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Dish loses 10K net subscribers in 2Q 2012


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34 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 03:10 PM

From http://www.chicagotr...0,3988821.story

Dish Network Corp., the No. 2 satellite provider in the United States, said on Thursday it lost 10,000 net subscribers in the three months ended June 30.

The company said in a regulatory filing it ended the second quarter with 14.061 million subscribers. Dish's average churn rate jumped to 1.60 percent, compared with 1.35 percent in the first quarter of this year.


Wonder why they published these numbers now vs. when they release the 2Q earnings report?

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#2 OFFLINE   RasputinAXP

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 03:12 PM

because it means that Dish hasn't lost any real money from the loss of AMC.

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#3 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 03:36 PM

because it means that Dish hasn't lost any real money from the loss of AMC.


That's good since Dish didn't drop AMC until the start of the 3rd quarter.

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#4 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:13 PM

Wonder why they published these numbers now vs. when they release the 2Q earnings report?

This is the second set of numbers I've seen today. The other number was around 655,000 to the good (waaay too good to be true).

http://www.streetins...6%/7591022.html

The interesting part of this is that the total subscriber number listed in the Street Insider article reflects a net loss of 10,000 subscribers versus the Q1 numbers (14,071,000 down to 14,061,000) which is in line with what the Tribune numbers indicate.

I too wonder who is leaking this information in advance of the August 7 conference call.

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#5 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:31 PM

That's good since Dish didn't drop AMC until the start of the 3rd quarter.

DISH spent most of the 2nd quarter telling customers that they were dropping AMC (and three other channels). DISH also pulled promoting AMC as part of their programming packages. While three of the four channels were technically carried until the end of the contract they were buried in a high channel number graveyard.

Last year DISH lost 135k net subscribers (572k gross adds) in the 2nd quarter. After a 104k net add first quarter a negative net add quarter isn't the best news, but at least they are not digging the hole they were in last year.

This is the second set of numbers I've seen today. The other number was around 655,000 to the good (waaay too good to be true).

Not really ... Gross adds are generally a high number. The worst quarter for gross adds in the past six years was 2Q2011 with 572k gross adds. Otherwise DISH has run 653k to 958k in gross adds each quarter since 1Q2006.

#6 OFFLINE   sliderbob

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:33 PM

I'd like to know how many left DirecTV over this Viacom dispute-where DirecTV had to take off 17 popular channels.

#7 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:37 PM

I expected higher sub numbers due to the Hopper.
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#8 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:38 PM

I'd like to know how many left DirecTV over this Viacom dispute-where DirecTV had to take off 17 popular channels.


You'll have to wait for quarter 3 results.
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#9 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:12 PM

I expected higher sub numbers due to the Hopper.


Dish probably did add a bunch of new customers due to Hopper... but then lost customers for other reasons. I'm not sure if we would see a breakdown of how many of the gross additions got Hopper/Joey installs.

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#10 OFFLINE   DodgerKing

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:21 PM

This is the second set of numbers I've seen today. The other number was around 655,000 to the good (waaay too good to be true).

http://www.streetins...6%/7591022.html

The interesting part of this is that the total subscriber number listed in the Street Insider article reflects a net loss of 10,000 subscribers versus the Q1 numbers (14,071,000 down to 14,061,000) which is in line with what the Tribune numbers indicate.

I too wonder who is leaking this information in advance of the August 7 conference call.

That 655,000 gain report was originally worded incorrectly. The report said 655k net gain when they really meant gross gain. In that same report they also stated they have a net loss of 10,000. Every report is now stating the same thing.

Of course they could have all just got the information for the same source and that one source could be wrong?

#11 OFFLINE   DodgerKing

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:22 PM

I'd like to know how many left DirecTV over this Viacom dispute-where DirecTV had to take off 17 popular channels.


Of the popular channels it may only be two. But those are two very big ones.

Not all 17 are popular. In fact, most of those 17 are some of the lowest rated cable channels.

#12 OFFLINE   MikeW

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:27 PM

Of the popular channels it may only be two. But those are two very big ones.

Not all 17 are popular. In fact, most of those 17 are some of the lowest rated cable channels.


Yip. Not too many people clamoring to get their VH1 Classic back.

#13 OFFLINE   DodgerKing

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:30 PM

Yip. Not too many people clamoring to get their VH1 Classic back.


Ironically, I am.

That and Spike are the only channels I watch in that suit. I watch VH1 Classic for "That Metal Show" and Spike for the Powerblock series.

With that said, those are two of the lowest rated channels on cable, particularly VH1 Classic.

#14 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:56 PM

Yip. Not too many people clamoring to get their VH1 Classic back.


That's one of the channels I watch fairly often. Classic Albums, Classic In Concert, Behind the Music Remastered, lots of concerts and movies like Woodstock and It Might Get Loud.
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#15 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:06 PM

A reminder ... there is a thread to discuss DirecTV vs Viacom and this one isn't it. :)

#16 OFFLINE   Wire Nut

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:49 PM

My guess is that many Dish subscribers were frustrated with the upfront charges upgrading to a Hopper, so they canceled and created a new account through a spouse or family member. I agree that waiting for 3rd quarter numbers will better reflect the status of the company, especially when AMC asks a reasonable price.

#17 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:44 AM

From http://www.chicagotr...0,3988821.story

Wonder why they published these numbers now vs. when they release the 2Q earnings report?

I too wonder who is leaking this information in advance of the August 7 conference call.


The 8-K filing for the DISH DBS Corporation debt says:

The DISH ® branded pay-TV service added approximately 665,000 gross new subscribers and lost approximately 10,000 net subscribers during the three months ended June 30, 2012. Our average monthly subscriber churn rate for the three months ended June 30, 2012 was approximately 1.60%. As of June 30, 2012, we had approximately 14.061 million subscribers in the United States.

This is advance information on the second quarter results which we will not see until August. I would suspect that the second quarter results may not have a profit growth similar to the first quarter because of the investment in the Hopper.

The churn rate is up. It will be very difficult to sort out the impacts of the Hopper, the dropping of the AMC family of channels, and the continuing economic doldrums which still include home foreclosures.

Regarding why the Tribune published these numbers absent any quarterly statement context, The Tribune Company's 18 newspapers such as the Chicago Tribune and the LA Times are part of a large media company that owns local broadcast stations and cable channels, all of which are constantly seeking increases in retransmission fees. The Tribune Company is in financial trouble and the newspaper staffs are feeling the crunch. They're are likely to be looking for you to pay in your basic package $25 a month for WGN, not helping you to get WGN and other cable channels a la carte.

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#18 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 11:59 AM

Regarding why the Tribune published these numbers absent any quarterly statement context, The Tribune Company's 18 newspapers such as the Chicago Tribune and the LA Times are part of a large media company that owns local broadcast stations and cable channels, all of which are constantly seeking increases in retransmission fees. The Tribune Company is in financial trouble and the newspaper staffs are feeling the crunch. They're are likely to be looking for you to pay in your basic package $25 a month for WGN, not helping you to get WGN and other cable channels a la carte.


BTW, it wasn't just the Tribune that published this,
http://www.streetins...6%/7591022.html
http://in.reuters.co...E8IJE0120120719
http://www.fiercecab...2012/2012-07-20

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#19 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 04:48 PM

Yeah ... this is soft wire service news. Pre-written stories that require no thought. Sometimes they get rewritten with a local angle but more often they are just regurgitated.

#20 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 11:21 PM

I was actually referring more about the AMC emphasis the Tribune put on the selected four paragraphs of the Reuters story, with the first two posted above followed by:

On June 30, Dish dropped New York-based AMC Networks after the companies' contract expired and a new agreement could not be reached. With the AMC channel blacked out, Dish subscribers have not been able to watch the new season of the drama "Breaking Bad."

The nine paragraph Reuter's story, on the other hand, led off with:

Dish Network Corp, the No. 2 satellite television provider in the United States, lost fewer subscribers than expected in the second quarter, which sent its shares up more than 3 percent on Thursday.

And before mentioning AMC they included:

"The improving customer results appear to confirm that the company continues to turn around its PayTV operations," [Canaccord Genuity analyst Tom] Eagan said in a research note on Thursday.

It could have just been the staff cutting the length of the story to fit on the page, but my paranoia kicks in when a wire service story from the internet seems carefully cut on a newspaper's internet site.

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