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Where are all the OAR snobs now?


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35 replies to this topic

#21 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:06 PM

Thanks, Mr. Spock!

Since it was actually shot with enough room to do a passable 16:9 conversion, I guess I could go either way with that one. It would even be interesting to see them clone in a little bit at the top and bottom to fill the frame rather than cropping. I bet they could.
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#22 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:19 PM

Thank you.

I'm trying to find the test real the TOS remasterers did of TNG in 16:9 but I can't. Maybe it was never released but I thought it was.

I did stumble across this teaser and screen caps of the new Blu-ray footage for TNG. It looks very good. link

Edited by Carl Spock, 29 November 2011 - 02:26 PM.

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#23 OFFLINE   tkrandall

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:04 PM

Guys, to be clear, I'm not talking about letterboxing here. I'm not talking about seeing a theatrical property in the same aspect in which it was shown in the theater. I'm talking about old TV shows being cropped to fit 16:9. Are you still so worried about that? Do you even care?


I'm not a fan of that. It requires "zoomig in" and then cropping off the top and bottom.

#24 OFFLINE   spartanstew

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:14 PM

Has OAR all of a sudden become irrelevant?


Nope, but I haven't seen those shows remastered in HD.

Everything should be seen in it's OAR, regardless of the TV it's being viewed on.

I'm sure Directv can't wait to get their hands on your unit.

 
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#25 OFFLINE   Eddie501

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:49 PM

I think the term 'director's intent' is a little bit different for a TV show vs. a film. People would be furious if Gone With The Wind or Casablanca were cropped for 16x9 for the Blu Ray. Not so much a half hour sitcom aired in syndication. Especially where it's pretty much opened up instead of cropped anyway.

Plus anybody who's truly and OAR snob can still easily obtain these shows on DVD in standard def 4x3, just as they were aired. It's not like there's not a choice.

#26 OFFLINE   Drucifer

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 07:14 PM

Guys, to be clear, I'm not talking about letterboxing here. I'm not talking about seeing a theatrical property in the same aspect in which it was shown in the theater. I'm talking about old TV shows being cropped to fit 16:9. Are you still so worried about that? Do you even care?

I think this is a long way before the dust settles. Today we view video on everything from something as large as a side of a building down to a watch-size screen.

Is there a perfect size? An eye scientists could probably answer that

And then just when you think you know the perfect size screen, 3D or even a more advance hologram takes over.

I doubt anybody will ever be 100% right on this subject.

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#27 OFFLINE   Alan Gordon

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:01 PM

OAR is always the preferred version here.

I've turned off films that I have wanted to see due to a crop job.

However, I've also watched some crop jobs not because I'd rather see them that way, but rather because that was the way in which they were presented to me... for instance, knowing my Blu-ray budget is no more, I recorded several films on Starz this past week... several of which were hatchet jobs.


As said elsewhere, I think there are times when the act is more offensive than others. While I'd prefer them in their OAR, I've seen some comedies in the 2.35:1 AR that honestly didn't affect my viewing experience when cropped to the 1.78:1 AR, but almost any sci-fi, action, or period piece movie cropped to 1.78:1 is offensive.


As for TV series, I'd rather always have 4:3 if that's the way it was recorded, but I thought "Quantum Leap" on UniversalHD looked quite good, and what I've seen of "Charlie's Angels", "Seinfeld", "Cheers", "Friends", etc. does not really bother me either... though "Friends" probably more so than the others. I'd like to know what ST:TOS looks like cropped to 16x9, but I'm quite pleased with my 4:3 Blu-ray sets. I'm doubtful I will be able to purchase any of the ST:TNG sets next year, but I'm hopeful Paramount will continue with OAR.

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#28 OFFLINE   djlong

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 09:52 AM

I'll trade in black bars for a full screen quality image any day.

OAR is fine, but in many cases undercuts the value of large screens.

Given the choice, OAS loses here. Not given a choice, it's tolerable.


I just watched a 16x9 version of the Buffy the Vampire Slayer episode "The Body".

When Buffy is talking to the EMT about what to do, the shots of Buffy's face are ok. When they cut to the EMT, as he's taller, you only see from his top lip down. The rest of his face is completely cut off WHILE HE'S TALKING IN A CLOSE UP!!!

#29 ONLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 09:55 AM

I just watched a 16x9 version of the Buffy the Vampire Slayer episode "The Body".

When Buffy is talking to the EMT about what to do, the shots of Buffy's face are ok. When they cut to the EMT, as he's taller, you only see from his top lip down. The rest of his face is completely cut off WHILE HE'S TALKING IN A CLOSE UP!!!

Doesn't Buffy have magical powers? ;):D
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#30 OFFLINE   machavez00

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 10:54 AM

I think the term 'director's intent' is a little bit different for a TV show vs. a film. People would be furious if Gone With The Wind or Casablanca were cropped for 16x9 for the Blu Ray. Not so much a half hour sitcom aired in syndication. Especially where it's pretty much opened up instead of cropped anyway.

Plus anybody who's truly and OAR snob can still easily obtain these shows on DVD in standard def 4x3, just as they were aired. It's not like there's not a choice.


Orson Welles made sure "Citizen Kane" wasn't messed with:
http://en.wikipedia....zen_Kane#Prints

In the 1980s, this film became the catalyst in the controversy over the colorization of black and white films. When Ted Turner told members of the press that he was considering colorizing Citizen Kane, his comments led to an immediate public outcry. About two weeks before his death, and almost a year before Turner acquired the rights to the MGM catalog, Welles had asked filmmaker Henry Jaglom, "Please do this for me. Don't let Ted Turner deface my movie with his crayons."[100] The uproar was for nothing, as Turner could not have colorized the film had he wanted to. Welles' original contract prevented any alteration to the film without his, and eventually his estate's, express consent.[101] Turner later claimed that this was a joke intended to needle colorization critics, and that he had never had any intention of coloring the film.



#31 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 11:19 AM

I don't think that cropping a 4:3 picture down to 16:9 is only for comedies. It's for TV programs where composition of the shots was not that critical. "Artistic integrity" and "television" aren't often used in the same sentence.

Upthread I suggested that any transfers of The Twilight Zone should stay 4:3. In the same vein, I'd also want I Love Lucy to stay at 4:3. The whole process of using three cameras to shoot a comedy in front of a live audience was invented for Lucy and to lose that magnificent camera work would be a sin.
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#32 OFFLINE   Stuart Sweet

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 11:26 AM

So you'd be ok if Sanford and Son were cropped. Of course that was shot on video so it wouldn't happen.
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#33 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 12:18 PM

Yes.

It isn't just that Lucy was shot on film. It was the innovative camera work. I wouldn't want to lose that.

Similarly, it would be OK to crop The Man From U.N.C.L.E. but not Mission Impossible. The production values for Mission Impossible were a couple of steps above the norm.
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#34 OFFLINE   trainman

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Posted 01 December 2011 - 10:05 AM

Upthread I suggested that any transfers of The Twilight Zone should stay 4:3.


Given that CBS has already done HD transfers of "The Twilight Zone" that are in 4:3 (and they look great on Netflix), I don't think you have to worry too much about them going back and doing a 16:9 version -- I can't believe the market would be there for it to be worth their while to redo them.
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#35 OFFLINE   paulman182

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Posted 02 December 2011 - 08:35 AM

There once was a time that I would probably have cared about OAR in old TV series, but now I have become accustomed to TV series being edited, time-compressed, with the screen half covered with promos.

In other words, I know that commercial TV has no respect whatsoever for its own product, so I generally don't, either. "It's just TV."

I've given up series TV for movies, which I can see uncut and often in OAR.

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#36 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 02 December 2011 - 12:26 PM

So you'd be ok if Sanford and Son were cropped. Of course that was shot on video so it wouldn't happen.

The AR of analog video can be digitally altered. It's not your father's VHS any more.

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