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Repeated SWiM failures

technical swm8

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43 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 11:44 AM

yes there are 4 splitters off the wires out of the dish. My four (one from each) go into the SWM. The other 4 (one from each) run directly into his condo, so I don't know what is on the other end.


What kind of splitters are used here (power passing on one leg, diode steered, etc?) If they're power passing on one leg, who is supplying the power (you or the neighbor?) It would also be helpful to know what the neighbor has connected to their four lines.
SL3-Slimline to SWM16 - DECA
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#27 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 11:52 AM

also I would get a polization locker (put it before the splitters that split the 2 locations) and ensure that he has some multiswitch


The SWM8 is a polarity locker. The more important question is the type of splitters used at the dish to see "who" is really powering the LNB.
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#28 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 11:56 AM

The SWM8 is a polarity locker. The more important question is the type of splitters used at the dish to see "who" is really powering the LNB.


however
the 4x 2way splitters are inbetween the dish and the SWM8 so if the switch or whatever the neighbor has is calling for a differant polarity than the SWM8 on one coax then there could be issues, unless the 4x 2ways are such that and polarity change from the neighbor would be blocked

it looks like you've missed parts of the thread

the SWM8 is only for the OP's stuff so he's powering it
then there are 4 coaxes going to the nieghbor in parralel to the swm8 to unknown setup

#29 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:05 PM

...it looks like you've missed parts of the thread...


I haven't missed anything ;) and a polarity locker does not need to go "before the splitters..."

The important question is the type of splitters, and where the power passing port is located. If the SWM8 is on the power passing ports then it's irrellevent what the neighbor's receivers are "calling" for (as the SWM8 is functioning as the polarity locker.) It is imortant to know what "switch" the neighbor is using as well.
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#30 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:10 PM

however...

Reading the OP's first post "suggests" this has been working fine for years, so the four coax have been "matched" or there would have been tuning problems long ago.
A.K.A VOS

#31 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:15 PM

ok
well still looks to me that the coax is getting wrongly used as a ground bond between homes

a proper grounding bond should be put in to ensure that the grounds are leveled and that differant ground voltage isn't causing current on the coax

#32 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:20 PM

ok
well still looks to me that the coax is getting wrongly used as a ground bond between homes

a proper grounding bond should be put in to ensure that the grounds are leveled and that differant ground voltage isn't causing current on the coax

This is kind of the problem with the internet. [not blaming you at all].
We don't know squat about what is really going on, yet we all try to offer help "blindly".
A.K.A VOS

#33 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:25 PM

ok
well still looks to me that the coax is getting wrongly used as a ground bond between homes

a proper grounding bond should be put in to ensure that the grounds are leveled and that differant ground voltage isn't causing current on the coax


"It's possible", but how did you come to that conclusion? It doesn't appear that the OP has a ground connection on his side, and the coax shield is not tied to the receiver electrical plug (unless it's a three prong); thus the coax is likely not tied to electrical ground on OP's side. If that's the case, the coax is not being utilized as a ground bond between homes. We'd really need more info on the complete system setup before deciding to bond the ground connections...
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#34 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:30 PM

from what he's said

1. its not grounded
2. 2 homes are using the same dish

2 homes are each going to have differant ground voltages (although ground is looked at as 0 its only relative and 2 differant grounds when connected to each other can have current between them)

as it only happens in the really cold, when air is thus drier and static charges can build up more, it might be the issue

I know I'd talked to someone before that was long ago running networking cable between buildings at a college and on connecting a cable to a transiver it arced and blew out the transciver (the solution as fiber was not common yet) was to drive in a ton of ground rods and bond the buildings together, thus why its not code to connect non-power connections between buildings (there might be some distance spec in there)

so having low voltage cableing linking 2 buildings without electricaly bonding their grounds your asking for trouble as the ground current might be low volt very high amp power and can fry things

sure its possible the grounding issue isn't the cause but with such a major code violation that has the ability to fry things it should be fixed and it might solve the problem or narrow down the causes

#35 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:32 PM

"It's possible", but how did you come to that conclusion? It doesn't appear that the OP has a ground connection on his side, and the coax shield is not tied to the receiver electrical plug (unless it's a three prong); thus the coax is likely not tied to electrical ground on OP's side. If that's the case, the coax is not being utilized as a ground bond between homes. We'd really need more info on the complete system setup before deciding to bond the ground connections...


its not grounded as far as we know its not grounded at the nieghbor's ether

so the coax could be finding any number of paths to ground none of which are good without having a safe path

#36 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:34 PM

It could be due to sun spots too for all we know.

Guys, it time to take a step back and wait cause you all don't know nothin. ;)
A.K.A VOS

#37 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:38 PM

from what he's said

1. its not grounded
2. 2 homes are using the same dish

2 homes are each going to have differant ground voltages


Ugghh...this is turning into a grounding thread....

I think you missed my point. The OP's side isn't grounded, so the coax isn't bonding the two homes together. The coaxial shielding is not tied to an electrical ground point in the receiver. In closing; one neighbor should ground dish, and this will be sufficient (and not cause problems between homes.)
SL3-Slimline to SWM16 - DECA
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#38 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:39 PM

so the coax could be finding any number of paths to ground none of which are good without having a safe path


Where are these ground paths?
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#39 OFFLINE   dsw2112

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:40 PM

It could be due to sun spots too for all we know.

Guys, it time to take a step back and wait cause you all don't know nothin. ;)


Yep, there's a lot that's unkown. Just trying to figure out how an ungrounded coax can be an electrical bond between homes :lol:
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#40 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:45 PM

Ugghh...this is turning into a grounding thread....

I think you missed my point. The OP's side isn't grounded, so the coax isn't bonding the two homes together. The coaxial shielding is not tied to an electrical ground point in the receiver. In closing; one neighbor should ground dish, and this will be sufficient (and not cause problems between homes.)


and possibily have a TV provide a bond that shouldn't be?
grounding one side would remove the static build up but then your left with current on the sheild

#41 OFFLINE   DarkLogix

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:51 PM

Where are these ground paths?


anything that has an electrical link that reaches the coax sheild
TV's, a person's hand touching the case of a reciver, anything that makes contact with the ground of a reciver (HDMI cables, other connection cables

its fully possible that the splitter is dieing but saving everything else

a code violation is a code violation and having another home's ground in your home and still thinking of them as ground is just going to lead to something bad

do it right or expect problems, and the right way is a ground block at one of the (or both) homes and bonding the ground rods

#42 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:59 PM

its fully possible that...

This thread has lost any usefulness to the OP too.
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#43 OFFLINE   bdodds

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Posted 23 December 2011 - 03:27 PM

Quick update. The temp dropped to 25 degrees and I had problems with signal strength on rec 1 tuner 1 (my normal place for problems). signal strength was 75 to 88 on different transponders, where the signal strength we 96+ during warmer weather. I did notice that no one was bitting on my cold weather theory. I replaced the splitter off the PI with a directv approved MRV green lable splitter and all is right with the world again.

I was using a Holland HFS-2D 5-2150 MHz diode steered splitter. Could this have been my problem all along. The splitter and PI are in my equipment closet and enviromentally controlled. There is still some direct correlation with the outside tempature and signal strength on my recievers.

I purchased a new green labled PI and SWM8 and will install them later, but I want to let this run and see if my problem reappears.

#44 OFFLINE   bdodds

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Posted 02 January 2012 - 11:06 AM

Quick update: Just got back home the the problem is back (and worse as measured by signal strength). BTW. Temp is much colder. I'm going to replace the PI today and see if there is any improvement. Replace the SWM8 later. just trying to step through to isolate the problem.

I'm going to call my electrician to provide me a grounding wire on the roof.

Let everyone know what I discover. And thanks again for the contribution.

BTW, I'm surprised that no one (many installers and myself) didn't notice the lack of grounding earlier.





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