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RT Channel 280


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58 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   samhevener

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:11 AM

Let me get this straight....you are KIDDING me!

We've got bloody RT which does NOTHING but slam the US and praise Putin 24/7, but Al Jazeera English was short-circuited by a few ... uninformed people?

OK, before I get into a shouting match here I simply want to challenge anyone who wants to slam me on AJE.

First, go to: http://rt.com/on-air/ Watch it for an hour and count the anti-US references you see and hear, the stories that tell of all the problems in America.

Then, go to: http://www.aljazeera.com/watch_now/ and do the same.

Then come back here and let's discuss.

BTW, as I was typing this I switched on RT, just to make sure it was what I remembered. Within 30 seconds I had been told how Newt Gingrich or Romney as President would curtail American civil liberties and the crawl at the bottom of the screen chided the US for "interfering" with its comments about the Russian election.

I want to know who is paying Dish to pick up this channel. Look, I know what Charlie's politics are...I can't help but wonder if he knows he's broadcasting this...stuff?

As a child, I would lie in bed at night and listen to Radio Moscow, along with many other shortwave stations. Even at the age of 12 I could discern the difference between propaganda and honestly reported news. Today's RT doesn't push the glories of Marxism as did the old Radio Moscow...but it is considerably more sophisticated in the ways it seeks to trash our country and its interests abroad.

Sorry for the rant, folks. This just pissed me off (as I guess you can tell).


RT is much better than all those Home Shopping Channels (aka 24 hour infomericals) that take up bandwidth on Dish. :mad:
AN OLD GEEZER WHO REMEMBERS THE DUMONT TELEVISION NETWORK AND IT'S TOP RATED "CAPTAIN VIDEO AND HIS VIDEO RANGERS", TV NEWS ANCHORMEN WEARING HATS DURING THE NEWSCAST, ONLY 180 SECONDS OF COMMERICALS EACH HALF HOUR, 3 STATIONS ON THE AIR WITH THEIR TEST PATTERNS AIRED FROM 2 TO 3PM, PROGRAMMING FROM 3PM TO 11:30 AND SIGNING OFF AT 11:30PM. HOW COULD I FORGET THE SINGLE FRAME VERTICAL ROLL WHEN THE STATIONS SWITCHED FROM NETWORK TO LOCAL OR LOCAL TO NETWORK AND THE TIME TONE ON THE HOUR.

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#27 OFFLINE   schmack

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:34 AM

What government is censoring the posts here?

Moderation happens to keep this place sane, otherwise it would become just like the wild wild west.


The government isn't the only power to whom the word censorship applies. Any entity with the power to suppress any content for any reason is censoring that content.

Moderating a forum like this can justify close and lock, but not delete.

Or not, whatever, lets not argue.

Edited by schmack, 14 December 2011 - 10:49 AM.


#28 OFFLINE   paja

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:21 AM

DISH gets RT
Comcast gets BBC WORLD NEWS
http://www.nytimes.c...dudKocyiZoDx86w

#29 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 08:04 PM

Moderating a forum like this can justify close and lock, but not delete.

Nope. Moderating can justify any action needed to keep the forum on track. Deleting is a key tool and not deleting something is probably the biggest complaint we get as moderators. Feel free to read the site's User Agreement and PM any moderator if you have any further questions.


As for the topic of this thread, I watched an hour or two when RT was first launched in DISH to see what it was. I did not find it any worse than the Public Interest "Free Speech TV" (9415) that has been on DISH for years. I would prefer BBC World News but with a couple hundred other channels to choose from I'm not forced to watch RT (or FSTV).

#30 OFFLINE   schmack

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:16 AM

Moderating can justify any action needed to keep the forum on track. Deleting is a key tool and not deleting something is probably the biggest complaint we get as moderators.


Nope. I do not doubt that not deleting something is the biggest complaint moderators get. However, that doesn't change the fact that when practiced it is indeed censorship, and *ahem* should not be done. Your attitude in this regard as a forum moderator is exactly what I needed to effectively demonstrate my original point on the subject. Thanks for that, I guess. Core belief here: Free people who enjoy (by rite of blood) freedom of speech should not have that freedom revoked in the name of moderation.

As for RT, I thought it was interesting to watch for ten minutes or so. If you can think for yourself the propaganda level there is astounding to see.

Edited by schmack, 19 December 2011 - 06:40 AM.


#31 OFFLINE   RasputinAXP

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:48 AM

Nope. I do not doubt that not deleting something is the biggest complaint moderators get. However, that doesn't change the fact that when practiced it is indeed censorship, and *ahem* should not be done. Your attitude in this regard as a forum moderator is exactly what I needed to effectively demonstrate my original point on the subject. Thanks for that, I guess. Core belief here: Free people who enjoy (by rite of blood) freedom of speech should not have that freedom revoked in the name of moderation.

As for RT, I thought it was interesting to watch for ten minutes or so. If you can think for yourself the propaganda level there is astounding to see.


THE MODERATORS ARE NOT THE GOVERNMENT. THIS IS NOT CENSORSHIP. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS. I mean, seriously. Your core belief does not entitle you to try and tell a forum moderator on a site you don't own what to do. Pop into your local coffee shop and start screaming obscenities at the top of your lungs and see if your first amendment rights get "trampled on."

Seriously, go start your own satellite forum and run it yourself.

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#32 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 11:34 AM

Rasputin above nailed it... I don't know why this concept always confuses people.

Censorship is when the government intervenes... Everything else is just house rules.

You may have the right to free speech and a gun... But I have the right to forbid you from my home if you bring that gun or speech... You have the right to leave if you do not like the rules in my home.

Think of a web site like this as the web site owner's home... You obey his rules when inside, and that includes his rules on moderating what can be discussed and how it can be discussed. Don't like the rules? Go to another home(forum) or build your own.

Forum moderation is not remotely the same as censorship.

Now back to topic!

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#33 OFFLINE   Orion9

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 01:30 PM

I just looked at a couple of dictionaries and neither made any assertion that a censor had to be working for a government. For example dictionary.com says:

1. an official who examines books, plays, news reports, motion pictures, radio and television programs, letters, cablegrams, etc., for the purpose of suppressing parts deemed objectionable on moral, political, military, or other grounds.
2. any person who supervises the manners or morality of others.
... several more.

My Oxford paper dictionary says that a censor is "a person authorized...." but doesn't say authorized by whom.

So it seems to me that a moderator can be called a censor if he likes.

But the word you chose doesn't change the fact that a site owner will control the site as he wishes.

#34 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 02:58 PM

I suppose if you are technical... Censoring could apply even to one's own self-editing... Do you ever not say something like a curse word in front of your mom or in church? Well, then you may have just censored yourself!

But the larger point when people talk of censorship usually is meant to be something like a government controlling the people by forbidding certain ideas OR sometimes when groups of people want to remove a book from schools.

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#35 OFFLINE   Orion9

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 03:26 PM

Yes, some degree of self-censorship is practiced by just about everyone. And Freud talked about censorship within the mind and dreams.

And then there is the larger form of self-censorship:

http://en.wikipedia....Self-censorship

To get more on topic - some of the stuff that is self-censored by one country's news outlets are likely to be played - or even overplayed! - on another country's news outlets, so a wide variety of sources is probably a good thing.

#36 OFFLINE   TBoneit

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 04:59 PM

Nope. I do not doubt that not deleting something is the biggest complaint moderators get. However, that doesn't change the fact that when practiced it is indeed censorship, and *ahem* should not be done. Your attitude in this regard as a forum moderator is exactly what I needed to effectively demonstrate my original point on the subject. Thanks for that, I guess. Core belief here: Free people who enjoy (by rite of blood) freedom of speech should not have that freedom revoked in the name of moderation.

As for RT, I thought it was interesting to watch for ten minutes or so. If you can think for yourself the propaganda level there is astounding to see.


If you had your way with no deleting the forum would become a wasteland of spam and malicious links. I've seen what happens to a unmoderated forum. The entire content is 10% good 90% garbage.

With no deletion anyone could post anything against the forum rules and they would get kicked off but their garbage would remain.

You have freedom of speech within limits. You do not ever have the right to stand up in in a movie theater and yell fire, fire, run for your life. Or go around saying kill so & so.

These occupy idiots have the right to say what they believe.
They do not have the right to ruin others quality of life or their sleep by making constant noise all night long.
They do not have the right to ruin someones business by driving away customers.
They do not have a right to block public streets without a permit from the city.
They do not have the right to squat on private property.

Freedom of speech has limits it isn't total freedom to say anything..
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#37 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 08:10 PM

And with that said, I'll add this reminder:
This is a satellite discussion forum. We discuss satellite services, channels and channel content. This thread is here to discuss the RT channel added to DISH Network. If anyone wants to continue to discuss moderation you may do so via private messages.

This thread is about RT.
:backtotop

#38 OFFLINE   Chihuahua

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 02:36 PM

I would like to see Dish Network add Al-Jazeera English, BBC World News, and possibly Sky News if that were possible, as mentioned earlier.

#39 OFFLINE   Ray C@DISH Network

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 08:31 AM

I will submit a programming request form to our programming department for the channels you mentioned. Thanks.

I would like to see Dish Network add Al-Jazeera English, BBC World News, and possibly Sky News if that were possible, as mentioned earlier.



#40 OFFLINE   mnassour

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Posted 23 December 2011 - 11:28 PM

OK, I've calmed down now, left for a while, and am back NOT to discuss moderation ;), but rather RT.

The tragedy of RT is that it is marketed by itself and Dishnetwork and a legitimate news channel when one can quickly tell by watching it for no more than ten minutes, that its sole reason for being is to give the world Vladimir Putin's latest party line and to disparage my country unfairly in the eyes of the English-speaking world. Indeed, it reminds me of nothing so much as the German English-language broadcasts during the second World War, technically excellent, but with grotesque content.

As for AJE, well, I can only agree with those up above who now say it is a legitimate news organization for the reasons stated. I have been away from this particular forum for quite a while and apparently missed the firestorm the last request for AJE caused.

Ray C...if you would, please, put my name on the list of those who will switch from DirecTV to Dishnework the day AJE appears on your system. Oh and of course, in HD please! ;)

#41 OFFLINE   jsk

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 08:46 AM

I doubt that Dish is paying anything for this channel and I think it is good for Americans to see what other countries are saying about them. Anyone with half a brain should be able to realize that this is blatant propaganda and should be able to separate the facts from the propaganda.

No one has been complaining about CCTV from the Chinese government. Dish has been carrying them for ever since I became a subscriber. The thing I like about CCTV, is that their news programs contain real news and not much analysis. Yes, I still know that CCTV determines what they will and will not air, but at least I get real facts. Many times, I see more news on CCTV than on CNN, Fox & MSNBC.
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#42 OFFLINE   mnassour

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 09:49 AM

Complete agreement about CCTV. The Chinese are very circumspect. The Russians yell in your face "look how bad you are!"

I would still like to know the process by which RT was added. Whose wagon wheel was greased.....

#43 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 11:51 AM

Every country has propaganda... We do it too, but since we are here, people tend to overlook it. Citizens of the rest of the world don't like some our stereotyping and generalizations of them either!

We also do not really have any unbiased news sources... So I fail to see anything unique or troubling if another country has a biased and inaccurate news channel. It just means they are becoming more like us! :)

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#44 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 12:26 PM

I did put all of your requests in


I would also like BBC WORLD NEWS. It''s on one of our locals here, but it's only on for thirty minutes a day.

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#45 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 12:40 PM

I don't think CNNI is a possibility as IIRC they won't sell it domestically. But BBC World is out there for the asking (and paying for).




....along with Al Jazeera English. :preach:


When I had U-verse in late 2009 they had CNNI.

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#46 OFFLINE   mnassour

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Posted 24 December 2011 - 01:27 PM

Every country has propaganda... We do it too, but since we are here, people tend to overlook it. Citizens of the rest of the world don't like some our stereotyping and generalizations of them either!

We also do not really have any unbiased news sources... So I fail to see anything unique or troubling if another country has a biased and inaccurate news channel. It just means they are becoming more like us! :)


Point well taken, sir!:lol:

I guess the particular burr under my saddle when it comes to RT is that it seems to be not a particular news channel, but rather something that is simply targeted to spread bad news, real or imagined, about the U.S....something on the lines of of the old Radio Moscow (for those of you who remember shortwave).

Like I say, what burns me is that something like this 24/7 slam gets carriage on Dish, while something that I (at least) have to consider considerably more useful and unbiased (AJE) remains left out in the cold.

When I had U-verse in late 2009 they had CNNI.


Well I would certainly like to have them if they're available. I remember watching their feed on the Ku side of my old 10' dish, marveling at how much more I liked it over the domestic CNN.

#47 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 01:26 AM

I have yet to find a news channel that is absolutely unbiased ... they ALL play to the bias of their audience, giving them the news they want to hear (or at least presented in the way they feel the audience wants to hear it). Most throw away any chance of becoming a truly unbiased news source in exchange for better ratings for their network. The channels play to their audiences. Cable news has become a lot more like professional wrestling with characters playing roles (yes Virginia, there is role play in wrestling) instead of simply telling the news.

Biased news is what most of the audience wants ... they just want the bias that matches their opinion. Fortunately we have several different biases to choose from. Perhaps in this world where "Free Speech TV" has been on DISH for years another "truth telling" channel is what the audience wants.

#48 OFFLINE   mnassour

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 05:30 PM

I have yet to find a news channel that is absolutely unbiased ... they ALL play to the bias of their audience, giving them the news they want to hear (or at least presented in the way they feel the audience wants to hear it). <snip>


That's just it, James. RT is NOT a news channel such as Fox, CNN, or AJE. It's sole purpose is to disparage the United States in the eyes of the English-speaking world. Each and every story concerning the U.S. paints us in a negative light. If you have not seen it I urge you...and everyone else here... to go online to http://rt.com/on-air/ and watch their live feed.

I would be thrilled to have an at least semi-impartial news service from Russia. I'd fight for it to be on both systems as I do AJE. But RT is NOT that service.


Cable news has become a lot more like professional wrestling with characters playing roles (yes Virginia, there is role play in wrestling) instead of simply telling the news.


An absolutely brilliant comparison sir. Nailed it!

#49 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 06:44 PM

That's just it, James. RT is NOT a news channel such as Fox, CNN, or AJE. It's sole purpose is to disparage the United States in the eyes of the English-speaking world. Each and every story concerning the U.S. paints us in a negative light.

I have not watched every story on RT. My experience with them is with reporting on other countries, such as the tsunami that hit Japan. With limited experience I feel that it is foolish to judge "every" story about the US to be disparaging. Absolute judgements are troublesome.

If all one has seen on AJE were stories about the US with a negative slant it would be easy to assume that ALL of their US stories were negative. If ALL of AJE's stories about the US had a positive slant I'd be more curious about their motives. There is no way that AJE or any other network operates with no slant at all. It isn't human. With their connection to AJ Arabic (which has a very poor reputation for how they portray the US) there remains a question of motive.

If you have not seen it I urge you...and everyone else here... to go online to http://rt.com/on-air/ and watch their live feed.

Or tune to channel 280 ... it is available to nearly every DISH subscriber (all the AT120 and above packages).

I would be thrilled to have an at least semi-impartial news service ...

Yes. But my point is that impartial is in the eye of the beholder. Pick ANY news network and you will find people who would swear on their mother's grave that the network is impartial. Even though there are others who would certainly not agree. AJE would fall into that category, just like the others.

We got RT ... I would have preferred a channel with a more western bias such as BBC World News or CNN International's English feed but we got RT.

Fortunately RT was placed in the 280's away from the US news channels. It isn't something that people are going to trip over when looking in the 200-211 news range. Just like FSTV on channel 9415 ... if people want that viewpoint they have to go looking for it.

(Now if only we could get CCNEW off of channel 265 and put it on 281. It doesn't belong with the religious channels.)

#50 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 07:12 PM

It's sole purpose is to disparage the United States in the eyes of the English-speaking world. Each and every story concerning the U.S. paints us in a negative light.


You wouldn't be Frank Stallone would you?

Did you ever think that not everyone in the world in impressed with U.S. policies and that they don't have to buy into your way of thinking?

Did you ever think that maybe RT's 'slant' is more accurate than say ... Fox's?
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