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HR34 Error 47 (was CCK Weak Connectivity)


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#26 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 12:03 PM

Sorry to high jack your thread. I noticed the other thread poped up right after this one.

Which way does the HR34 go? 40 or 50 for too much?

This will all get standardized in up coming software, but "for now" if the PHY levels are -xx, they are the lower limits, and if they don't have the minus sign, they are the upper limits.
A.K.A VOS

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#27 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 01:18 PM

Sorry to high jack your thread. I noticed the other thread poped up right after this one.

Which way does the HR34 go? 40 or 50 for too much?


I am not sure what you mean here?

#28 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 01:23 PM

Changing from 8-ways to 4-ways changes the DECA loss [for the green labeled splitters] from -14 to -11 dB.


Is this something I should do or is there a better option to better my system?

#29 OFFLINE   LoweBoy

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 01:47 PM

I was asking VOS. None of what I asked really pertained to your specific issues. I was looking for the limits of the coax testing.
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#30 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 01:57 PM

I was asking VOS. None of what I asked really pertained to your specific issues. I was looking for the limits of the coax testing.


Thanks. Just at a loss on what to do. Not sure if my setup is correct or not. If it is finding out how to increase performance. Thanks

#31 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 02:23 PM

Is this something I should do or is there a better option to better my system?


Thanks. Just at a loss on what to do. Not sure if my setup is correct or not. If it is finding out how to increase performance. Thanks

I'm currently waiting to see more of your setup, because I can suggest what changes you should make. Yes changing over to 4-ways looks like something that will help, but if this only changes your 57 to 54, you still aren't in a range that I would be happy with.
A.K.A VOS

#32 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 02:43 PM

I'm currently waiting to see more of your setup, because I can suggest what changes you should make. Yes changing over to 4-ways looks like something that will help, but if this only changes your 57 to 54, you still aren't in a range that I would be happy with.


What else in my setup do you need to see? I posted a number of additional pictures earlier and hoped that was enough.

If that is not the case let me know what else I need to provide and will do it. Thanks.

#33 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 02:46 PM

What else in my setup do you need to see? I posted a number of additional pictures earlier and hoped that was enough.

If that is not the case let me know what else I need to provide and will do it. Thanks.


I am referring to my 12:24 post with additional pics and detail

#34 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:04 PM

Here are some more pictures.


The splitters have 3 connections to each. Still not sure exactly why there are 3 connections to each as I only have 5 boxes.

Hope this helps, if you need something else, let me know.


I couldnt tell from the size of the picture, but what are the three coax cables just hanging unconnected for? And looking at the splitters, do they have terminating caps on them or are they just open coax connectors? Cant really see that well.

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#35 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:16 PM

Here are some more pictures.

1. Another picture of gutter area
2. 2 cables going down wall.
3. Connection on house
4. 4 wires going into house
5. 4 wires from house are connected to the 4 slots on top of swim 16
6. The 3 cables on left side of swim 16 (see previous pictures) are connected into the 2 green splitters and 1 power adapter.

The splitters have 3 connections to each. Still not sure exactly why there are 3 connections to each as I only have 5 boxes.

Hope this helps, if you need something else, let me know.

For "some reason" [we both posted at the same minute] I didn't see these were posted until now. :shrug:

I see two things that could be "improved":
1) there are way too many open ports on those splitters. All used ports should have terminations on them.
2) you have no need/use for 8-way splitters, so changing to a 2-way on one side and a 4-way on the other will improve your loss.
Since you have "5 boxes", you should have five coax runs from the splitters, which it looks like you have.
How is your CCK currently connected? Is there another splitter connected to it?
A.K.A VOS

#36 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:19 PM

I couldnt tell from the size of the picture, but what are the three coax cables just hanging unconnected for? And looking at the splitters, do they have terminating caps on them or are they just open coax connectors? Cant really see that well.


There are 4 cables not connected. I have 2 other rooms that are cabled but do not have boxes. They were originally connected to my zinwell 16 but the tech disconnected as they are not being used.

On the 2 8 way splitters, the 5 empty slots do not have anything covering them. Is this what you are referring to? Thanks.

#37 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:21 PM

On the 2 8 way splitters, the 5 empty slots do not have anything covering them. Is this what you are referring to? Thanks.


Yes. Every unused connector on the splitter(s) need a 75 ohm terminating resistor screwed onto them.

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#38 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:26 PM

For "some reason" [we both posted at the same minute] I didn't see these were posted until now. :shrug:

I see two things that could be "improved":
1) there are way too many open ports on those splitters. All used ports should have terminations on them.
2) you have no need/use for 8-way splitters, so changing to a 2-way on one side and a 4-way on the other will improve your loss.
Since you have "5 boxes", you should have five coax runs from the splitters, which it looks like you have.
How is your CCK currently connected? Is there another splitter connected to it?


To respond to your comments.

1. It seems like the tech should have put terminating resistor onto each empty port. Where do I purchase these?

2. There are 6 cables connected, 3 on each side. I am not sure what the 6th is for as I only have 5 boxes. What kind of 2 and 4 way connectors should I get? If I get a 2 and 4, and since there are 3 on each now, how do I know which 1 cable to move to the 4 when I purchase it?

The CCK is connected wirelessly to my hr20 in my house. There are 2 cabled connections from the hr20 to the WCCK.

Thanks again for all your help, I really appreciate it.

Jim

#39 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:34 PM

To respond to your comments.

1. It seems like the tech should have put terminating resistor onto each empty port. Where do I purchase these?

2. There are 6 cables connected, 3 on each side. I am not sure what the 6th is for as I only have 5 boxes. What kind of 2 and 4 way connectors should I get? If I get a 2 and 4, and since there are 3 on each now, how do I know which 1 cable to move to the 4 when I purchase it?

The CCK is connected wirelessly to my hr20 in my house. There are 2 cabled connections from the hr20 to the WCCK.

Thanks again for all your help, I really appreciate it.

Jim

Not quite sure what you mean by this "but" you shouldn't be connecting the CCK wirelessly to your HR20 [at all] and I hope that the count at the splitters, is five coax to receivers, and one to the CCK.
Terminators can be bought most places that have this [home depot/lowes, radioshack, etc.]
The green labeled splitters are a bit harder to find. Solid Signal is one place, but your "tech" should be providing them.
From what "I can figure" [through the internet] changing over to a 2-way on one leg with the HR34 and another receiver [DVR] and a 4-way on the other leg, for the CCK and the rest of your receivers, is the best option and will drop your loss down to within range. I'd expect high forties to low fifties, after making these changes.
A.K.A VOS

#40 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:39 PM

Not quite sure what you mean by this "but" I'd now guess that the count at the splitters, is five coax to receivers, and one to the CCK.
Terminators can be bought most places that have this [home depot/lowes, radioshack, etc.]
The green labeled splitters are a bit harder to find. Solid Signal is one place, but your "tech" should be providing them.
From what "I can figure" [through the internet] changing over to a 2-way on one leg with the HR34 and another receiver [DVR] and a 4-way on the other leg, for the CCK and the rest of your receivers, is the best option and will drop your loss down to within range. I'd expect high forties to low fifties, after making these changes.


I did find the 2 way and 4 way splitters at Solid Signal which I can purchase. I am not real skilled at this but how do I figure out which boxes are on each one. I assume, if I turn on all the tv's, disconnect one and whatever tv goes out, that is that one? Probably should figure out a way to label them for future reference.

If I do this, I will not need any terminating caps. If I used two 4 ways would that make much difference? The reason I ask is that I may be adding another receiver in the near future? Not sure at this point when, but that may happen.

Thanks again.

Jim

#41 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 03:49 PM

I did find the 2 way and 4 way splitters at Solid Signal which I can purchase. I am not real skilled at this but how do I figure out which boxes are on each one. I assume, if I turn on all the tv's, disconnect one and whatever tv goes out, that is that one? Probably should figure out a way to label them for future reference.

If I do this, I will not need any terminating caps. If I used two 4 ways would that make much difference? The reason I ask is that I may be adding another receiver in the near future? Not sure at this point when, but that may happen.

Thanks again.

Jim

Think you answered your own question "lots of running around" :lol:
As to "maybe" adding another receiver, there are at least a couple of ways to do this.
Since your current loss is so high, I would first want to address this.
Does your CCK have two coax ports?
If so, then it can be configured in a pass through mode, so it doesn't require a coax for itself, but can be inline with a receiver. I'm currently doing this with mine.
If it doesn't have two, then it isn't a wireless CCK, but if/when you need to add another receiver, I would use a second 2-way splitter and connect it to the 2-way splitter you may get now. I'd still keep the HR34 on the first splitter, run another receiver & CCK off the second splitter. This way, the HR34 has the least loss, the double splitter is no more than a 4-way, but this would only effect the receiver connected to it, and all the others on the "other side" wouldn't be affected at all.
A.K.A VOS

#42 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 04:30 PM

Think you answered your own question "lots of running around" :lol:
As to "maybe" adding another receiver, there are at least a couple of ways to do this.
Since your current loss is so high, I would first want to address this.
Does your CCK have two coax ports?
If so, then it can be configured in a pass through mode, so it doesn't require a coax for itself, but can be inline with a receiver. I'm currently doing this with mine.
If it doesn't have two, then it isn't a wireless CCK, but if/when you need to add another receiver, I would use a second 2-way splitter and connect it to the 2-way splitter you may get now. I'd still keep the HR34 on the first splitter, run another receiver & CCK off the second splitter. This way, the HR34 has the least loss, the double splitter is no more than a 4-way, but this would only effect the receiver connected to it, and all the others on the "other side" wouldn't be affected at all.


I looked at the CCK and there are two ports and two wires connected to the back. One is thicker and one is thinner. The thinner one is connected to the deca. The other end of the deca has a coax going into the receiver and then an ethernet going from the deca into the receiver also.

Another thing that may be a problem is that the other coax that connects into the deca goes into my surge protector. There are a total of 4 coax going into my surge protector, not sure what they all are.

This is an hr20-700. Is this connected properly with the deca and cck?

Is there a diagram how the hr20-700 with deca and cck should be connected? I am wondering if this is done incorrectly?

Jim

#43 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 05:04 PM

I looked at the CCK and there are two ports and two wires connected to the back. One is thicker and one is thinner. The thinner one is connected to the deca. The other end of the deca has a coax going into the receiver and then an ethernet going from the deca into the receiver also.

Another thing that may be a problem is that the other coax that connects into the deca goes into my surge protector. There are a total of 4 coax going into my surge protector, not sure what they all are.

This is an hr20-700. Is this connected properly with the deca and cck?

Is there a diagram how the hr20-700 with deca and cck should be connected? I am wondering if this is done incorrectly?

Jim

So don't connect any of the DirecTV coax through a surge protector.
At the HR20, it isn't connected "as well as" it could. It needs to have a filter between the DECA and the HR20, but "better yet" it should have its own white DECA, and not be sharing the CCK.
Now this brings up: why or where does the sixth coax go from the splitters?

This is how the CCK & HR20-700 should look:
http://www.dbstalk.c...=1&d=1311788989
A.K.A VOS

#44 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 05:14 PM

So don't connect any of the DirecTV coax through a surge protector.
At the HR20, it isn't connected "as well as" it could. It needs to have a filter between the DECA and the HR20, but "better yet" it should have its own white DECA, and not be sharing the CCK.
Now this brings up: why or where does the sixth coax go from the splitters?

This is how the CCK & HR20-700 should look:
http://www.dbstalk.c...=1&d=1311788989


Good question, isn't it. I guess I can take them out one by one and see if it has any effect on the boxes? That would be one way. Any other thoughts?

On getting the hr20-700 connected properly with the deca and cck. I will disconnect everything from the surge protector but how do you suggest I get this connected properly? I don't have a white deca or filter? I also noticed on the white deca that the link button is amber with the other two green. Not sure what that means.

#45 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 05:21 PM

I also noticed on the white deca that the link button is amber with the other two green. Not sure what that means.

I do and it ain't good.
You really need to sort out all of this cabling.
The amber cLink LED is because you have reduced RF performance on the DECA. This can come from: too much noise, and/or too low a signal level.
A.K.A VOS

#46 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 06:18 PM

I do and it ain't good.
You really need to sort out all of this cabling.
The amber cLink LED is because you have reduced RF performance on the DECA. This can come from: too much noise, and/or too low a signal level.


I went through and disconnected all 6 of the coax connected into the splitters. When I removed 5 of them, I received a 771 error, which means that cord went to that box. The 6th one didn't do that to any box. However, with the 6th one disconnected, I ran info and test and received an error that swim was not available because there is not enough tuners. I connected the 6th one back in and we are back to normal. So, I still don't understand what the 6th one is for? It did not disconnect the cck either.

On the cck, the light is mostly green but on occasion it goes to amber.

Not sure what to do at this point? I will get the 2 way and 4 way but when I separate the 5 boxes as you state below, the 6th one, which splitter should it go on? I assume, the one with the 3 other boxes? Since there are 8 connections now, there are 3 on each. If I go to 2 and 4, one has to go off the one where there will be two. Confused yet?

Anyway, I am confused. Thoughts?

#47 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 06:58 PM

I went through and disconnected all 6 of the coax connected into the splitters. When I removed 5 of them, I received a 771 error, which means that cord went to that box. The 6th one didn't do that to any box. However, with the 6th one disconnected, I ran info and test and received an error that swim was not available because there is not enough tuners. I connected the 6th one back in and we are back to normal. So, I still don't understand what the 6th one is for? It did not disconnect the cck either.

On the cck, the light is mostly green but on occasion it goes to amber.

Not sure what to do at this point? I will get the 2 way and 4 way but when I separate the 5 boxes as you state below, the 6th one, which splitter should it go on? I assume, the one with the 3 other boxes? Since there are 8 connections now, there are 3 on each. If I go to 2 and 4, one has to go off the one where there will be two. Confused yet?

Anyway, I am confused. Thoughts?

There is something fishy here.
At first I expected it to have been from the PI, but checking your photo, shows you're using the PWR connector for the PI.
Disconnecting any of the coax, should have given you what you saw on the first five, or nothing at all. There is nothing that can be connected to a splitter that enables tuners, and if not connected disables them.
The PI is the closest thing, but if it was disconnected 771a messages will show.
I would like to see this repeated and more info for exactly what this message is.
A.K.A VOS

#48 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 07:13 PM

How about some more photos of the cables at the splitters?

It kind of looks like the PI is connected to the one on the right, which then brings up the question of what's connected to the SWiM-16's middle connector?
A.K.A VOS

#49 OFFLINE   jimlenz

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 07:33 PM

I unplugged the 6th coax and ran info and test on all 5 receivers. I did not receive the error regarding swim not aviailable due to not enough connections. However, what I did was reset one of the dvr's and it would not connect. When it go to step 2, it was searching for signal. When I plugged the 6th one in, it was able to connect, no problem.

I took a few more pictures for you. The power inverter is connected to the 'middle' outlet on the swim 16, not to either of the splitters. I did follow the coax to make sure where it was connected.

Disregard all the non-connected wires. Is there something I should be doing with these? Caps or just leave as is.

Talk about confusing. I do know that when I disconnected the other 5 coax cables from the splitters, one of the boxes did not work properly, it was giving the 771 error.

Anyway, I did order the new splitters from solid signal, should get them later in the week and will install.

Let me know if you have any other thoughts.

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#50 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 08:38 PM

I unplugged the 6th coax and ran info and test on all 5 receivers. I did not receive the error regarding swim not aviailable due to not enough connections. However, what I did was reset one of the dvr's and it would not connect. When it go to step 2, it was searching for signal. When I plugged the 6th one in, it was able to connect, no problem.

I took a few more pictures for you. The power inverter is connected to the 'middle' outlet on the swim 16, not to either of the splitters. I did follow the coax to make sure where it was connected.

Disregard all the non-connected wires. Is there something I should be doing with these? Caps or just leave as is.

Talk about confusing. I do know that when I disconnected the other 5 coax cables from the splitters, one of the boxes did not work properly, it was giving the 771 error.

Anyway, I did order the new splitters from solid signal, should get them later in the week and will install.

Let me know if you have any other thoughts.

Sorry, but there still must be a mix up here.
The two shots of the SWiM-16 & splitters look identical to what was posted before and they look to even have the same labels.

The PI on the right sure looks like it run to the first port on the splitter on the right.
If this is what is going on, then this makes sense: "However, what I did was reset one of the dvr's and it would not connect. When it go to step 2, it was searching for signal. When I plugged the 6th one in, it was able to connect, no problem."
You must be running the PI through this "sixth" coax.

If in doubt, pull the power cord on the PI and then check your receivers.
Even with this sixth coax connected "I bet" you'll what happens with it removed.
A.K.A VOS




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