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The official Mac vs PC thread


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126 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 12:51 AM

Yes, I do. And yet I manage to get Windows to work as I want. And I don't mind using IE9. I have been able to get all my old software to work well. I'm probably not as adventurous or demanding in what I do, but I seem to have found tricks over the years that most of my colleagues and students who I'm always told "grew up using computers" never seem to know.


I'm not a PC/Windows hater... To be fair, the main reason I went back to PC from Mac many years ago was that it was harder to use Terminal in the Mac O/S and you had no choice but to but into a windows environment. I miss the old days of booting to DOS and then choosing to run Windows.

But... around the time Microsoft made DOS Prompt the alternate mode... and then basically reduced it to a shadow of its former self... the differences in the Mac O/S and Windows weren't as great... and with a little poking around I find I can do pretty much the same stuff on my Mac as I could under Windows.

I have asked about this, and according to people I know who own iPods, they aren't able to use anything except iTunes for their music on (at least older) Apple products. Perhaps these are the people who shouldn't be using computers? :D I trusted them when they said I couldn't put all my music from my computer to anything i___.


Yeah, that was a mixed bag of inaccurate and perhaps old advice. WinAMP even makes their MP3 player for the Mac now, though I haven't tried it out yet.

I use VLC Media player rather than QuickTime to play video because VLC supports way more media formats, including the bulk of my old Windows format videos

iTunes grows on you with the Mac... but as a PC user I honestly wouldn't use it there either. Apple doesn't really have as good of support for Windows for Quicktime and iTunes as they do on the Mac. Probably a purposeful thing.

No Kool-aid for years in my house. :) Of course, the publishers weren't happy. However, they did not change their pricing before Mr. Jobs's idea to make a deal with as many publishers as he could. So, yes, I do blame Apple for instigating this, as I said previously.


I know it seems like Apple started the ball rolling... but it's not like the publishers were dragged kicking and screaming :) Some people (probably not you) seem to think of Apple as the evil empire... as if Microsoft and other companies haven't similarly tried to take over certain aspects of computers.

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#42 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 03:46 AM

What's a premium PC? Please define it and then pick an iMac or something with the specs and I bet that anyone can find computers with the same specification requirements for much cheaper with a PC. People who own them like to state this because it helps with the mythos that was created around Apple. It's not really true but people like to tell themselves that. You can buy absolute crap parts for a PC easily because, unlike Mac OS, you can install other OS's on any computer which makes the market larger so you will have a wide range of options.


I could get into different things but it boils down to this. People who like Apple will continue to like Apple regardless of other people's opinions. People who don't probably won't be swayed either. Some people don't like or like the other for the wrong reasons but in the end it doesn't really matter.
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#43 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 06:50 AM

Shades228, I agree with what you say about those that like the Mac and Apple products in general. We do tend to like them and will probably always like them if Apple keeps going they way they are.

As to loading an OS on computers. You can, and some do, load OSX, Windows and Linux on their Macs. It isn't hard to do at all, and the OS's tend to run just fine. My iMac has OSX on it, and for the very rare times I need Windows, I use VMWare and it runs just fine that way too.

And for price comparisons, well you can do them and I have. But it is an effort in futility because if I find a unit that matches perfectly, the questions always then are about why I included something in the config that the questioner finds little if any value for. But compare the new ultrabook designs to the MacBook Air and you'll find that they are not all that far apart in price. Apple will be higher in most cases, the difference isn't huge.

Lloyd
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#44 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 07:02 AM

An article from Feb 2012, comparing a few different Macs with a few different PCs and noting the price gap has shrank (and went the other way in one case)...

http://www.techerato...p-is-shrinking/

It is difficult to find a lot of direct comparisons because the combinations of Mac configurations don't match one-to-one with similar PCs.

If you compare the cheapest PC to the cheapest Mac, the PC wins on price hands-down... and if you only want to do email and Web and little things... then your money wouldn't be well spent on a Mac.

But if you want a computer that will last (both in terms of performance and craftmanship) and you are planning on doing more than web surfing and emailing... you might want to consider a Mac Mini over the bargain basement PC.

If you compare the Mac Pro to PC Servers, you get more favorable comparisons with Apple... and in some cases a Mac Pro can outperform a more expensive PC Server. It depend on the configuration you want.

The iMacs are harder to compare... you can try and compare with other desktops but its hard to guage form-factor (iMac taking less space on the table) than a separate PC + monitor config.

You can compare to other all-in-one computers... and some of them are still cheaper than iMacs... but do you know if you are getting the same quality of components? You might be... but even so, the price differences aren't as great as they used to be.

-- I like to go fast (not really)


#45 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 07:25 AM

The iMacs are very hard to compare. Most other AIOs are all plastic casing with really crap keyboards and mice at prices that are not all the much lower than a nearly equivalent iMac. And most of them don't come with bluetooth at all, and while most seem to have wireless including 'n', it is 2.4Ghz all the way, not 5Ghz in them. And in general, upgrading an AIO is a daunting task regardless of mfg 'cause that isn't the way things are in the AIO machines.

Example, a friend bought a very nice HP Touchsmart. Upgrading RAM was quite easy, as it is on the iMac. But that was pretty much all you could do, just as in the iMac. He paid less for that than I would have for an iMac of a similar screen size, but then paid some more money to add a good keyboard and mouse to the mix. I actually liked the design of the HP keyboard, but it was extremely flimsy which detracted from the design. In the end, the difference was a couple hundred bucks. And for that difference, I would take the iMac all metal design, superior keyboard and absolutely great mouse any day. Well actually my great mouse is in a drawer as the Magic Trackpad is just so much better! :)

Lloyd
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#46 OFFLINE   Charise

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 02:30 PM

I know it seems like Apple started the ball rolling... but it's not like the publishers were dragged kicking and screaming :) Some people (probably not you) seem to think of Apple as the evil empire... as if Microsoft and other companies haven't similarly tried to take over certain aspects of computers.

According to what I have read, Jobs contacted the publishers, not the other way around. Kicking and screaming? I'm sure the publishers jumped in with both feet! With the number of sold iPhones and iPads, publishers looked to him as their savior, I have no doubt.

Like I said, perhaps I'm not the most adventurous or demanding in what I do with computers, and my only limited time using a Mac was in the mid-90s. I was more familiar with my Aptiva (yeah, I know :lol:), and found I had no further desire to play with Macs. I liked what I could already do, and quicktime was a pain to use, so I haven't looked back.

The two reasons I read about/hear from people who use Apple products are 1) it just works; and 2) it's so intuitive. I have no problems with Windows in either category, so I will stay where I am. :D

#47 OFFLINE   wilbur_the_goose

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:01 AM

One side note - Hackers are now attacking Macs. Please - if you have a Mac - install and run anti-virus/malware software. Your days of immunity from cybercrime are now officially over.

#48 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:57 AM

One side note - Hackers are now attacking Macs. Please - if you have a Mac - install and run anti-virus/malware software. Your days of immunity from cybercrime are now officially over.


Macs have been assailed from day one. There have been challenges out there with cash rewards for successful hacking into Macs.

But intelligent use means for most of us: No AV crap.

And I am not saying it will never ever happen. Don't forget that AV works only if it knows what to look for.....
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#49 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 09:10 AM

Yeah... that's the thing, whether you run a PC or a Mac... responsible computer use can all but eliminate virus infection.

Macs have never been immune, they are just targeted less on average. Linux isn't immune either, but since it is freeware, most of the skilled programmers who might develop a virus for Linux are too busy developing things to incorporate into Linux :)

Most of the virus infections result from people essentially leaving their metaphorical door open to allow them inside.

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#50 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 09:33 AM

I've run AV software on my Mac for quite some time. At first so it would catch the Windows viruses that might show up so I didn't end up passing them to friends I correspond with, and now because there are some things out there.

After a few years, nothing has ever been found with it, which tells me that because I don't go to those kind of sites that seem to be loaded with all the crap, I don't get much exposure. It also tells me that if I were using a Windows box all the time, I wouldn't be getting anything with it either.

Not 100% solution as there really isn't a 100% solution. I use the free Sophos software.

Lloyd
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#51 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 11:22 AM

Networking and file sharing is simple, bonjour is a real nice feature.

It is precisely because of the pain and suffering of sharing content (what is in the files is what is important) that I've always disliked the Mac. Needing an full-blown application to write or read a memo has always escaped me since the early days of the Mac. How many millions of questions have their been over the years about converting from MacWrite to Word or Word to iWork?

Even having to do end-of-line conversions within the Mac community slays me.

Sharing files in the Apple world is easy if you get all of your content from Apple. Who would willingly put themselves in such a position?

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#52 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 12:22 PM

LOL! Nice look at the history of Mac vs PC!

Those issues are not issues these days and haven't been for many years.

Yes, you can get apps that won't share the content with apps from others, but Office and even FOSS versions of it are available for the Mac, and most apps these days come in both Mac (unix) flavors and Windows. Just not a real issue unless you just have to use Mac only apps, which is seldom the case.

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#53 OFFLINE   dpeters11

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 01:46 PM

It doesn't take much to get hit by a virus, even for someone that generally knows what they are doing. At one point, even the New York Times website got hit by a malicious ad.

I'm a pretty safe web user, and I still use AV of some sort. I have no reason not to.

#54 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 02:20 PM

Those issues are not issues these days and haven't been for many years.

As long as you have to seek out intermediary software or services to exchange content with others, the problems remain.

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. -- JFK


#55 OFFLINE   mashandhogan

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 02:35 PM

I'm Windows from head to toe. I own 2 Windows 7 PC. I own a Windows Phone. I refuse to use an iPod, iPad, or iPhone.

For you Mac Lovers:
The only good thing about Apple, Inc. is iMovie.
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#56 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 02:53 PM

As long as you have to seek out intermediary software or services to exchange content with others, the problems remain.


Since you seldom have to do that, it isn't an issue. Word processors of many levels on both platforms have the ability to see files produced.

Send me a data file in nearly any major products format and reading it on the Mac is a non-issue. That a Windows user wouldn't know how to do that in reverse says more about the user than anything else.

Hell, it isn't even as bad as it used to be in the DOS and earlier Windows times. Remember Word Perfect, Word and Wordstar? None could read the others documents.

You're trying to make a mountain out of an anthill! :)

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#57 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 02:55 PM

I'm Windows from head to toe. I own 2 Windows 7 PC. I own a Windows Phone. I refuse to use an iPod, iPad, or iPhone.

For you Mac Lovers:
The only good thing about Apple, Inc. is iMovie.


Glad you like what you have. I enjoy using my Apple products as much as you enjoy your Windows boxes. And of course, I like that Apple makes stuff that just works... :)

Lloyd
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#58 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 03:06 PM

As long as you have to seek out intermediary software or services to exchange content with others, the problems remain.


Not sure what you are talking about here. Please name some specific examples, because I've had no troubles accessing PC files on my Mac.

There are often free apps available too, so you don't even have to buy some things. OpenOffice, for example, is available for PC and Mac and reads/writes Office format as well as its own format if you so choose.

-- I like to go fast (not really)


#59 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 03:07 PM

For you Mac Lovers:
The only good thing about Apple, Inc. is iMovie.


What's funny about that statement.... is that I don't know if I've ran iMovie more than twice in the several years I've owned my iMac.

-- I like to go fast (not really)


#60 ONLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 03:11 PM

Not sure what you are talking about here. Please name some specific examples, because I've had no troubles accessing PC files on my Mac.

There are often free apps available too, so you don't even have to buy some things. OpenOffice, for example, is available for PC and Mac and reads/writes Office format as well as its own format if you so choose.


I'm wondering the same thing. I can and do read and write Word documents, same with Excel documents. I choose to use Pages and Numbers to do it, but I could just as easily get MS Office for Mac, or Open Office. Heck, not only can Pages create a Word document, it can do RTF, PDF, Plain Text and Epub.

Most of my other apps are cross-platform, like Sibelius (Music Engraving), PhotoScore (Music OCR), and others.

The only data format that is somewhat a standard that I don't think Mac supports is MS Access database stuff, but database files are notorious for being pretty app specific.

Lloyd
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