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Long Buried/Suspended Cable Run


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24 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Eben

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:42 AM

Apologies for the length of this inquiry.
My friend has a house that's surrounded by a small forest of tall trees. About 250' from his house is a field (clear view of the southern sky). He had a D* dish (slimline 3 I think) mounted on his chimney and got signal on all the sats. Recently, the tree growth reduced the "window" to the point that he's down to 6 channels. Trimming the trees would be a bear and only a temporary fix.
His plan: Put the dish on a pole at the edge of the woods by the field. He wants to run a buried cable from the dish about 150' to an existing utility pole and then follow the utility wires back to the house, which would mean a 100' suspended cable run. He has only 1 HD receiver (not DVR) on his system. Total distance from dish to receiver is ~300'.
He would prefer to make a single run from dish to house.
Is there a brand/type of coax that is designed for burying that would also withstand suspension?
I welcome any other tips and suggestions, thank you.

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#2 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:13 PM

For the ground part what you want is "flooded" or "direct burial" cable. It has a sticky sealant under the jacket that will ooze out to fill any nicks made during installation. For the rest of the run you want "aerial" or "messenger": cable.

For the length of the run you are going to want RG11 since it is such a long pull, maybe even too long even for RG11 so an amp may be needed. Maybe since its only one receiver it will work ok. I know I have seen RG11 flooded with messenger, but will be much harder to find. What I would do is find a flooded RG11 and then make the part you need to be aerial by attaching a steel line to the coax that will do the job of holding it up on either end. You just have to make sure that the "line" that you hang it with is supporting all of the weight so the coax does not stretch on you.

It would be easier to fake the aerial part than the flooded part although you could always put the wire in conduit and completely seal it but that would be pricey but it would be much more damage and critter proof.

#3 OFFLINE   Eben

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:32 PM

OK, so flooded/d-b RG11 with a messenger cable for the aerial portion. Is that type of cable available in a spool large enough for a single uncut run of ~250'? And if needed, can you recommend a specific brand/model amp?

#4 OFFLINE   kaminar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:05 PM

RG11 is the way to go. Techs successfully use for runs up to 400' without repeater, no problem. As mentioned, buried in conduit is the most durable option.

Good luck!

-=K=-

#5 ONLINE   Yoda-DBSguy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:27 PM

OK, so flooded/d-b RG11 with a messenger cable for the aerial portion. Is that type of cable available in a spool large enough for a single uncut run of ~250'? And if needed, can you recommend a specific brand/model amp?


They are easily found in up to 1000' spools. Belden or CommScope would be the brands I'd recommend

Edited by Yoda-DBSguy, 15 May 2012 - 10:47 AM.


#6 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:08 PM

OK, so flooded/d-b RG11 with a messenger cable for the aerial portion. Is that type of cable available in a spool large enough for a single uncut run of ~250'? And if needed, can you recommend a specific brand/model amp?


Dont worry about amp since you only have the one receiver. Sonara is the brand that makes good IF amps.

As for the cable its a mater of calling suppliers and see what they will do for you. Finding a spool with more than 250' will NOT be the problem finding a vendor willing to cut a 1000' spool down to 250' might be. I know I have purchased 500' spools before.

#7 OFFLINE   AntAltMike

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:47 PM

On eBay, you can get a 1000 foot spool of RG-11 aerial coax for $140 to $150, or even for a little less if you take advantage of an, "or best offer" auction.

One seller has multiple, RG-11 pre-connectorized, aerial cut piece auctions, and since he offers a 150' length for $66 and a 200' length for $78, then he probably would list a 300' piece for $102 if you asked him to.

Similarly, there are eBay sellers who can furnish connectorized underground RG-6 for under $30, or 500 foot spools for under $30.

None of these products have solid copper center conductors, but given that the copper clad steel RG-11 center conductor is so heavy, I doubt you'd run into a voltage drop problem with it.

Edited by AntAltMike, 10 May 2012 - 03:58 PM.


#8 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:00 PM

On eBay, you can get a 1000 foot spool of RG-11 aerial coax for $140 to $150, or even for a little less if you take advantage of an, "or best offer" auction.

One seller has multiple, RG-11 pre-connectorized, aerial cut piece auctions, and since he offers a 150' length for $66 and a 200' length for $78, then he probably would list a 300' piece for $102 if you asked him to.

Similarly, there are eBay sellers who can furnish connectorized underground RG-6 for under $30, or 500 foot spools for under $30.

None of these products have solid copper center conductors, but given that the copper clad steel RG-11 center conductor is so heavy, I doubt you'd run into a voltage drop problem with it.


Thats the thing to do measure how much coax you need for the aerial and how much for the burial and contact one of those ebay sellers to make you those pieces with the connectors pre-terminated. I would get RG-11 for both sections though.

#9 OFFLINE   AntAltMike

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:30 PM

50' RG-11 buryable with connectors, free shipping: $41.

http://www.ebay.com/...=item1e565ac2fb

#10 OFFLINE   cabletech

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:27 PM

Also, if you are going that far out and burying the cable, I would DIFFENTLY do three things: 1) dig your trench AT LEAST 36" 2) 1" pvc conduit and 3) absulity flooded RG11.

When you put in the pvc, use 90 deg SWEEPS (not bends) on each end, this allows for
easy replacement or adding more cable later.


You can also get the cable from Pace International in 500 foot spools.
( web--paceintl.com)

#11 OFFLINE   Wire Nut

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 10:00 PM

1) dig your trench AT LEAST 36" When you put in the pvc, use 90 deg SWEEPS (not bends) on each end
( web--paceintl.com)

3' to the top of the conduit, not just code this prevents the conduit from shattering. It will be dry when you put it in, but no amount of PVC glue will keep the condensation out. The run will inevitably fill with water, putting the run below the frost line will keep water expansion from destroying all your hard work. If you cannot find RG-11 with messenger it is acceptable to pull a solid #10 copper ground wire with the coax. Or cut the trees, your call which is more cost effective.

#12 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:12 PM

3' :eek2:

Frost line must be a real issue where you guys are. Here NC/SC 2' is rare for coax, wouldnt think VA would be that much deeper. That depth usually is more about accidental digging then frost.

How bad is the path where you plan on setting the pole? Will it be easy to trench? Wonder if the cost/effort to install conduit would be worth it.

#13 OFFLINE   studechip

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 06:49 AM

IIRC, code in most areas for burying cable is 18" deep.

#14 OFFLINE   fleckrj

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 08:30 AM

3' :eek2:

Frost line must be a real issue where you guys are. Here NC/SC 2' is rare for coax, wouldnt think VA would be that much deeper. That depth usually is more about accidental digging then frost.

How bad is the path where you plan on setting the pole? Will it be easy to trench? Wonder if the cost/effort to install conduit would be worth it.


I agree. My water meter is only about six inches below the surface, and it has not frozen in the 22 years I have been in this house. I doubt VA is that much different from NC.

IIRC, code in most areas for burying cable is 18" deep.


I think the code applies to electrical service - not telephone, cable TV, or satellite cable. I agree that 18" is a good idea to prevent accidental cutting, but in my neighborhood the telephone is only about 12 inches and Time Warner cables are no more than about 6 inches.

#15 OFFLINE   cabletech

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 09:58 AM

Excuse me...I keep forgetting that I have to draw pictures as well as explain what I am trying to tell some one, as people do not see the over all picture.

The OP is wishing to run cable OVER 300 ft. thru a field. WHO CARES ABOUT THE FROST LINE.

I gave the openion of the PVC and the 3ft. for the main reason that going thru a field like that, there MAYBE the chance that someone would like to plow the field for some reason.

If the cable is only 18" then it will be subject to damage, if it is down 24-36" then it is LESS likely to be damaged.

In areas that I know in Calif, Ideho Oregon and Washington, all major utilities bury the main lines 24"-36" and then taper to no less then 18" to the house.

My water meter is next to the house but the line feeding it is 24" down from the main line at the street which is 36".

I have a neighbor that has his meter at the street and from it to the house (35ft) the pipe is average 30".

The bottom line, is to protect the service, what ever it is.

#16 OFFLINE   Eben

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 02:25 PM

Excuse me...I keep forgetting that I have to draw pictures as well as explain what I am trying to tell some one, as people do not see the over all picture.

The OP is wishing to run cable OVER 300 ft. thru a field. WHO CARES ABOUT THE FROST LINE.

I gave the openion of the PVC and the 3ft. for the main reason that going thru a field like that, there MAYBE the chance that someone would like to plow the field for some reason.

If the cable is only 18" then it will be subject to damage, if it is down 24-36" then it is LESS likely to be damaged.

In areas that I know in Calif, Ideho Oregon and Washington, all major utilities bury the main lines 24"-36" and then taper to no less then 18" to the house.

My water meter is next to the house but the line feeding it is 24" down from the main line at the street which is 36".

I have a neighbor that has his meter at the street and from it to the house (35ft) the pipe is average 30".

The bottom line, is to protect the service, what ever it is.


OK, just to be clear, the dish will be on the edge of a field, but the run will be back through the woods to the house, not across the field. My friend has a ditch witch attachment for his tractor and has experience with utility "burials." :) His primary concern was the aerial run. Thank you all for your assistance.

#17 OFFLINE   cabletech

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 06:38 PM

woods, field the concept is the same. As for the aeirl, if you use one lenght of RG11 with messenger, then you can do both with out haveing to splice the cable which with that distance you do not want to do.

Messenger is what the attached wire is that is used both for aeiral and for grounding the cable.

This messenger only works for RG11 and RG6 cable that is designed to be aeiral.

The normal RG6 that a sat installer use's is NOT strong enought to be hung.

#18 OFFLINE   Eben

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:18 AM

woods, field the concept is the same. As for the aeirl, if you use one lenght of RG11 with messenger, then you can do both with out haveing to splice the cable which with that distance you do not want to do.

Messenger is what the attached wire is that is used both for aeiral and for grounding the cable.

This messenger only works for RG11 and RG6 cable that is designed to be aeiral.

The normal RG6 that a sat installer use's is NOT strong enought to be hung.


So RG11 with messenger would be OK to bury (I looked for RG11 flooded with messenger and couldn't find)?

#19 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:51 AM

So RG11 with messenger would be OK to bury (I looked for RG11 flooded with messenger and couldn't find)?


I would only recommend any cable going on the ground or in the ground to be flooded. Just attach your own messenger to the flooded cable and fly it. Find a small spool of galvanized guy wire to use as a messenger.

#20 OFFLINE   Eben

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 12:22 PM

I would only recommend any cable going on the ground or in the ground to be flooded. Just attach your own messenger to the flooded cable and fly it. Find a small spool of galvanized guy wire to use as a messenger.


OK, thanks.




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