Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

in need of a complicated installation


  • Please log in to reply
35 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 12:29 PM

hey everyone, guy from directv said i had no clear line of sight for the extra wide 5lnb dish he wanted to install.. for complete programming including locals and high definition channels, its my understanding i would need to access 99, 101, 103, 110, and 119 satellites

my problem is the house to my south has a lot of HUGE trees, and i did find an opening about 20 feet wide, 10 feet high between them.. maybe a little higher, but its not enough for the 5lnb installation, and the guy was too lazy to actually climb a ladder to be sure, so it looks like im just going to have to install it myself

is it correct that i need to access those 5 satellites for complete programming?... i found that i can get a three LNB setup to access satellites 99, 101, and 103 which i believe i could hit all three with a single dish... would these require a wide HD dish or could i use these with an 18 inch dish?

if that works, for the other two (110 and 119) i can get a dual lnb setup to hit both of those, but im not entirely sure i can reach those two from a single dish, i may actually have to bring in a third dish.. one to hit 99-101-103, one for 110, and one for 119..

has anyone ever installed a setup this complicated? if so, what had to be done? can i use the 18 inch dish i already have for the 99-101-103, or will i need an HD dish for that and an 18 inch dish for the others? also, whats the least expensive route i can go for a dish capable of touching 110 or 119 by itself?

ill take a photo of the area later and post it here so you guys can see the area im talking about... and thanks in advance for any help

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#2 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

veryoldschool

    Lifetime Achiever

  • Moderators
  • 41,755 posts
Joined: Dec 09, 2006

Posted 17 August 2011 - 12:38 PM

HD doesn't work with the 18" dish, so you'll need the slimline. The SL3 LNB is for 99/101/103, which covers HD.
Adding a second [or third dish] will end up being way too complicated, so I'd suggest skipping it. What you'll miss are some music channels and maybe your local SD channels if they come off the 119 SAT.
A.K.A VOS

#3 ONLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 10,901 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 17 August 2011 - 12:49 PM

Virtually all SD programming is on 101. HD programming (both national and local) is on 99 and 103. So with those 3 positions covered you will get everything except possibly your SD locals, a couple of Spanish language channels, and a few sonic tap music channels (all of which would be on 119).

Typically, DirecTV won't allow a 3LNB installation (99,101,103) in a market where SD locals are on 119, so it would be a do-it-yourself installation. If this is going to be a new account, you might have a problem doing that though (typically a new account requires an installer to do it).

#4 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 01:08 PM

so... if i skip 110 and 119 im only missing out in hispanic and standard definition locals?... the guy wanted to install a huge 5lnb dish and said there was no line of sight... hes not allowed to leave out those channels even though i couldnt care less about them?.. so a 20x10 foot gap about 40 feet high and 30 feet away from my house... that would be enough for the 99, 101, and 103 satellites?... if so, i could probably buy a kit online to install that myself... would i be able to order the receivers and programming for my own installation?

#5 OFFLINE   Shades228

Shades228

    Hall Of Fame

  • Banned User
  • 5,914 posts
Joined: Mar 18, 2008

Posted 17 August 2011 - 01:17 PM

The SL3 and SL5 are the same size it's just the LNB that's changing. I would do more research before installing and getting locked into an agreement for 2 years. If it's a window that small chances are you're going to see issues in the future even if it is wide enough for the 99, 101, 103.

You would probably be better off in the long run just trimming some trees back if you're that dead set on getting DIRECTV.

#6 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 01:49 PM

i would love to trim some of these trees, but dont have the money to do that, and a lot of those trees arent on my property, so i cant do so anyway

i looked at lyngsat and apparently my standard definition locals are in fact on 119

#7 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 02:38 PM

one question.. what is the highest a vertical pole can be installed on my roof?

#8 OFFLINE   trh

trh

    This Space for Sale

  • Registered
  • 3,308 posts
  • LocationNE FL
Joined: Nov 02, 2007

Posted 17 August 2011 - 03:30 PM

You mean what's the highest pole that the installers will work with? Probably not very tall.

#9 ONLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 10,901 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 17 August 2011 - 04:19 PM

Short of custom work you do yourself or hire someone to do, you won't get a vertical pole on your roof. Further, anything much bigger than the standard mount for the slimline dish isn't going to be stable enough. The dish is a big sail when there is wind. Put it on top of a ten foot pole on top of your roof and it won't last beyond the next serious blow (and will probably damage your roof too).

Go to www.dishpointer.com and use their site to help determine your line of site. Check for the three orbital slots (99, 101 and 103).

Keep in mind, if those trees continue to grow, you could find an opening that exists today could be gone next summer. Often times a no-LOS refusal is as much due to the fact that you would lose LOS before your 2 year initial commitment is complete even if you had it to start with. Installers have some margin requirements for LOS before they can do the installation.

#10 OFFLINE   Michael Hilley

Michael Hilley

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 187 posts
Joined: May 31, 2007

Posted 17 August 2011 - 05:15 PM

Keep in mind a couple of things:
1) If you are in a market with LIL SD, the programming guide may come off of 119. (This is changing and may no longer be the case for your market).
2) That in the eastern half of the US, that the arc descends downward from the 99 to the 119 (opposite for those in the western half).
So if the clearing between the trees allows LOS for 99-101-103, then 110 and especially 119 are significantly lower in the sky, and simply trimming the tree(s) to the right probably won't provide LOS. If the clearing allowed LOS to 119, then clearing the top of the tree to the left might be possible.

I haven't tried the dishpointer app for handhelds but others' feedback seems to indicate that it is pretty accurate... you might want to invest in it before you start drilling holes in your roof.

#11 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 06:23 PM

well, directv practically begged me to get a second opinion so ill have someone next week not afraid to go on the roof, and the big tree in the front might be leaving soon since its half dead already

#12 OFFLINE   jdspencer

jdspencer

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,566 posts
Joined: Nov 07, 2003

Posted 17 August 2011 - 07:55 PM

IMO. DirecTV needs to change the requirement to see 119 for an install if the HD locals are available and the new customer doesn't care about SD.
DirecTV since '96, Waivers for ABC, CBS, NBC, & Fox, HR23-700 & HR24-500/AM21, using ethernet based MRV.

#13 OFFLINE   tech24218

tech24218

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 70 posts
Joined: Aug 12, 2009

Posted 17 August 2011 - 08:28 PM

well, directv practically begged me to get a second opinion so ill have someone next week not afraid to go on the roof, and the big tree in the front might be leaving soon since its half dead already


I'm not afraid to get on your roof. However, I'm also not permitted by the company I work for to get on the roof. So with my handy dandy inclinometer I can probably tell from the ground that you don't have a line of sight off of your roof. I have no reason to waste my time climbing on the roof if I've made up my mind I don't want to do your install. If I drill holes in your roof and six months later you don't have line of sight, guess who that's coming back on? It's not worth 80$ to me to have to pay out 200$ in repairs for your roof just because you want Directv. Are you going to tip me after I spend three times as long on your install as I would a similar job at a different location?

Good luck with your multiple dish set up.
HR22-100 RCA Scrennium 50"
R16-300 32" Toshiba
D11-500 @ lake House

The Best Directv Ad
http://www.facebook....v=1340867931805

#14 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 17 August 2011 - 09:48 PM

i guess according to tech24218, they only want to do the easy jobs that dont take much effort, which is pretty much what i expected

#15 ONLINE   carl6

carl6

    Hall Of Fame

  • Moderators
  • 10,901 posts
  • LocationSeattle, WA
Joined: Nov 15, 2005

Posted 17 August 2011 - 10:18 PM

Unfortunately, installers are not paid by the hour, but by how many receivers are installed. They are not paid for travel time to/from jobs, etc. The longer they spend on a job, the fewer jobs they can do in a day, and the less they get paid.

There are arguments for and against that type of compensation system. An obvious disadvantage is they will find ways to not do a difficult or complicated (time consuming) job.

#16 OFFLINE   joe diamond

joe diamond

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,071 posts
Joined: Feb 28, 2007

Posted 17 August 2011 - 11:14 PM

Unfortunately, installers are not paid by the hour, but by how many receivers are installed. They are not paid for travel time to/from jobs, etc. The longer they spend on a job, the fewer jobs they can do in a day, and the less they get paid.

There are arguments for and against that type of compensation system. An obvious disadvantage is they will find ways to not do a difficult or complicated (time consuming) job.



Yup,

PLUS...after a few times working for this one company I found myself getting the same......"damn, you are as bad as the other guy they sent yesterday...why can't they send someone who knows what they are doing...?

You are in a dark deep forest with NO chance for a LOS. The company sent a second opinion guy (me). When it was obvious I just phoned it in...and eventually stopped working for the company.

Joe

#17 OFFLINE   animus_divinus

animus_divinus

    New Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 8 posts
Joined: Aug 17, 2011

Posted 18 August 2011 - 06:36 AM

i called directv, and although im fairly sure i would have decent enough line of sight with just a 3LNB HD dish, they "require" an installer to install the dish... does this mean if i install one prior to them showing up, theyll just remove it and say i dont have a clear line of sight to all 5, and i wont get service meaning im completely out of luck due to outdated policies requiring me to only be able to access outdated channels?... it just seems like a major hole in marketing to now allow the 3LNB setup where a LOS to all 5 is difficult

for that matter, why couldnt they install an HD 3LNB dish for 99, 101, and 103, then another dish for 110 and 119 if they absolutely needed those hooked up? theyre not even high definition so the second dish could just be a regular 18" dish... or two simpler, cheaper ones that can only tune into a single dish at once?... it just seems to me that something like that would be worth the 2 year commitment they require

anyway, besides that i seriously doubt theres any way this is going to work... its impossible to get over these trees as they are more than twice the height of the house... they are MASSIVE.. however, the one tree is dying, and is actually splitting in half and does have power lines weaving between it... so the power company might actually remove it soon... that tree WILL come down on its own soon if they do not

#18 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

veryoldschool

    Lifetime Achiever

  • Moderators
  • 41,755 posts
Joined: Dec 09, 2006

Posted 18 August 2011 - 07:50 AM

for that matter, why couldnt they install an HD 3LNB dish for 99, 101, and 103, then another dish for 110 and 119 if they absolutely needed those hooked up? theyre not even high definition so the second dish could just be a regular 18" dish... or two simpler, cheaper ones that can only tune into a single dish at once?

DirecTV would need to built a special LNB assembly for this and the market simply isn't large enough for it.

Doing this with current hardware available:
$459.99 http://www.thesatell...er_of_uploads=0
.$55.98 (2) http://www.solidsign...ku=053818480106
.$29.99 http://www.solidsign...-Kit-(SAT-CKIT)
$545.96 + tax + shipping

Edited by veryoldschool, 18 August 2011 - 09:00 AM.

A.K.A VOS

#19 OFFLINE   fleckrj

fleckrj

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 1,092 posts
  • LocationCary, NC
Joined: Sep 04, 2009

Posted 18 August 2011 - 11:03 AM

Why would DirecTV put east coast (the OP is from PA) locals on 119? No LOS to 119 from the east coast is common.

#20 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

veryoldschool

    Lifetime Achiever

  • Moderators
  • 41,755 posts
Joined: Dec 09, 2006

Posted 18 August 2011 - 11:16 AM

Why would DirecTV put east coast (the OP is from PA) locals on 119? No LOS to 119 from the east coast is common.

I'm sure it has to do with the market size, and not the location.
The largest DMAs are on 101, and then DirecTV added 119 for more markets.
For the smallest, they used 72.5, but have moved those off 72.5 and to the MPEG-4 SATs.

The OP's problem isn't elevation, but trees anyway.
A.K.A VOS




Protected By... spam firewall...And...