Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo

Now that the Dispute has Ended what have we Learned?


  • Please log in to reply
167 replies to this topic

#21 OFFLINE   fleckrj

fleckrj

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 1,048 posts
  • LocationCary, NC
Joined: Sep 04, 2009

Posted 20 July 2012 - 08:55 AM

don't think you will find the president of the United States doing the same thing if ESPN goes dark.


It depends on who is president at the time and whether it is during the NCAA basketball season ;)

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#22 OFFLINE   mitchflorida

mitchflorida

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 423 posts
Joined: May 18, 2009

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:01 AM

Well, uhm, yes. In my opinion anyway. The reality is the content was going up but instead of going up to the level they wanted, it will not go up as high. All depends how you view things I suppose, but I'd rather pay $3.50 for gas than $4.00. Of course, I'd rather not pay anything for it, but that isn't reasonable.


Viacom did everything it could to sabotage DTV, including forcing DTV to give millions of dollars away in credits to customers deluging the customer reps.

As I mentioned before, I got $15 to do without Viacom for three months and I would have been fine with a 2 or 3 month outage. DTV had a lot more leverage than they thought and could have driven a much better deal and at lower costs. How many kids who miss Nickelodeon are going to call up DTV to cancel their service? Not too many would care and of course are not authorized to.

#23 OFFLINE   raott

raott

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,120 posts
Joined: Nov 23, 2005

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:02 AM

OK - who's going to be the first satco/cableco to let ESPN go dark?

The only lesson I can think of would be what happened in New York last winter when Time Warner yanked MSG off its systems for seven weeks, denying Knicks and Rangers telecasts to 3 million subscribers. New York's governor had to intervene in that dispute, according to Bloomberg News. I don't think you will find the president of the United States doing the same thing if ESPN goes dark.

Frankly, I believe this is shaping up to be the doomsday dispute that could do serious -- maybe even historic -- damage to both sides.


I'd love to see a comeuppance to ESPN. I can't stand what they have done to college sports and I don't like the way they cover and jam down our throats those sports they carry while largely ignoring a sport if they don't carry it (ie watch their afternoon shows and see what topics are covered and which are ignored and compare that to whether ESPN is carrying that sport).

With all I can't stand about ESPN, it is probably still the channel I watch most, because of the content they have. That is unbelievable leverage IMO, a network who I largely can't stand, I still watch.
SONY KDS-55A3000 and a couple of Vizios; SWM16; HR34 NR; HR22 NR; HR20-700 NR; H23-600 NR; R22 NR

#24 OFFLINE   DodgerKing

DodgerKing

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,041 posts
Joined: Apr 28, 2008

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:04 AM

Maybe, but don't forget Nick channel is the number 1 rated channel on D*. ESPN is not. Many people do not care about sports one iota. However, to your point, the difference is who is paying the bill...the kids or the parents. Typically you can find something else for the kids to do, parents not so much. :D


Nick maybe #1 but it does not bring in close to the revenue that ESPN brings. Even a lower rated ESPN brings in much more revenue to the providers than the higher rated nick. How many bars and restaurants carry DirecTV because of ESPN and not Nick? How much more add revenue and revenue from sporting events does ESPN bring compared to Nick?

#25 OFFLINE   zimm7778

zimm7778

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,158 posts
Joined: Nov 11, 2007

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:19 AM

I'd love to see a comeuppance to ESPN. I can't stand what they have done to college sports and I don't like the way they cover and jam down our throats those sports they carry while largely ignoring a sport if they don't carry it (ie watch their afternoon shows and see what topics are covered and which are ignored and compare that to whether ESPN is carrying that sport).

With all I can't stand about ESPN, it is probably still the channel I watch most, because of the content they have. That is unbelievable leverage IMO, a network who I largely can't stand, I still watch.


You mean like the NHL that they ignore now while acting like every NBA game they ever air is a ***** classic in SC highlights?

#26 OFFLINE   sigma1914

sigma1914

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,840 posts
  • LocationAllen, TX
Joined: Sep 05, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:25 AM

I learned how snobbish people can be with what they watch on TV. Words like trash, garbage & crap to describe content on Viacom channels really showed the arrogance of some posters.
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#27 OFFLINE   mitchflorida

mitchflorida

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 423 posts
Joined: May 18, 2009

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:27 AM

Some people do have standards.

#28 OFFLINE   pappy97

pappy97

    Icon

  • No PM's
  • 605 posts
Joined: Nov 14, 2009

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:28 AM

I discovered that you can watch the most recent new episode of Degrassi in HD on their website about an hour after it airs up until the next new ep airs...better than watching in SD on TeenNick!
My setup (TV + DirecTV):
Master Bedroom: LG 32" 120hz LCD TV, GENIE Client
Living room: Samsung 46" 120hz LED LCD TV 7000 series, GENIE Master
Dedicated HT: Epson 8700UB projector with 150" 16:9 painted on screen and 180" 2.4:1 painted on screen, HD-DVR (HR22), Denon AVR-890, Klipsch Icon Front Speakers, Center Speaker, and Klipsch Icon Floorstanders for side and rear speakers (6 total floorstanders), subwoofer is BIC America V-1220 12" down-firing sub

#29 OFFLINE   sigma1914

sigma1914

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,840 posts
  • LocationAllen, TX
Joined: Sep 05, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:28 AM

I learned how snobbish people can be with what they watch on TV. Words like trash, garbage & crap to describe content on Viacom channels really showed the arrogance of some posters.


Some people do have standards.


My point is proven.
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#30 OFFLINE   tonyd79

tonyd79

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,277 posts
  • LocationColumbia, MD
Joined: Jul 24, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:34 AM

I learned how snobbish people can be with what they watch on TV. Words like trash, garbage & crap to describe content on Viacom channels really showed the arrogance of some posters.


Face it. A lot of what we all watch is trash, garbage & crap. It's just *my* trash, garbage & crap.
LR: HR34-700, H24-200, Fios DVR, BD350 Blu Ray, Roku Netflix Player, Chromecast, Sony 65w850 TV
BR: HR21-200, Viso 32LX, DB350 Blu Ray
Dish: Slimline, SWM8
Other: genieGo

#31 OFFLINE   fleckrj

fleckrj

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 1,048 posts
  • LocationCary, NC
Joined: Sep 04, 2009

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:34 AM

You mean like the NHL that they ignore now while acting like every NBA game they ever air is a ***** classic in SC highlights?


NHL is on NBC. ESPN is ABC. Of course ESPN will show more highlights from sports for which they have the rights than for sports they have to obtain the rights from another network to show.

#32 OFFLINE   pablo

pablo

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 897 posts
Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:35 AM

I was hoping we'd get Epix out of this debacle.

#33 OFFLINE   maartena

maartena

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,795 posts
Joined: Nov 01, 2010

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:37 AM

For those of us in the industry, this was a real eye opener. Viacom got humiliated, that's the best way I can state it and the chatter among nearly everyone I speak to that does this for a living.

Humiliated, publicly undressed, you name it. They thought they had the leverage and DTV got what they wanted from what I hear. The channels are back up, they aren't paying anything close to the 30% and if I am a betting man, Epix isn't coming. Meanwhile, Viacom got clobbered in the ratings, have to give make-goods to advertisers, likely lost some of their digital rights and they helped their competition like Disney, Sprout and others gain market share.

WHAT AN ABSOLUTE DEBACLE FOR VIACOM.

There is no other way to put it. I've also not seen a major programmer act in such a low brow manner as they did. The sniping on both sides was not needed, but especially what Viacom had done. When they altered the video of DTV's CEO Mike White and called him a liar, that is not something you do. The 26 channels BS right from the start was garbage. The comment that DTV was only negotiating 10 minutes a day - knowing a few folks over at Viacom and DTV, that was a bald face lie and Denise Denson should apologize for that rhetoric. Unprofessional.

The relationship will take some time to heal. Redstone must be fuming.

DTV certainly lost some customers but they came out stronger from this. This was a strategic battle they picked and sends a message to the other majors out there. The message is simple, we can live for a long time without you and we are willing to lose customers. The days of grow grow grow subscribers at all costs are over, we can sustain what you throw at us so think real hard before you do it.

That's my view from inside the television world in talking to friends and colleagues the last few days.


I completely agree with the assessment above.

From a financial point of view, this was MUCH harder for viacom.

Viacom spent money on radio ads, full-page newspaper ads, and several other ways trying to convince the public that DirecTV is bad.

Viacom will have to pay off a large number of advertisers that expected their products to be shown on-air to DirecTV's 20 million potential viewers during popular (and less popular) shows.

Meanwhile....

DirecTV mainly waged a online war, which is cheap. And if they lost a 1000 customers in total over these last 10 days, I'd say it is a lot. Of course we won't see the numbers, but it won't be anywhere near the amount of money they lost that Viacom has used up and lost in this.

And yes, I think the television industry will have learned from this:

DirecTV is willing to go black for 2 weeks for.... ehm.... lets just say "17 to 26" channels. :D But is the next television producer willing to go that far? Now that they know DirecTV isn't going to be bullied into submission, how far are they willing to let things go when their turn to negotiate comes up?
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

I am the Stig.

#34 OFFLINE   maartena

maartena

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 2,795 posts
Joined: Nov 01, 2010

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:41 AM

I learned how snobbish people can be with what they watch on TV. Words like trash, garbage & crap to describe content on Viacom channels really showed the arrogance of some posters.


Those are called opinions.

I still think the television produced by Viacom, besides the fact it is geared towards audiences under 25, spread over a number of channels, with exception of Spike and TVLand, is mostly reality garbage and trash that I would never watch. But to each their own, some people like it, I think it is pure trash.

I do believe however, that people are entitled to that opinion, just as they are entitled to proclaim it was the best television since they invented sliced bread.
[Disclaimer] The definition of "soon" is based solely on DirecTV's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "soon" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

I am the Stig.

#35 OFFLINE   tonyd79

tonyd79

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,277 posts
  • LocationColumbia, MD
Joined: Jul 24, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:44 AM

I think it could be more far reaching than just directv being tough. It could adjust the balance of who has the upper hand.

The demands to get paid for programming have gotten out of hand. Satellite and cable companies would be happy to be conduits an make their money for what they do...transmit signal but the content providers started to make it all about the paycheck for the programming so the satellite and cable industry get squeezed. Then they try to be content providers cause that is where the money is going.

It is all out of kilter and this may not turn it back around but it at least slowed the freight train of companies thinking because they own 1000 reruns of King of the Hill that they are king of the hill.
LR: HR34-700, H24-200, Fios DVR, BD350 Blu Ray, Roku Netflix Player, Chromecast, Sony 65w850 TV
BR: HR21-200, Viso 32LX, DB350 Blu Ray
Dish: Slimline, SWM8
Other: genieGo

#36 OFFLINE   harsh

harsh

    Beware the Attack Basset

  • Registered
  • 18,370 posts
  • LocationSalem, OR
Joined: Jun 14, 2003

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:44 AM

We learned that, in no uncertain terms (and consistent with their previous statements), DIRECTV doesn't want anything to do with Epix.

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. -- JFK


#37 OFFLINE   tonyd79

tonyd79

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,277 posts
  • LocationColumbia, MD
Joined: Jul 24, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:49 AM

We learned that, in no uncertain terms (and consistent with their previous statements), DIRECTV doesn't want anything to do with Epix.


Guess we will have to save this post for when Epix appears on directv.

Nuance is beyond your ken?
LR: HR34-700, H24-200, Fios DVR, BD350 Blu Ray, Roku Netflix Player, Chromecast, Sony 65w850 TV
BR: HR21-200, Viso 32LX, DB350 Blu Ray
Dish: Slimline, SWM8
Other: genieGo

#38 OFFLINE   damondlt

damondlt

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 3,833 posts
  • LocationWanye County PA
Joined: Feb 27, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:51 AM

Viacom is one of the most dishonest companies around.

Everything they posted on their website, FB, and Twitter was a lie. They went as far as saying that they were not negotiating anymore.

Thats what I learned,
Also learned that millionares are never satified!

DIRECTV Since 5/13/2012:

    Living room      Master Bedroom        Bedroom 2            Bedroom 3       Office/Bedroom 4      

HR34-700  /  C31-700  /  HR24-500 / HR23-700  /  H25-100 

Slimline 5 / SWiM 16 / Premier / MLB EI  / MRV

Blue Ridge Cable Networked 30-3 Mbps 

 

 

 


#39 OFFLINE   Ira Lacher

Ira Lacher

    Icon

  • Registered
  • 823 posts
Joined: Apr 24, 2002

Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:02 AM

Satellite and cable companies would be happy to be conduits an make their money for what they do...transmit signal but the content providers started to make it all about the paycheck for the programming so the satellite and cable industry get squeezed.


Well, you can't run a supermarket without groceries to sell. So yes, the content providers do have the upper hand, and probably always will have. That's why HBO, Showtime, etc., which only used to retransmit movies owned by other producers, became producers themselves.
-- Ira

================================================
"There are no solutions to complex problems" -- Stan Littman, longtime social studies teacher at The Bronx High School of Science

#40 OFFLINE   tonyd79

tonyd79

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 12,277 posts
  • LocationColumbia, MD
Joined: Jul 24, 2006

Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:09 AM

Well, you can't run a supermarket without groceries to sell. So yes, the content providers do have the upper hand, and probably always will have. That's why HBO, Showtime, etc., which only used to retransmit movies owned by other producers, became producers themselves.


It has gotten out of balance though. It should be a symbiotic relationship. Viacom and others (yes, I mean you, mr mickey mouse) have been pushing it to the extreme.
LR: HR34-700, H24-200, Fios DVR, BD350 Blu Ray, Roku Netflix Player, Chromecast, Sony 65w850 TV
BR: HR21-200, Viso 32LX, DB350 Blu Ray
Dish: Slimline, SWM8
Other: genieGo




spam firewall