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Guest Message by DevFuse

about to jump ship to DirecTV, any chance that Dish will offer something to keep me?


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56 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:57 PM

Again, they are not Giving you equipment , You cancel they get it back. No loss there!

Returned equipment should be reconditioned. DISH has a process that they runs their receivers through when the customer returns them.

I paid upfront $260 + I gave the tech a $30 tip. He was here 4 hours , Ran about 50 feet of wire 4 12 foot runs.

You seem to be using DirecTV specific examples in a DISH forum ... Perhaps you should find or create a thread about how much money DirecTV isn't losing when a new customer leaves? Lets stick with DISH in the DISH forums ...

One can get DISH installed with no money upfront (other than 1st month service). If someone chooses additional receivers (ie: second Hopper) there is an additional charge but most customers are not making large prepayments.

And anyone who has good credit or cares about their credit is not going to cut their service without paying. Hence the reason less the perfect credit pays higher lease fees.

Those with less than perfect credit won't have the money to pay an ETF ... so they get to pay it up front when they sign up for service.

DISH's favorite response to bad credit is "buy all of your own equipment, pay for it to be installed and then we'll provide monthly service". They don't invest the money in acquiring such a customer that they do with one who can return the investment.

Advertising is not valid, thats a business expence just like an electric bill!

Not really. Advertising is there to attract new customers. There is no point in advertising if you are not trying to reach new customers.

But someone who is out or close to out should get a sweetend deal to stay. Of course make it a commitment.

If they could afford it perhaps. But you are continually ignoring the cost of doing business.

Perhaps your business has an inflated price list ... everyone sees $100 as the price and pays $80. And that makes them feel good. But doesn't that just make the real price $80 and your price list a lie? DISH offers a sign up discount and a lot of free equipment but otherwise their price list is as stated. Not a bad thing.

Edited by James Long, 20 May 2012 - 05:05 PM.


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#42 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:00 PM

One can get DISH installed with no money upfront (other than 1st month service). If someone chooses additional receivers (ie: second Hopper) there is an additional charge but most customers are not making large prepayments.

Those with less than perfect credit won't have the money to pay an ETF ... so they get to pay it up front when they sign up for service.

DISH's favorite response to bad credit is "buy all of your own equipment, pay for it to be installed and then we'll provide monthly service". They don't invest the money in acquiring such a customer that they do with one who can return the investment.

Exactly see we do agree!

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#43 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:02 PM

Returned equipment should be reconditioned. DISH has a process that they runs their receivers through when the customer returns them.


.

OK yes , But its sent back out to another customer most likly for another upfront fee.

And Dish also still charges Upfront fees based on credit score.

I paid $149 5 years ago for a VIP 622 and 211.
Plus my first months bill was for 2 months of service!

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#44 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:14 PM

OK yes , But its sent back out to another customer most likly for another upfront fee.

Existing customers would pay an upgrade fee ... for new customers it is less likely.

DISH once sold the equipment and gave credits to cover the cost of that equipment over 18 months. No ETF - if you left you just would not get your equipment paid for (although it was yours and eBay existed). A lot has changed since then. The equipment is much more expensive (retail and reseller price).

At the end of the day DISH will charge what the market will bear ... and at the end of an excellent year make a little profit.

#45 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 06:02 PM

I'm confused.

I see "Dish doesn't give anything away"

THEN

I see "Why doesn't Dish give me something to sweeten the deal?"

So...

Which is it?

Does Dish give things away or not?

You can't argue that Dish doesn't give customers anything and then in the same breath ask them to give you something.

:confused:

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#46 OFFLINE   Inkosaurus

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 06:10 PM

Tell me what where and how any money is invested in a customer. NONE!
Stop acting like these company's are doing you a favor. Big company's don't invest money in things that make them take a loss.
Again the customer pays ETFs, most likly up front lease fees on equipment the customer must return as well as the service they used. All this is based on a customers credit score
If equipment is unreturned or damaged it clearly stated additional fees apply.

So again the only one I see losing is the customer. So if they don't want to sweeten an existing customers bill then they have a right seek service elsewhere without anyone telling them otherwise.


Companies invest in products that cost more to make then they sell for at retail all the time.
Early on Sony lost money on every single PS3 sell, the only reason they sold it was because they new they would make that money back in sells of there first party games (i.e. games like uncharted, Killzone, ect).

I believe in the SAC because I've worked for both E* and D* and seen how things are behind the scenes and They do definitely invest alot of "keesh" to get a customer in hopes they will stay as long term customers and one day pay off there investment.

And I dont know about you but Dish has been very generous to us customers lately. The free starz for a year was neat, and Ill remind you they got sued by Starz and Disney because of it and still didnt take it down despite the legal battle.

Fact of the matter is a existing customer will never see comparable credits like they had when they were knew, but that doesnt mean they dont offer things to you either.

Dish'n it up for free/reduced cost upgrades.
Free Dish movers
Club Dish
Free movie packages, you just have to call in and ask about them.
The free Starz we got for a year.
Movie packages half off for 6 months.
Dish Online access at no additional charge.
HD free for life, for any package that has HD.

So again the only one I see losing is the customer.

Nope. If you leave at the end of the 2 years and sent all your equipment back Dish still lost a few hundred bucks on you. Like I said customers dont become a profit until the 4 year mark.

Tell me what where and how any money is invested in a customer. NONE!


25$ off for 12 months = 300$
HBO free 3 months (16$ x m) = 48
Showtime free 3 months (13$ x m) = 39
Starz free 3 months (13$ x m) = 39

Its already at 426$ before we even start talking about free equipment, cables, diplexers, switches, Install, the money it takes to pay the Tech, the Ad campaign that lured you in, ect.

Edited by Inkosaurus, 20 May 2012 - 06:20 PM.


#47 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 06:32 AM

Companies invest in products that cost more to make then they sell for at retail all the time.
Early on Sony lost money on every single PS3 sell, the only reason they sold it was because they new they would make that money back in sells of there first party games (i.e. games like uncharted, Killzone, ect).

I believe in the SAC because I've worked for both E* and D* and seen how things are behind the scenes and They do definitely invest alot of "keesh" to get a customer in hopes they will stay as long term customers and one day pay off there investment.

And I dont know about you but Dish has been very generous to us customers lately. The free starz for a year was neat, and Ill remind you they got sued by Starz and Disney because of it and still didnt take it down despite the legal battle.

Fact of the matter is a existing customer will never see comparable credits like they had when they were knew, but that doesnt mean they dont offer things to you either.

Dish'n it up for free/reduced cost upgrades.
Free Dish movers
Club Dish
Free movie packages, you just have to call in and ask about them.
The free Starz we got for a year.
Movie packages half off for 6 months.
Dish Online access at no additional charge.
HD free for life, for any package that has HD.


Nope. If you leave at the end of the 2 years and sent all your equipment back Dish still lost a few hundred bucks on you. Like I said customers dont become a profit until the 4 year mark.



25$ off for 12 months = 300$
HBO free 3 months (16$ x m) = 48
Showtime free 3 months (13$ x m) = 39
Starz free 3 months (13$ x m) = 39

Its already at 426$ before we even start talking about free equipment, cables, diplexers, switches, Install, the money it takes to pay the Tech, the Ad campaign that lured you in, ect.


Thanks for your break down.

Dish turns proffit even in Quarters that they lose 100,000 customers. So again NOT sold!

Bottom line again , if a customer is near or out of a commitment, and can choose what he or she want to do.
If he wants a free Hopper, he can ask for it regaurdless what anyone thinks.

Now if Dish doesn't accept, then he is free to go without any comments from any here,or anywhere.

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#48 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 12:03 PM

Bottom line again , if a customer is near or out of a commitment, and can choose what he or she want to do.
If he wants a free Hopper, he can ask for it regaurdless what anyone thinks.

Now if Dish doesn't accept, then he is free to go without any comments from any here,or anywhere.


Customers can ALWAYS ask for anything. I think many of us have said that several times.

Ask all you want... just don't EXPECT.

It is when people expect and think "loyalty" should "entitle" them to something...

Again... I am seeing contradictory terms. Dish should "give me something" to keep a subscriber but Dish isn't "giving anything" to customers? Those arguments are counter to each other.

I would argue anyway that companies should really stop with the giving stuff away because it just leads customers to expect/demand more and conveniently forget whatever was given to them last time around.

I see all the time people mad because every 2 years they don't get another deal... Asking = fine... Expecting = ill-conceived.

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#49 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 12:41 PM

Customers can ALWAYS ask for anything. I think many of us have said that several times.

Ask all you want... just don't EXPECT.

It is when people expect and think "loyalty" should "entitle" them to something...

Again... I am seeing contradictory terms. Dish should "give me something" to keep a subscriber but Dish isn't "giving anything" to customers? Those arguments are counter to each other.

I would argue anyway that companies should really stop with the giving stuff away because it just leads customers to expect/demand more and conveniently forget whatever was given to them last time around.

I see all the time people mad because every 2 years they don't get another deal... Asking = fine... Expecting = ill-conceived.

I AGREE. But customers should get an insentive to sign up again for 24 months.
It never hurts to ask!
and if a customer doesn't get something, well then they can do what they want.
If Dish doesn't want to offer anything then that's on them, the customer doesn't have to accept.

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#50 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 12:51 PM

I'm confused.

I see "Dish doesn't give anything away"

THEN

I see "Why doesn't Dish give me something to sweeten the deal?"

So...

Which is it?

Does Dish give things away or not?

You can't argue that Dish doesn't give customers anything and then in the same breath ask them to give you something.

:confused:

price breaks on products they still own.
You are still paying for it. If they want to send you $45 gift card for walmart instead of 3 months free of showtime then that would be a gift. Because that would cost them something. I already know it doesn't cost dish $45 to give you showtime for 3 months. I'm not going to tell what it costs cause it will only piss everyone off.

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#51 OFFLINE   Inkosaurus

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 02:50 PM

I AGREE. But customers should get an insentive to sign up again for 24 months.
It never hurts to ask!
and if a customer doesn't get something, well then they can do what they want.
If Dish doesn't want to offer anything then that's on them, the customer doesn't have to accept.


They do get an incentive, its called Dishn'it up. When there 2 year contract is over is not automatically renewed. In fact in order for them to get a new 2 year contract they HAVE to do a Dishn'it up, which in turn gives them free/discounted receivers (up to 3 at a time).

My arguments were never meant to imply that a customer shouldnt ask for stuff, heck im rocking a 10$ x 12m credit on my account as we speak. But as said earlier I also believe if the company says "no" then that should be the end of the story. A lot of customers unfortunately have entitlement issues when in all honesty these companies dont owe ANYTHING to the customer, and in most cases that customer still owes several years beyond there contract to that company.

Dish turns proffit even in Quarters that they lose 100,000 customers.

Its already been established that Dish is barely even turning a profit, and its not on the customers who just joined on them either. The only customers turning profit for Dish are the ones who have been with them half a decade or longer.
Dish's profit margins are incredibly low too. All your statements in this thread regarding how much money they make/keep, and profit have been nothing short of inaccurate.

At the end of the day damond we dont really have to sell you on anything. We all know your stating your opinion and were here stating facts ;)

Edited by Inkosaurus, 21 May 2012 - 04:00 PM.


#52 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 03:13 PM

At the end of the day damond we dont really have to sell you on anything. We all know your stating your opinion and were here stating facts ;)

Thats fine and I'm ok with that. But you guys can't Bash the OP for trying to make a deal.

He doesn't OWE Dishnetwork anything either.

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#53 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 03:54 PM

Dish turns proffit even in Quarters that they lose 100,000 customers. So again NOT sold!

Have you looked at how DISH loses net customers? Looking at the MATH not the excuses (such as a month without Fox channels or the competition improving).

DISH loses net customers when they do not replace the customers that leave. That is the math.

Not replacing the customers saves money. While the advertising costs are still there (they are trying to add customers) the remainder of the subscriber acquisition costs go unspent.

In the past two years DISH paid to add 5.6 million customers. Over that same time 5.7 million customers left. A net loss of 133k customers (2010-2011). If DISH would have broken even on net customers they would have paid acquisition costs for 133k more customers ... which temporarily lowers their profit.

Fortunately they have plenty of customers staying more than two years who keep paying their bills and keep the company afloat.


Thats fine and I'm ok with that. But you guys can't Bash the OP for trying to make a deal.

There's an OP? Most of this thread seems to be a hijack. :)

How many times does it need to be said ... it is OK to ask. I'm not seeing the OP bashed for asking.

#54 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 04:43 PM

But customers should get an insentive to sign up again for 24 months.


It never hurts to ask... but why would you feel anyone "should" get an incentive every 2 years? That actually makes no sense. IF Dish has to bribe customers to stay every 2 years, then it says something about the business model and desirability/value of the product they are selling.

A quality product that customers want and is fairly priced shouldn't have to be incentive-ized every two years.

If they want to send you $45 gift card for walmart instead of 3 months free of showtime then that would be a gift.


And here's where you are going where I said you (not specifically you, but the generic "you") would go...

Now not only expecting a gift BUT questioning the value of the gift. It isn't a gift if it saves you money but doesn't cost Dish any? It only is a gift if it saves you money AND costs Dish money?

Is that part of the criteria? So... not only do you want Dish to cut your bill say by $10 per month as an incentive BUT Dish should take $10 per month and kick it to a charity or something perhaps in your name?

I'm not trying to be smart here... just analyzing where you are going.

Dish lowering your bill an introductory rate OR waiving the installation fee (where they actually do pay someone to install it for you by the way) OR giving you a discount on the up-front fee to have a particular receiver model doesn't "count" because it is something Dish does with their own product?

Dish actually has to go buy gifts from some 3rd party in order to give to you to get you to sign up as a customer for 2 years in order to be seen as actually giving you something?

That's starting to be some pretty specific and strict criteria. Do you hold all companies to that standard?

How much does McDonald's have to spend on you to get you to come through their drive-thru again? Or wherever you buy groceries, what do they have to give you in order to get you to return each week?

Thats fine and I'm ok with that. But you guys can't Bash the OP for trying to make a deal.

He doesn't OWE Dishnetwork anything either.


I've never said anyone on either side owes anything. The bottom line is, Dish owes me some programming in exchange for the monthly bill that I owe them each month. Once the initial agreement is done, neither side owes anybody anything but that.

It never hurts to ask... but to expect it doesn't seem right to me. Nobody here is bashing the thread starter either. I think I only pointed out that a customer who was with DirecTV a few years ago and left to get a better deal who now wants to go right back to DirecTV because Dish won't give him a better deal is exactly the kind of customer companies do NOT fight for because such customers have not only proven that they will keep asking for more each time BUT also have proven if you wait, they will come back to you in a couple of years anyway without having to offer them the house to get them back.

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#55 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 05:19 PM

It never hurts to ask... but why would you feel anyone "should" get an incentive every 2 years? That actually makes no sense. IF Dish has to bribe customers to stay every 2 years, then it says something about the business model and desirability/value of the product they are selling.

A quality product that customers want and is fairly priced shouldn't have to be incentive-ized every two years.



And here's where you are going where I said you (not specifically you, but the generic "you") would go...

Now not only expecting a gift BUT questioning the value of the gift. It isn't a gift if it saves you money but doesn't cost Dish any? It only is a gift if it saves you money AND costs Dish money?

Is that part of the criteria? So... not only do you want Dish to cut your bill say by $10 per month as an incentive BUT Dish should take $10 per month and kick it to a charity or something perhaps in your name?

I'm not trying to be smart here... just analyzing where you are going.

Dish lowering your bill an introductory rate OR waiving the installation fee (where they actually do pay someone to install it for you by the way) OR giving you a discount on the up-front fee to have a particular receiver model doesn't "count" because it is something Dish does with their own product?

Dish actually has to go buy gifts from some 3rd party in order to give to you to get you to sign up as a customer for 2 years in order to be seen as actually giving you something?

That's starting to be some pretty specific and strict criteria. Do you hold all companies to that standard?

How much does McDonald's have to spend on you to get you to come through their drive-thru again? Or wherever you buy groceries, what do they have to give you in order to get you to return each week?



I've never said anyone on either side owes anything. The bottom line is, Dish owes me some programming in exchange for the monthly bill that I owe them each month. Once the initial agreement is done, neither side owes anybody anything but that.

It never hurts to ask... but to expect it doesn't seem right to me. Nobody here is bashing the thread starter either. I think I only pointed out that a customer who was with DirecTV a few years ago and left to get a better deal who now wants to go right back to DirecTV because Dish won't give him a better deal is exactly the kind of customer companies do NOT fight for because such customers have not only proven that they will keep asking for more each time BUT also have proven if you wait, they will come back to you in a couple of years anyway without having to offer them the house to get them back.


Fair enough! Well said.

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#56 OFFLINE   damondlt

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 05:21 PM

There's an OP? Most of this thread seems to be a hijack. :)

How many times does it need to be said ... it is OK to ask. I'm not seeing the OP bashed for asking.

Don't make me list posts please.

There was some bashing right away at the beginning of the thread.
Where ever that is.:lol:

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#57 OFFLINE   WestDC

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 05:04 AM

about to jump ship to DirecTV, any chance that Dish will offer something to keep me?

I have thought long and hard, but I couldn't find a reason not to switch to DirecTV because of the offers they're giving me. I spoke to DishNetwork a couple of times and they weren't even willing to discount the Hopper by $10 when I told them my intentions to switch to another provider. Guess being a Dish customer for three years means very little to them?( my monthly bills for the three years add up to be $4327, excluding taxes, plus a few hundred bucks that I paid for the HD DVRs)

The only reason that I have made the jump is that I really don't want to deal with having to re-learn the DirecTV remote/DVR.(having left them 3 years ago)


On 5/21/2012 -It looks really good ,the only reason I won't jump at it is Sunday Ticket.

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