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Dish AutoHop vs Networks Commercial Skipping Discussion


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694 replies to this topic

#321 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 12:17 AM

Well normally I support DISH in their endeavors but I must abstain from any support of Primetime Anytime and AutoHop.I also feel fortunate that I live in an excellent OTA area as I am afraid the networks may retaliate against DISH.If NBC does this since this is an Olympics year I just hope NBC does not restrict some programming from DISH viewers because of this issue.Let's hope the courts can convene concerning this issue and the jury solve it quickly one way or the other.:nono2:

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#322 OFFLINE   runner861

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 03:28 AM

I don't think that this issue will receive a final resolution on the merits any time soon. A court may issue an injunction stopping the practice pending a resolution, or a court may decline to do so. That is the immediate issue.

What the stations will do with regard to retransmission authorization is a longer-term issue, and one not directly related to the legality of Dish's autohop feature.

The ultimate resolution of the matter is a very long-term issue. It could well end up at the Supreme Court.

#323 OFFLINE   sregener

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 03:50 AM

I think this lawsuit boils down to one question. When someone skips a commercial with their remote by pressing fast forward or skip, they are actively and purposefully skipping that commercial, on their own. What dish has done is make it so dish now alters the stream that you see and they are the ones actively altering what you are viewing, without you actively participating in that changing of the viewing stream.


I think you are making too much of this software feature. I can see somebody saying that the remote control, by changing the channel without requiring the viewer to get up and turn the knob, alters the viewing experience and thus should be illegal. Or that 30-second skip, by not requiring the viewer to press the fast-forward button and time the pressing of play, alters the viewing experience and thus should be illegal. Auto-Hop makes skipping commercials easier, but it is by no means altering the viewer's control of the situation.

#324 OFFLINE   MysteryMan

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 04:09 AM

Personally I like the Auto Hop feature and would like to see all service providers offering this technology. I can also see the Networks point of view as well. It would be best if both sides can resolve this between themselves. Any attorney will tell you the last thing you want is going into a courtroom and having a judge make a decision for you.

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#325 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 05:02 AM

Personally I like the Auto Hop feature and would like to see all service providers offering this technology. I can also see the Networks point of view as well. It would be best if both sides can resolve this between themselves. Any attorney will tell you the last thing you want is going into a courtroom and having a judge make a decision for you.

I think it's a very, very bad idea.

Any service provider that does this will wind up paying higher carriage fees charged by the broadcasters to make up for the lost ad revenue and right into the bills of the subscribers.

This is finacially bad for everyone...except maybe Dish. :nono2:

Mike

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#326 OFFLINE   MysteryMan

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 05:33 AM

I think it's a very, very bad idea.

Any service provider that does this will wind up paying higher carriage fees charged by the broadcasters to make up for the lost ad revenue and right into the bills of the subscribers.

This is finacially bad for everyone...except maybe Dish. :nono2:

Mike


You must be of the belief that we should have more government in our lives. I once witnessed a civil case in your home state, Connecticut. A young couple were divorcing. There were no children involved nor was there any animosity between the parties. They were very civil and respectful toward each other. Neither wanted anything from the other. Both were gainfully employed and could provide for themselves. They were simply not compatible and wished to sell their home, divide the profit equally between them and to go their own way and start over. Their attorney's presented the agreement expecting the judge to agree. He did not. He said the wife was entitled to more than half of the profits of the sale of the home and should consider other entitlements as well. The dead silence and look of astonishment on everyone's faces said it all. Judges don't always make a fair or wise decision. Better to settle your differences out of court.

DirecTV customer since 1995.


#327 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 06:45 AM

You must be of the belief that we should have more government in our lives. <snip>.

Wow! Jump to conclusions much? :rolleyes:

This isn’t a political discussion. My point is purely economic.

If the broadcasters are going to lose ad revenue because a service provider is going automatically skip commercials then the broadcaster is going to make it up by charging that service provider more in carriage fees. I have no doubt the service provider will pass the increase on to the subscriber.

Or, do you think the broadcasters will simply eat the loss of revenue? IMHO, not likely.

IOW, you can’t mess with someone’s income and expect it isn’t gonna cost you more for their service. If it costs you more it’s gonna cost your customers more.

Mike

Edited by Mike Bertelson, 29 May 2012 - 06:55 AM.

µß
Since it costs 2.4¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 4.8¢ worth.  That 4.8¢ is my own and not the 4.8¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#328 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:01 AM

Or Dish could simply say they're not carrying locals anymore and use the bandwidth for something else. That would end the retrans gravy train and suddenly the locals would have bigger things to worry about than a few people skipping commercials, which most people do anyways.
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#329 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:46 AM

Or Dish could simply say they're not carrying locals anymore and use the bandwidth for something else. That would end the retrans gravy train and suddenly the locals would have bigger things to worry about than a few people skipping commercials, which most people do anyways.

Then what happens to people like me who can't get locals OTA. I have to have a service provider in order to get locals as does everyone in South East CT.

I could be wrong but I don't think any service provider would implement a policy that would potentially lose millions of customers.

Both Dish and DIRECTV spent years building up local channels to be competitive. I, like others in my area, waited until one of the satellite providers started carrying locals before switching.

I doubt any service provider is going to stop carrying locals as long as the competition is carrying them. IMHO, it ain’t gonna happen. :grin:

Mike

µß
Since it costs 2.4¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 4.8¢ worth.  That 4.8¢ is my own and not the 4.8¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#330 OFFLINE   DawgLink

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:52 AM

DirecTV user wishing Dish the best in luck in kicking the TV companies butts

#331 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:53 AM

If you're not willing to stand up to the networks then you may be as big a part of the problem as their greed is.

At some point, people have to say 'enough is enough'.


But maybe you can get 'locals' from really, really, really, really far away where Mork and ET call home.
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#332 OFFLINE   DawgLink

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:54 AM

Any service provider that does this will wind up paying higher carriage fees charged by the broadcasters to make up for the lost ad revenue and right into the bills of the subscribers.


You think even if this didn't exist the exact same high carriage fees wouldn't be charged onto the consumers? :confused:

#333 OFFLINE   lparsons21

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 07:57 AM

I keep wondering if this is an issue that Charlie should be suing or getting sued for is worth it. Other than a small marketing message, is this such a big deal that you want to spend millions on?

IMO, not to me. But then again, this is Charlie! :)

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#334 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:11 AM

You think even if this didn't exist the exact same high carriage fees wouldn't be charged onto the consumers? :confused:

I think the carriage fees would go even higher. It gives companies like Lin & Tribune the perfect excuse to charge Dish, or any provider using this kind of technology, an additional premium on top of the usual fee.

You think they wouldn't try to squeeze more money out of this situation?

Mike

Edited by Mike Bertelson, 29 May 2012 - 08:36 AM.

µß
Since it costs 2.4¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 4.8¢ worth.  That 4.8¢ is my own and not the 4.8¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#335 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:15 AM

Then what happens to people like me who can't get locals OTA. I have to have a service provider in order to get locals as does everyone in South East CT.

I could be wrong but I don't think any service provider would implement a policy that would potentially lose millions of customers.

Both Dish and DIRECTV spent years building up local channels to be competitive. I, like others in my area, waited until one of the satellite providers started carrying locals before switching.

I doubt any service provider is going to stop carrying locals as long as the competition is carrying them. IMHO, it ain’t gonna happen. :grin:

Mike



We would have to go back to cable,in fact where I live I'm between two cities both DirecTV&DISH cannot offer me both cities local channels,only one city.Cable can and does have both cities locals in their guide.

#336 OFFLINE   Jhon69

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:26 AM

I think the carriage fees would go even higher. It gives companies like Lin & Tribune the perfect excuse to charge Dish, or any provider using this kind of technology, an additional premium on top of the usual fee.

You think they would try to squeeze more money out of this situation?

Mike



Sure the fees will go higher because once a number is reached of how many subscribers have this feature,the advertisers will start leaving so an increase in carriage fees will be put into the contracts to survive.

#337 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:29 AM

If you're not willing to stand up to the networks then you may be as big a part of the problem as their greed is.

At some point, people have to say 'enough is enough'.

An interesting point but not very realistic.

If you’re a service provider all you care about is what the other guy is doing. If all the other service providers carry those locals then you gotta have them too.

You can rail on about “enough is enough” all you want but in order to stay competitive a service provider has to keep up with the Joneses.

Outside of forums like this one, the vast majority of subs have no idea how pervasive the problem is. Heck most subs don’t even know this is a subject about which they need to be an informed consumer let alone be outraged by it. Until you can get subs across all providers to say “NO” nothing is going to change.

But maybe you can get 'locals' from really, really, really, really far away where Mork and ET call home.

I have no idea what this means but ummm...okay. :scratchin

Mike

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Since it costs 2.4¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 4.8¢ worth.  That 4.8¢ is my own and not the 4.8¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#338 OFFLINE   Mike Bertelson

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:35 AM

We would have to go back to cable,in fact where I live I'm between two cities both DirecTV&DISH cannot offer me both cities local channels,only one city.Cable can and does have both cities locals in their guide.

My locals are either the four networks from CT or RI. One set of networks from each State but I prefer the locals from my own State. :grin:

However, DIRECTV does carry a couple of the RI networks in SD. I’m not sure why but we have them. :shrug:

Mike

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Since it costs 2.4¢ to produce a penny, my 2¢ worth is really 4.8¢ worth.  That 4.8¢ is my own and not the 4.8¢ of DIRECTV, Dish, or anyone else for that matter.


#339 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:51 AM

I have no idea what this means but ummm...okay.


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Personally, I think we need to find intelligent life on Earth first, but we're stuck with network execs and lawyers.
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#340 OFFLINE   Herdfan

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 08:53 AM

Or Dish could simply say they're not carrying locals anymore and use the bandwidth for something else. That would end the retrans gravy train and suddenly the locals would have bigger things to worry about than a few people skipping commercials, which most people do anyways.


IF there was an easy OTA solution for everyone, this would work. But alas there is not.

I know for me it takes 2 antennas, a power booster and a combiner to get it done. Too much work for the average homeowner or tech. But if pulling in OTA signals were as easy as aligning a dish, then it would work great. Both DISH and DirecTV have shown they can integrate OTA feeds into receivers and DVR's. But instead they decided to spend $$$$ on satellites instead of developing a comprehensive OTA plan. But like Mike B pointed out, some people can't get OTA no matter what.

The true solution actually would have been government intervention at the beginning. Instead of licensing both carriers to carry locals, a joint provider should have been created to beam down locals. The feeds would have been just like locals where anyone could have bought a satellite converter box and received the signals for free. DISH and DirecTV could have integrated them into their current receivers and we would not have had any of this holding customers hostage.

Edited by Herdfan, 29 May 2012 - 08:58 AM.





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