thanks.

I have to admit that I didn't keep up with CES that much this time around.

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#15 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 11:17 AM

Again, thanks.

I have to admit that I didn't keep up with CES that much this time around.

Not to worry...we were THERE....and it was a challenge to keep up with everything... :D:lol:

Glad you enjoyed the reports and photos. We try.
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#16 OFFLINE   NR4P

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 11:33 AM

Sony did display PROTOTYPES (marked big and bold) of 24" Glasses Free 3D TV.
They were OLED displays. Very expensive technology.

Looked good, bright colors, good 3D but they were in a blackened display area where you looked in from about 8 feet away.

No dates to production known and if you follow OLED technology it's quite expensive.

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 12:30 PM

Sony also showed two other glasses free displays, one 40ish inches, the other 50ish inches. The larger was using a 4K source, and looked pretty incredible, as far as the depth goes. These two displays were in two rooms that said future 3d and were next to a third room that the SXRD front projector was in.

#18 OFFLINE   bidger

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:41 PM

Sony did display PROTOTYPES (marked big and bold) of 24" Glasses Free 3D TV.
They were OLED displays. Very expensive technology.


Interesting, especially in light of several articles earlier in the year proclaiming the technology "dead".

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#19 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 07:41 PM

Interesting, especially in light of several articles earlier in the year proclaiming the technology "dead".

If one thing was clear about 3D....CEs showed everyone that the industry manufacturers think the exact opposite...its early, but in growth mode.

There were roughly 3 times the 3D HD presentations/products as last year at CES. Reports of 3D HD's demise have clearly been premature.
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#20 OFFLINE   bidger

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 10:20 PM

Just to clarify, I was referring to OLED's alleged demise, not 3D.

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#21 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 04:27 AM

Just to clarify, I was referring to OLED's alleged demise, not 3D.

That's how I read it...

Others have claimed the doomsday sceanrio for 3D. If they would have attended CES this year, they would have been very disappointed. :D
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#22 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 07:57 AM

If one thing was clear about 3D....CEs showed everyone that the industry manufacturers think the exact opposite...its early, but in growth mode.

There were roughly 3 times the 3D HD presentations/products as last year at CES. Reports of 3D HD's demise have clearly been premature.

I am by no means a "Debbie Downer" on 3D, but I can't help but think the situation you describe is analogous to the scene is a hospital emergency room where the dying patient has just "coded" and support staff are rushing in to perform heroic procedures in a last-ditch effort to revive the patient.

When I first watched a monster movie in 3D as a kid in the '50s, I remember thinking then it that was just a novelty. Yes, we have come a long way with the technology and all, but my opinion has not changed all that much. 3D will continue to be a novelty and be relegated to just a niche product for years to come.

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#23 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 08:04 AM

I am by no means a "Debbie Downer" on 3D, but I can't help but think the situation you describe is analogous to the scene is a hospital emergency room where the dying patient has just "coded" and support staff are rushing in to perform heroic procedures in a last-ditch effort to revive the patient.

When I first watched a monster movie in 3D as a kid in the '50s, I remember thinking then it that was just a novelty. Yes, we have come a long way with the technology and all, but my opinion has not changed all that much. 3D will continue to be a novelty and be relegated to just a niche product for years to come.

I can certainly understand that view.

But having seen, discussed, and interacted with various manufacturers directly at CES...it was quite obvious the commitment is both solid and for the long haul. I suspect the numerous additions of new players this year alone demonstrated that a bandwagon was moving down the road.
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#24 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 08:22 AM

I thought the same thing about minidiscs, as well as a dozen other technologies. Anyone remember how big "Playsforsure" was at CES about five years ago?
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#25 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 08:29 AM

I thought the same thing about minidiscs, as well as a dozen other technologies. Anyone remember how big "Playsforsure" was at CES about five years ago?

That's true for sure.

That said...

In looking at the shear $$$ invested in 3D, as well as the very large number of adopter manufacturers, as well as content providers growing to support it...it appears to have some "sticking power". Content will be a key element, and the manufacturers are even partially subsidizing that expansion.

Also, 3D enabled HDTVs may start to normalize in terms of price a bit better over 2011.

While its all been out for a while, at CES...this is yearly "year two" of the mainstream rollout of 3D - still early. Many manufacturers at CES this year almost "matter of factly" showed off a growing arsenal of hardware - not only 3D HDTV's - but also laptops, portables, and other devices. Glasses free also hit for the first tangible beta units there.

With HDTV taking almost 7 years to hit critical mass for "mainstream" adoption...3D is still a bit early to judge in terms of lasting success. Based on CES 2011 and other reports read - a year from now, we should know if the momentum continues or has peaked IMHO.
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