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How to hook up speakers


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42 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 09:15 PM

Ok, I was thinking of hooking up two bookshelf speakers (Klipsch KB-15s) on each side of the entertainment center, rather than just the one pair I have now.

My amp is a Denon. It specs Speaker A,B as 6-16 ohms, and Speaker A+B as 12-16 ohms. It recommends not using speakers with a lower rating (ex 4 ohms) at high volumes for long periods due to overheating.

So, the speakers are rated: NOMINAL IMPEDANCE: 8 ohms compatible

So, if you were to hook two up per side, how would you wire it?

Both on Speaker A in series (16 ohms): Amp + to Speaker1 +, Speaker1 - to speaker2 +, speaker2 - to amp -

Both on Speaker A in Parallel (4 ohms): Amp 1 to speaker1 and speaker2 +. Amp - to speaker1 and speaker2 -

One on each Speaker A and Speaker B...(Which I think would be the same as hooking both up to SpeakerA in parallel...i.e. 4 ohms.

Amp power is 75W/ch at 8 ohms, 110W/ch at 4 ohms, and no rating for 16 ohms. Each speaker is rated at 85W/ch.

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#2 OFFLINE   ke3ju

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 10:03 AM

I would go with "One on each Speaker A and Speaker B...", as then you have the option of turning either set on or off, and the option of having both sets on (4 ohms) to pull the most power out of your amp.
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#3 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 10:20 AM

You should be OK hooking them up in parallel. If the amp runs hot to the touch - warm is fine - or if it shuts down, then you'll have to try another option.

Impedance is not a set thing. It varies with frequency. Many manufacturers play fast and loose with their impedance ratings. I rarely trust them.
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#4 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 11:30 AM

I highly recommend wiring one pair to the A leads and the other pair to the B leads..That way you can listen to either pair or both pairs, and can shut one pair or the other down possibly with the remote....dont know why you would want have 2 sets of speakers set up next to each other though..quite puzzling that one? That Denon is probably one of the lower end models as its only rated at 75wpc....I have a 2809CI which is a great headend but I'm getting ready to add a Rotel RMB-1575 for some real power...

#5 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 01:06 PM

Why would you want two speakers on each side of your entertainment center? The major amount of audio in any program source would be from the center channel. You haven't said what your system configuration is, but if you're looking for better performance from your system, I'd recommend upgrading the center channel and if your bass is weak, upgrading your subwoofer.. Of course, you could always add a pair of KB-15's as presence speakers if your Denon supports them.

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Family Room: Sony KDFE-55A20 55" LCD RPTV; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVoRoamio Plus, LG BH200 HD DVD/Blu-ray player via HDMI to AVR
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#6 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 11:06 AM

Having 2 pairs of speakers side by side can definitely ruin the sound stage and imaging...not something I would ever do either...but I try not to cast dispersions on other people's setups....even when they are wrong:lol:

#7 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 11:21 AM

I have a small living room. The speakers are about 6 feet apart. I was going to angle one set toward the middle of the room, and the other set toward the side walls (kinda like the bose speakers do) to see if it would give me more "width".

I dont use the center channel or rears for music, but do have a 100W Polk sub with the crossover set at 100hz.

The Denon is a AVR-687. I currently have two fronts (Klipsch), a center (Optimus), and two rear surrounds (Pioneer bookshelf speakers on the floor behind the sofa). The amp has outputs for two "side speakers" as well (7.1), but I have never hooked anything to those, because I have no sources for 7.1 surround, no any room to practically mount them in my living room which is only 12x14 with 3 doorways in it.

I am open to suggestions... Replace the center channel with one of the KB-15's? Replace the rear surrounds with the KB-15s? Try to figure out how to put them on the sides of the room for 7.1? Just keep em in the box :) ?

Thanks for the tips so far. Will be making notes.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#8 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 04:39 PM

Your center channel speaker may or may not be used normally for music, depending on the surround mode selected. Not being familiar with Denon receivers, I won't comment further :D
However, I'd reiterate--don't try to use 2 pairs of speakers for fronts -- ever.
Rather, arrange your front speakers according to the manufacturer's suggested spacing. Normally, your front speakers should be placed equally from the side walls. Paradigm suggests they be spaced apart equal to 3/4 the distance from the listening position. Another recommendation is that the speakers and listener position form an equilateral triangle ( distance from listening position to each speaker and distance between speakers should be equal).

Charlie
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Family Room: Sony KDFE-55A20 55" LCD RPTV; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVoRoamio Plus, LG BH200 HD DVD/Blu-ray player via HDMI to AVR
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#9 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 04:39 PM

I have a small living room. The speakers are about 6 feet apart. I was going to angle one set toward the middle of the room, and the other set toward the side walls (kinda like the bose speakers do) to see if it would give me more "width".

I dont use the center channel or rears for music, but do have a 100W Polk sub with the crossover set at 100hz.

The Denon is a AVR-687. I currently have two fronts (Klipsch), a center (Optimus), and two rear surrounds (Pioneer bookshelf speakers on the floor behind the sofa). The amp has outputs for two "side speakers" as well (7.1), but I have never hooked anything to those, because I have no sources for 7.1 surround, no any room to practically mount them in my living room which is only 12x14 with 3 doorways in it.

I am open to suggestions... Replace the center channel with one of the KB-15's? Replace the rear surrounds with the KB-15s? Try to figure out how to put them on the sides of the room for 7.1? Just keep em in the box :) ?

Thanks for the tips so far. Will be making notes.


Think about investing in a better pair of front speakers and center channel...that is how you can get more width, or in audio terms, a better soundstage...

#10 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 05:03 PM

Think about investing in a better pair of front speakers and center channel...that is how you can get more width, or in audio terms, a better soundstage...


As you can see from the attached picture, which is wall left to wall right, there isnt much space in my little house for any bigger speakers, or taller ones.

Sorry about the crappy standard def picture on the TV, but thats the best Directv gives me on my favorite channel :)

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Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#11 OFFLINE   TXD16

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 06:58 PM

As you can see from the attached picture, which is wall left to wall right, there isnt much space in my little house for any bigger speakers, or taller ones.

Sorry about the crappy standard def picture on the TV, but thats the best Directv gives me on my favorite channel :)


From your picture, your speakers all look fine, but I think you'd get a little better sound if you moved the center kitty a little to the left. :lol:

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#12 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 07:12 PM

From your picture, your speakers all look fine, but I think you'd get a little better sound if you moved the center kitty a little to the left. :lol:


You laugh, but she likes the warmth from the amp. That cost me having to move the 60" TV from its stand, to a wall mount about 12" higher, so she wouldnt block the screen :)

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#13 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 08:06 PM

Your center speaker should be where the cat is....:lol:

#14 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 12:51 AM

Your center speaker should be where the cat is....:lol:


Yep. Ive been reading (amid all the arguing) over on AVSForum, and the conclusion I have come to is #1, you are precisely correct, and #2, ONE of the KB-15 Klipsch speakers should be the center channel speaker, since the consensus over there is all THREE speakers SHOULD be identical, and using special "horizontal" center channel speakers is really more to accommodate the ease of placement, than the sound.

SO I replaced the Optimus Center channel speaker (89 db SPL) with a KB-15 (93 db SPL) and reset the amp so all three speakers were set to -0 db.

It sounds much better now. The Optimus did not have very good highs at all, and soundtracks sounded kind of "muffled". Now, they sound much better.

Unfortunately, that leaves me one spare KB-15. Oh well, better than using two per channel like I was planning on :)

Since they also said the speaker should be on the vertical axis (I seriously doubt I will hear the difference with that one speaker being on its side, or set vertically, I am going to roll out the entertainment cabinet tomorrow, and rearrange the Amp and some other components to see if I can get the speaker in there vertically right UNDER the cat :) The cabinet and components need to be vacuumed and cleaned anyway, and I need to remove the Tivo series 3 on the left side bottom, since Im not using it anyway right now. Can probably get rid of the DVD Recorder as well, since I dont record on it, and the PS3 can play DVD and Blu Ray.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#15 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 07:25 AM

You're moving in the right direction. Given that you have doors on both sides of your installation, you are limited regarding front speaker placement. It ould be ideal if you were able to place your left and right speakers either side of your TV, but that doesn't seem possible.Now that you're using one of your KB-15's for center channel, I agree with the folks over at AVSforum that it should be vertical. If you had a speaker specifically designed for center channel use, it should be horizontally oriented, since in all probability it would have 2 symmetrically positioned speakers, usually 5 inches or more in diameter, with a tweeter centered between the two.. And, yes, the center should be up high, where the kitty is. :D If your Denon doesn't have automatic speaker balancing, it would prove helpful if you wwere do have a sound level meter to assist in the task

Charlie
--------------------

Family Room: Sony KDFE-55A20 55" LCD RPTV; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVoRoamio Plus, LG BH200 HD DVD/Blu-ray player via HDMI to AVR
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#16 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 07:46 AM

Davenlr, don't get ruled by orthodoxy. There may the be best way to do something and then there is the realistic way to do something. Yes, tweeters do have dispersion patterns. Yes, they often want to beam more sideways than up and down. But your center channel is much closer to the floor than the side speakers. The center speaker's location will make a bigger difference in its sound than the properties of the tweeter. With the center closer to the floor, besides adding up to 3 dB to its bass output, the treble is more likely to bounce off the floor back to your ears. That will color the speaker's sound more than the tweeter's dispersion pattern.

Leave your center speaker where it is. It's a real world. I wouldn't rearrange your system, and rearrange your cat, unless you really want to redo your hardware. Even then, set everything up the way the cat and you like it. I have deliberately left an amp available for a cat to sleep on many times.

And as for your extra speaker, there is really no difference between 6.1 and 7.1 surround sound system. The rear center speakers in a 7.1 system are in mono, so a 6.1 surround system with a single center rear speaker is really the same thing. I think you are on your way to a 6.1 surround sound system.

Edited by Carl Spock, 19 February 2012 - 07:53 AM.

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#17 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 08:27 AM

And as for your extra speaker, there is really no difference between 6.1 and 7.1 surround sound system. The rear center speakers in a 7.1 system are in mono, so a 6.1 surround system with a single center rear speaker is really the same thing. I think you are on your way to a 6.1 surround sound system.


OK. So I run a third speaker wire under the house from the media closet to the back of the couch, hook the two current speakers up as the side stereo surround speakers, and move them forward from the corners a bit, then add the KB15 centered behind the couch, correct?

Since all my sources are 5.1, does the amp just not send anything out on the two sides when playing 5.1 material? I think the only 7.1 stuff I have is maybe a couple blu-ray discs.

Cholly: The Denon has auto speaker leveling.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#18 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 08:40 AM

You'd need a 6.1 or 7.1 amp to provide the rear center information, with different Dolby Digital surround processor. That would be in the next amp you'd buy. Put the speaker in the back of a closet for now.

These amps are capable of synthesizing the rear center information from 5.1 sources. It's not as good as a discrete 6.1/7.1 source but it's better than nothing.
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#19 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 08:57 AM

You'd need a 6.1 or 7.1 amp to provide the rear center information, with different Dolby Digital surround processor. That would be in the next amp you'd buy. Put the speaker in the back of a closet for now.

These amps are capable of synthesizing the rear center information from 5.1 sources. It's not as good as a discrete 6.1/7.1 source but it's better than nothing.


My current amp is a 7.1 amp. I just never hooked anything to the "side" outputs.

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#20 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 09:28 AM

Well, there you go.

Hook up the surrounds to the side outputs and the extra speaker to one of the center ones.
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