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Lakers New Regional TV Network - NOW ON THE AIR


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#26 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 01:08 PM

That may be, but recently they've said they will hold the line on programming costs, and IMHO if they can't reach a deal that they think is reasonable they'll take a pass.


While I'm not to sure if they will come to agreement before the start of the preseason, doubt it will be Christmas before these to come to an agreement. They both need each other.

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#27 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 01:13 PM

That may be, but recently they've said they will hold the line on programming costs, and IMHO if they can't reach a deal that they think is reasonable they'll take a pass.


I don't think they can risk it with the Lakers, they are by far the most popular franchise in half of California. Plus, Hawaii and Nevada are part of their DMA.

Also, TWC paid a lot for the Lakers rights, so they pretty much NEED DirecTV, even if it is at a lower cost than they initially wanted. For 2 reasons actually: Direct income from DirecTV, and the ability to sell advertising with millions of viewers as potential customers.

As usually however, we will probably not hear or see anything until maybe a week before the season starts, whether it is good or bad news.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#28 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 01:22 PM

I don't think they can risk it with the Lakers, they are by far the most popular franchise in half of California. Plus, Hawaii and Nevada are part of their DMA.

Also, TWC paid a lot for the Lakers rights, so they pretty much NEED DirecTV, even if it is at a lower cost than they initially wanted. For 2 reasons actually: Direct income from DirecTV, and the ability to sell advertising with millions of viewers as potential customers.

As usually however, we will probably not hear or see anything until maybe a week before the season starts, whether it is good or bad news.


So if TWC makes a reasonable offer to DIRECTV then yes they'd probably make a deal. But remember Dish doesn't offer any of the NYC RSN's so DIRECTV may decide to take the same path in the second largest TV market.

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#29 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 01:37 PM

So if TWC makes a reasonable offer to DIRECTV then yes they'd probably make a deal. But remember Dish doesn't offer any of the NYC RSN's so DIRECTV may decide to take the same path in the second largest TV market.


I don't think they will. DirecTV is headquartered here, and has a HUGE customer base here. They offered locals here pretty much from the beginning (just like New York).

On top of that, the Lakers DMA is huge. It contains everything south of Fresno in California, including all of San Diego, it contains the entire state of Hawaii, it includes Las Vegas and major areas of Nevada, and it even contains portions of Arizona. With 18 million in the Los Angeles Greater Area alone, the entire DMA easily encompasses 30 million people.

If Los Angeles had an AVERAGE amount of DirecTV customers, using 300 million Americans, they would have had 2 million out of the 20 million DirecTV customers.

However, due to favorable weather, a HUGE mess in the Adelphia failure in 2006/2007, and the fact that DirecTV is headquartered here and heavily advertises here, I think that number is probably at least 3 million, maybe even 4 million customers within the Lakers DMA.

In my Neighborhood, I have seen 1 Dish Network dish, and dozens of DirecTV dishes. And it is that way most neighborhoods I drive through, DirecTV seems immensely more popular than Dish Network.

Where Dish has decided not to focus on sports, sports is what people come to DirecTV for.

The Lakers are probably one of the most important teams to have for DirecTV, together with teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, Celtics.

Personally, I won't cry if they don't carry them. The only time I watch basketball, is with the Olympics... and even then I am more interested in other sports. So I will continue to be with DirecTV if they don't carry this network. But there is a HUGE amount of Lakers fans who will take no time to switch to TWC (which also covers 90% of the Lakers DMA, Cox covering the other 10% in south OC, and Las Vegas) who automatically already carry the networks in HD.

This is pretty much a "must have" for DirecTV. But yeah, it has to make financial sense. But since DirecTV is also a "must have" for TWC, I am sure they will make a deal.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#30 OFFLINE   kb24sd

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 04:59 PM

I forget how much and maybe someone can find how much Fox Sports was charging TV providers per household each month.

The last reports I saw was that under the Lakers old TV network deal with Fox Sports West & KCAL 9 they were getting $30 million a year in revenue each year.

Another encouraging sign is that Directv this year came to an agreement with Fox Sports San Diego to carry the Padres games while Time Warner Cable & AT&T U-Verse still refuse to pay and aren't carrying the channel right now.Cox is the only other TV provider in San Diego carrying it.By comparison the Padres who are currently dreadful and are about to be sold led by former Dodgers owners the O'Maley family & Phil Mickelson and they honestly have a lot smaller TV fan base compared to the Lakers.

Keep in mind that TWC paid anywhere from 3 billion over 20 years and up to 5 billion if they extend this new TV contract 5 more years.

So yeah I think TWC is going to ask for at least $3 a month per house hold for their competitors like Directv to carry this channel.Directv probably is going to play hardball and try and keep it to the $2.50 a month range per household.

#31 OFFLINE   shyvoodoo

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 08:26 PM

I don't think they will. DirecTV is headquartered here, and has a HUGE customer base here. They offered locals here pretty much from the beginning (just like New York).

On top of that, the Lakers DMA is huge. It contains everything south of Fresno in California, including all of San Diego, it contains the entire state of Hawaii, it includes Las Vegas and major areas of Nevada, and it even contains portions of Arizona. With 18 million in the Los Angeles Greater Area alone, the entire DMA easily encompasses 30 million people.

If Los Angeles had an AVERAGE amount of DirecTV customers, using 300 million Americans, they would have had 2 million out of the 20 million DirecTV customers.

However, due to favorable weather, a HUGE mess in the Adelphia failure in 2006/2007, and the fact that DirecTV is headquartered here and heavily advertises here, I think that number is probably at least 3 million, maybe even 4 million customers within the Lakers DMA.

In my Neighborhood, I have seen 1 Dish Network dish, and dozens of DirecTV dishes. And it is that way most neighborhoods I drive through, DirecTV seems immensely more popular than Dish Network.

Where Dish has decided not to focus on sports, sports is what people come to DirecTV for.

The Lakers are probably one of the most important teams to have for DirecTV, together with teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, Celtics.

Personally, I won't cry if they don't carry them. The only time I watch basketball, is with the Olympics... and even then I am more interested in other sports. So I will continue to be with DirecTV if they don't carry this network. But there is a HUGE amount of Lakers fans who will take no time to switch to TWC (which also covers 90% of the Lakers DMA, Cox covering the other 10% in south OC, and Las Vegas) who automatically already carry the networks in HD.

This is pretty much a "must have" for DirecTV. But yeah, it has to make financial sense. But since DirecTV is also a "must have" for TWC, I am sure they will make a deal.


I agree with maartena here, besides its waaaay too early to worry about this right now I mean we still 3 months out. For those who are thinking about leaving the D because of this, at least do some research on who you gonna leave them for... Like someone else said, Dish doesn't even carry the New York RSNs and they focus is not on sports in general, so they would be the LAST people i would look at.. If I was a betting man, my money will ALWAYS be on the D*..

beIN sports said they will have at least ONE provider at launch and I'm praying HARD it's D* right now..

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#32 OFFLINE   celticpride

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 01:36 PM

I feel bad for the people who cant afford cable or satellite as they wont have their laker road games for free over the air any more. I also think time warner will ask for a LOT of money from providers like ESPN does. anyway i think these new channels will be huge especially also having the spanish language version,BTW is the spanish version also in HD?

#33 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 01:44 PM

BTW is the spanish version also in HD?


As far as I know they are both HD. That doesn't mean they will be carried in HD, but it wouldn't even make sense to launch a SD-only station right now.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#34 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 01:50 PM

As far as I know they are both HD. That doesn't mean they will be carried in HD, but it wouldn't even make sense to launch a SD-only station right now.


I don't think it makes much sense to launch a Spanish-only channel, either, but there it is. Not with the technology that could share the feed. Dual audio, bilingual graphics.
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#35 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:25 PM

I don't think it makes much sense to launch a Spanish-only channel, either, but there it is. Not with the technology that could share the feed. Dual audio, bilingual graphics.


I think that is more about the pre, post, and halftime shows, along with interviewing the Spanish speaking players perhaps. During the game there isn't a lot of need to see anything but the game itself with perhaps a few audio feeds.

TWC Deportes is also going to carry MLS Soccer, something that carries a lot of weight in Socal, and they too will have their own pre, post, and half time shows with their own studio and crew.

That was never about the games, all about the shows around the game.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#36 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:33 PM

I think that is more about the pre, post, and halftime shows, along with interviewing the Spanish speaking players perhaps. During the game there isn't a lot of need to see anything but the game itself with perhaps a few audio feeds.

TWC Deportes is also going to carry MLS Soccer, something that carries a lot of weight in Socal, and they too will have their own pre, post, and half time shows with their own studio and crew.

That was never about the games, all about the shows around the game.


Blah. It is still a waste. For a few minutes of programming, let's put up an entire channel. I can see it for some national channels like an ESPN Deportes and for channels that have their own real programming like Univision (although those morons should have an English track to get more people watching) but the rest does not justify it to me. I have seen what multilingual countries do. They subtitle. They translate. We waste.

Oh, and I do NOT want to see TWC Deportes on CONUS. As much a waste of bandwidth as HBOL.
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#37 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:46 PM

Blah. It is still a waste. For a few minutes of programming, let's put up an entire channel. I can see it for some national channels like an ESPN Deportes and for channels that have their own real programming like Univision (although those morons should have an English track to get more people watching) but the rest does not justify it to me. I have seen what multilingual countries do. They subtitle. They translate. We waste.

Oh, and I do NOT want to see TWC Deportes on CONUS. As much a waste of bandwidth as HBOL.


I just don't think you understand the Spanish market in the Lakers DMA. The Spanish channel could get as good or better ratings than the English one. Remember it includes san diego all the way to Fresno. The advertising will all be different. It's a different world in California than the rest of the country for many things. Half of all our retail stores have multiple languages for tags and signs. Spanish radio stations outperform English ones regularly. There is no majority here. And you have to understand, if you can get better targeted advertising for different segments of the market then it will be successful. That's not something they can do with subtitles at all.

#38 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:47 PM

Blah. It is still a waste. For a few minutes of programming, let's put up an entire channel. I can see it for some national channels like an ESPN Deportes and for channels that have their own real programming like Univision (although those morons should have an English track to get more people watching) but the rest does not justify it to me. I have seen what multilingual countries do. They subtitle. They translate. We waste.

Oh, and I do NOT want to see TWC Deportes on CONUS. As much a waste of bandwidth as HBOL.


Might be a waste to you. Or me for that matter, I don't speak a word of Spanish.

Might not be a waste to the over 50 million Latino's this country has as of the 2010 Census. And those people aren't any less important than you or me. And seeing the Lakers DMA is about 30 million people, with about HALF of those people being Latino, I'd say it is rather relevant. Especially when you start to included targeted advertising in Spanish, during the games.

As for CONUS/Spotbeam.... The Lakers DMA extends to at least three spot beams (Hawaii, Socal, Nevada are all in the DMA), so I think it would be a waste of Spotbeam bandwidth if you need to use three spotbeams just to get the Spanish version to the entire Lakers DMA, while you can do with just 1 CONUS slot.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#39 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:49 PM

I just don't think you understand the Spanish market in the Lakers DMA.


Hey, he's from Maryland. Give him a break. :D
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

I am the Stig.

#40 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:19 PM

I feel bad for the people who cant afford cable or satellite as they wont have their laker road games for free over the air any more.

I would imagine that they think it will improve ticket sales, but we're talking about those who can't afford free TV. The Lakers can ill afford to write anyone off at this point.

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#41 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:28 PM

I would imagine that they think it will improve ticket sales, but we're talking about those who can't afford free TV. The Lakers can ill afford to write anyone off at this point.


They really can't "improve ticket sales", virtually every Lakers home game is sold out.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

I am the Stig.

#42 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:43 PM

I just don't think you understand the Spanish market in the Lakers DMA. The Spanish channel could get as good or better ratings than the English one. Remember it includes san diego all the way to Fresno. The advertising will all be different. It's a different world in California than the rest of the country for many things. Half of all our retail stores have multiple languages for tags and signs. Spanish radio stations outperform English ones regularly. There is no majority here. And you have to understand, if you can get better targeted advertising for different segments of the market then it will be successful. That's not something they can do with subtitles at all.


Oh, crap. You LA guys always think you are so different. There is no Spanish speaking population in DC. Right.

As I said, local fine. CONUS, nope. Use closed captioning and secondary audio track.

BTW, I am firmly in the camp that you learn the language. Culture is not tied to language. My first generation Italian American father was culturally Italian but he spoke English. There is no favor being given to Spanish speakers if we keep them apart from the rest of the population.
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#43 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:44 PM

Hey, he's from Maryland. Give him a break. :D


I live in a county that is 40% Asian. Give you a break.
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#44 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:47 PM

Might be a waste to you. Or me for that matter, I don't speak a word of Spanish.

Might not be a waste to the over 50 million Latino's this country has as of the 2010 Census. And those people aren't any less important than you or me. And seeing the Lakers DMA is about 30 million people, with about HALF of those people being Latino, I'd say it is rather relevant. Especially when you start to included targeted advertising in Spanish, during the games.

As for CONUS/Spotbeam.... The Lakers DMA extends to at least three spot beams (Hawaii, Socal, Nevada are all in the DMA), so I think it would be a waste of Spotbeam bandwidth if you need to use three spotbeams just to get the Spanish version to the entire Lakers DMA, while you can do with just 1 CONUS slot.


Wasting my bandwidth on redundant programming. I will never think that is a good idea.

3 spot beams are still less than 1 CONUS channel no matter how you dice it.

But, my god, how did all those Spanish speaking people enjoy the Lakers without a channel that is purely Spanish?

Oh, and of those 50 million, 15 are in the LA market. That leaves 35 million. How many are DirecTV customers and then how many of them actually buy the NBA package or the RSN package?

Don't throw numbers around. I gave you a solution. It works for 95% of the country and 95% of the channels out there. But you always think that LA drives the world. It does not.
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#45 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:09 PM

Oh, crap. You LA guys always think you are so different. There is no Spanish speaking population in DC. Right.

As I said, local fine. CONUS, nope. Use closed captioning and secondary audio track.


As I said, waste of three spot beams just to get the Lakers DMA. If there is plenty of bandwidth, I don't see a reason to NOT go CONUS. Nothing wrong with a Spanish RSN, there is plenty of other Spanish channels, and this would also add a Spanish feed to those with NBA League pass.

TWC Deportes is going to do a lot of their own productions. And again, there is a LOT of money to be made with targeted advertising in Spanish, also during the game. There is plenty of reason to go "full boat" with a channel like this. And the Latino market in Los Angeles is SO big, it's not going to be an unimportant channel either.


BTW, I am firmly in the camp that you learn the language.


What language? This country doesn't have an official language. The founding fathers didn't think it was important to include in the constitution, and any later endeavors to put make a constitutional amendment failed. In the conservative camp they are very split about this too.... there are the ones that think more like Ron Paul that don't want ANY official language as a federal law and have the "let the states decide" opinion, anyone that wants to run for President (like Romney) is against it because they would lose so many votes from the 15% Latino's in this country, and that leaves a relatively small group trying to pass legislation re: an official language, from both sides of the aisle. (There are some Democrats that favor this as well). All states have been able to do so far is make it the official language of their state, but they are still bound by many federal laws they can't ignore.

I actually agree with you on this: I learned the language, so can they. But the reality is.... this is not going to happen. On top of that, this is a free market enterprise, where companies are at complete and free liberty to establish a TV station in a different language, if they see it might be profitable. TWC is not doing this because they feel for the poor latinos that might not understand the English commentators, they feel that there is money to be made from Spanish language pre/post shows, along with Spanish language advertising.

And with 50 million Latino's in this country..... not only are we WAY past trying to force everyone to speak 1 language, we have pretty much reached the status of a bi-lingual country. With 22% French speakers in Canada, we aren't that far away anymore with the 15% Spanish speakers in the United States. And they produce a hell of a lot more babies than the average non-Latino in the U.S.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

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#46 OFFLINE   maartena

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:20 PM

But, my god, how did all those Spanish speaking people enjoy the Lakers without a channel that is purely Spanish?


This doesn't mean there isn't a market for it. This is a capitalist country, and TWC thinks they can make money with a Spanish language RSN. It will be the nation's first Spanish language RSN indeed.

The question is whether a CONUS channel is profitable for DirecTV. If it is, then why not. If it isn't, carrying the channel at ALL might not be something they would want. I'd say it has the potential for a lot more profit (and/or loss of Latino customers who might go to TWC for it) to get the channel CONUS than using that CONUS spot for something that isn't going to lose/gain any customers, such as Basic HD.

In the end, neither you or me know all the numbers. TWC will crunch them, DirecTV will crunch them.

I personally THINK the channel will be profitable for TWC, and will help retain latino customers for DirecTV. I also think it is an "all or nothing" deal.

All this talk about spotbeams.... we should push this to spotbeams to save bandwidth, we should push that to spotbeams to save bandwidth. Do we have unlimited spotbeam bandwidth? In another topic somewhere, where it was noted that the Los Angeles DMA got 5 new HD channels (yes, in Spanish), it was also noted that it was getting REALLY cramped on the Los Angeles spotbeam. Spotbeams aren't the answer for everything we don't want wasting CONUS bandwidth.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

I am the Stig.

#47 OFFLINE   espnjason

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:12 PM

I feel bad for the people who cant afford cable or satellite as they wont have their laker road games for free over the air any more.


There is another side to this coin. Even with NBA League Pass, those outside L.A. but within the defined Lakers market weren't likely to get the KCAL road games unless they were nationally televised. At least TWCS would be the go-to channel for all concerned.

I've experienced it constantly for the five years I lived in Vegas. I understood the same frustration happens in San Diego, Bakersfield, and Hawaii so there are many that would regard this as a boon.

Subscribed to DirecTV for NFL Sunday Ticket, remained a subscriber for international football.


#48 OFFLINE   espnjason

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:48 PM

Maybe TWC Deportes wants to be available in Mexico. I saw a couple of Lakers jerseys when I was in Cabo back in '07 and there are a small handful of such in Tijuana.

#49 OFFLINE   kb24sd

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Posted 02 August 2012 - 04:27 AM

I would imagine that they think it will improve ticket sales, but we're talking about those who can't afford free TV. The Lakers can ill afford to write anyone off at this point.


:lol:

Staples Center seats 18,997 max and the Laker games are always sold out.Heck the waiting list to become a season ticket holder is over 5 years just to get the nose bleed 300 level seats where 7 foot basketball players look like ants.We aren't the other team down the hall.Well they also sell out now also now with their flashy lob city crap.Yes it's exciting basketball but if I want to see a bunch of alley oop dunks. I'll go watch the Harlem Globe Trotters instead.

Mark my words when I say the Clipper style of basketball won't get them any rings anytime soon.

Heck their franchise player Blake Griffin is injured once again with another serious knee injury.He better learn how to improve & adjust his game if he wants to stay in the league for over 10 years.

Honestly though the whole argument of losing a lot of TV viewership because of a lot of fans who can't afford cable or satellite.I just don't buy. Sure the Lakers may lose some viewers locally in the poverty parts of LA & Socal.But also remember that what they are losing they will make up with rest of the Laker fans in the TV network coverage that use to not get the local channel KCAL 9 which carried the road game before that weren't nationally televised.That market is San Diego, Las Vegas, Hawaii, and whole bunch of central CA cities in between.

KCAL 9 was the channel that the poor, homeless, starving college student, non paying television viewer relied on in the past to catch a couple Laker road games since they could have gotten the channel through OTA.Under the old TV deal a person still needed at least basic digital cable to get FSN West in order to view the Lakers home games.

Edited by kb24sd, 02 August 2012 - 04:44 AM.


#50 OFFLINE   kb24sd

kb24sd

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Posted 02 August 2012 - 04:47 AM

There is another side to this coin. Even with NBA League Pass, those outside L.A. but within the defined Lakers market weren't likely to get the KCAL road games unless they were nationally televised. At least TWCS would be the go-to channel for all concerned.

I've experienced it constantly for the five years I lived in Vegas. I understood the same frustration happens in San Diego, Bakersfield, and Hawaii so there are many that would regard this as a boon.


Yeah the frustration was your only option to catch maybe 15 to 20 of the non nationally televised road games was to spend $189 or $99 each season on the TV version of NBA League Pass or the broadband version.

I hated that so much.




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