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BTN & DISH Agree to Deal (was BTN, Dish Network negotiation at stalemate)


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153 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 11:03 PM

Perhaps the local stations should just say no ... absolutely NO retransmission of their signals whatsoever. See how they survive without the audience cable and satellite providers give them. Especially in a market where the other stations have said yes and subscribers can more easily watch competitive programming.

And bringing that back to the topic of this thread ... perhaps BTN should say no and refuse to be carried by DISH.

Cutting your network off from millions of viewers does not seem to make sense. A relative few may leave for a provider that has BTN ... but there will still be millions of people who will not have the option of watching BTNs commercials and the programming surrounding them.

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#27 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 12:48 AM

Yeah, we somehow are WAY off-topic for the BTN thread.

So to get back to topic... I'm frankly surprised we haven't heard more about this by now... I guess no games until Saturday... but seems like we should have heard something positive OR negative by now.

Unless, as I said in the other thread... Dish is trying to do this and PAC-12 all in one fell swoop in time for the weekend.

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#28 OFFLINE   sregener

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 03:09 AM

What needs to happen is channel consolidation. I'm not a Big10 sports fan. I am a fan of my local college Big10 football team. Before BTN, I'd get all but one or two games on ESPN or ABC. Pre conference games were on my local FSN. Along came the BTN and now those one or two games are televised, but I never watch it otherwise. So from my perspective, the programming I like was spread over more channels (since ESPN and ABC still air some of the games I watch) and that is the sole benefit. It seems that we had a boom of channel creation without a corresponding boom in quality programming. At some point, duplication and dilution have to stop and the number of channels must shrink. BTN can fold for all I care. They haven't made my life better, just more expensive.

#29 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 05:54 AM

In theory... networks like the Big Ten and PAC-12 are "anchored" by their football and basketball coverage... but were supposed to also cover other less-covered sports. I have to say, though, that they sure don't use those alternate feeds to cover say volleyball or softball do they?

It might still be niche... but I could see a LOT more potential for these conference-dedicated networks IF they gave more coverage to the other sports at the schools and athletes that otherwise are largely ignored.

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#30 OFFLINE   bscott

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 05:54 AM

http://www.indystar....|IndyStar.com|s
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#31 OFFLINE   oldengineer

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 06:47 AM

I'm going away for he weekend but I've got the Purdue-EKU game scheduled to record. Call me an optimist.

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#32 OFFLINE   John W

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 07:06 AM

What needs to happen is channel consolidation. I'm not a Big10 sports fan. I am a fan of my local college Big10 football team. Before BTN, I'd get all but one or two games on ESPN or ABC. Pre conference games were on my local FSN. Along came the BTN and now those one or two games are televised, but I never watch it otherwise. So from my perspective, the programming I like was spread over more channels (since ESPN and ABC still air some of the games I watch) and that is the sole benefit. It seems that we had a boom of channel creation without a corresponding boom in quality programming. At some point, duplication and dilution have to stop and the number of channels must shrink. BTN can fold for all I care. They haven't made my life better, just more expensive.


Not likely to fold.

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http://www.indystar....|IndyStar.com|s

#33 OFFLINE   John W

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 07:08 AM

Yeah, we somehow are WAY off-topic for the BTN thread.

So to get back to topic... I'm frankly surprised we haven't heard more about this by now... I guess no games until Saturday... but seems like we should have heard something positive OR negative by now.

Unless, as I said in the other thread... Dish is trying to do this and PAC-12 all in one fell swoop in time for the weekend.


The latest.

Dish Network likely to drop Big Ten Network

http://www.indystar....|IndyStar.com|s

#34 OFFLINE   chris83

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 07:37 AM

I've been through cable, DirecTV and am currently with Dish. When my contract is up in the Spring I will most likely say "So long" to pay TV and do OTA and streaming, for a while at least. I've just grown weary of these types of disputes over the years with ALL the providers. I'm sure I will miss a lot of the programming, but even MORE sure I WON'T miss the crappola.
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#35 OFFLINE   nmetro

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 11:59 AM

Meanwhile, the the BIg Ten Network goes dark on DISH, folks in Indianapolis also have to put up with losing their NBC affiliate"

"WTHR's contract also expires at midnight Friday and would not be available on Dish Network if the sides can't reach an agreement."

So, no Notre Dame football come 8 September, with no Purdue and Indiana on BTN.

One has to wonder that the owners of WTHR may be a more larger push. They are owned by the same people who own The Columbus Dispatch (WBNS) - a CBS affiliate).

In the end , only 400,000 DISH subscribers outside the Big Ten states subscribe to the channel. Inside the Big Ten states not everyone watched BTN and do not care about Big Ten sports. So, how many will leave DISH over this; it is hard to say.

I am because I do not have only have two options DirecTV or Comcast. Such is life in the exurbs.

#36 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 10:26 PM

I wonder if we will hear news before Saturday... or if the "answer" will come in the form of being able (or not) to watch Big Ten on Saturday.

Interesting too that DirecTV and PAC-12 pretty much fell apart to the point of PAC-12 launching attack ads against DirecTV (and not Dish curiously) for not launching with them this weekend... so that probably relieves some pressure on Dish since people thinking of jumping to DirecTV if Dish dropped BTN might have to consider if DirecTV might be next when their contract ends.

Used to be you assumed DirecTV would pick up the sports channels... but now with PAC-12 falling through, you can't just assume DirecTV will keep Big Ten either.

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#37 OFFLINE   BillJ

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 04:53 AM

Just a few years ago the was no BTN or Pac 12 network. Dish and DTV played a big role in getting them exposure. Now those networks have joined many other content providers in deciding the cable or satellite TV consumer is a pigeon ripe for plucking. I'm tired of it.

I remember the year the NFL locked out players for weeks. Everyone predicted the end of the world. For advertiers it might have been, but I and everyone I know discovered there is a whole active world out there on Sunday afternoons. And some, who were normally glued to the TV on Sunday afternoon, never fully came back to NFL football.

I love football. I'm in Big Ten territory. But my Dish bill is already large enough to choke a horse. I hope Charlie stands up to every content provider who thinks I'm the golden goose. Inflation based increases sure. They're a part of life in all areas. But when providers demand increases of 50% and more I can do without them.

#38 OFFLINE   nmetro

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 06:10 AM

I wonder if we will hear news before Saturday... or if the "answer" will come in the form of being able (or not) to watch Big Ten on Saturday.

Interesting too that DirecTV and PAC-12 pretty much fell apart to the point of PAC-12 launching attack ads against DirecTV (and not Dish curiously) for not launching with them this weekend... so that probably relieves some pressure on Dish since people thinking of jumping to DirecTV if Dish dropped BTN might have to consider if DirecTV might be next when their contract ends.

Used to be you assumed DirecTV would pick up the sports channels... but now with PAC-12 falling through, you can't just assume DirecTV will keep Big Ten either.



Part of the problem with the PAC 12 Network, is that they have seven full time channels (one for Washington, Oregon, Northern California, Southern California, Arizona and Colorado/Utah). Unlike BTN, which has one full time channel (2 if you count the SD). So, PAC 12 would want a satellite carrier to uplink all their channels. If both HD and SD are involved; that is 14 channels. So, in order to do that, either more capacity has to be added, or other channels need to be dropped. This besides what the channel wants per subscriber.

As it stands now, BTN, again, is only one channel, and shares the HD pool for alternate football games. Certainly a much smaller footprint, then what PAC 12 is doing.

It is unfortunate that DISH is pulling the channel and I have to move to another provider. But, in this case, BTN is the guilty party here. Also, the PAC 12 is a greedy party here. The conferences of so called amateur athletics want carriage charges as if they were the NFL and the NBA, sorry folks, in the end it is still college sport.

#39 OFFLINE   Ira Lacher

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 09:09 AM

[S]orry folks, in the end it is still college sport.

The only differences between big-time college football and the NFL are that ostensibly nonprofit university athletics departments instead of privately held franchises are raking in the millions of dollars, and the players are largely uncompensated and too frequently exploited.
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#40 OFFLINE   nmetro

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 02:55 PM

I just found this (Lansing State Journal):

http://www.lansingst...dyssey=nav|head

It seems that it is not the Big Ten, but FOX. The following is from the article in the Lansing State Journal:

John Hall, a spokesman for DISH, released a statement that said only “DISH continues good-faith negotiations with FOX, part owner of Big Ten Network. We are always open to proposals that offer our customers high quality programming at a good value.”

And:


"But the current negotiations come in the context of a legal fight. FOX filed a lawsuit against DISH earlier this year contending that Auto Hop, a feature that allows subscribers to automatically skip commercials, was a violation of copyright."

Apparently, if FOX succeeds here, NBC, ABC and CBS will try to do the same with other channels. Get rid of the "Hopper" ad skip feature or else. I guess the legal term is "bribery".

#41 OFFLINE   Shades228

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 11:57 PM

I just found this (Lansing State Journal):

http://www.lansingst...dyssey=nav|head

It seems that it is not the Big Ten, but FOX. The following is from the article in the Lansing State Journal:

John Hall, a spokesman for DISH, released a statement that said only “DISH continues good-faith negotiations with FOX, part owner of Big Ten Network. We are always open to proposals that offer our customers high quality programming at a good value.”

And:


"But the current negotiations come in the context of a legal fight. FOX filed a lawsuit against DISH earlier this year contending that Auto Hop, a feature that allows subscribers to automatically skip commercials, was a violation of copyright."

Apparently, if FOX succeeds here, NBC, ABC and CBS will try to do the same with other channels. Get rid of the "Hopper" ad skip feature or else. I guess the legal term is "bribery".


As everyone said would happen. Even if DISH wins the lawsuit the networks can still "make them pay" in negotiations like this.

#42 OFFLINE   John W

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 04:57 AM

An update from the Big Ten Network

BTN and DISH have agreed to a short-term arrangement. Discussions will continue towards a long-term agreement. Enjoy today’s season-opening games.

Thank you for your continued support.

(Received via email 4:04 AM EDT 9/1/2012)

#43 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:32 AM

I just read that on the Big Ten Web site as well... It's a positive sign, though not as positive as a new deal of course...

It's also potentially positive for the PAC-12 as well, since if Dish is looking to keep Big Ten, they are open to a similar deal IF the PAC-12 will back off of wanting their 7 24/7 channels! But that's for another thread.

In the meantime, nice to see Big Ten still on this morning.

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#44 OFFLINE   Jim5506

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:39 PM

I think one full time channel is enough to devote to each conference.

They think they are WAY more important than they really are.
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#45 OFFLINE   ehilbert1

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 08:35 PM

I think one full time channel is enough to devote to each conference.

They think they are WAY more important than they really are.


That's because they are. The Big Ten isn't even the best conference and they put hundreds of thousands of people in their stadiums every Saturday. Just Ohio State, Michigan and Penn State put about 320,000 people in their stadium's.

College football is a huge deal. If you don't like it don't watch. Don't pay for the sports pack. You can even get the top 120 without Big Ten. Don't ever underestimate collage football fans. It's passion like no other sport.

#46 OFFLINE   Jim5506

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:04 AM

But, you see, I AM a sports fan and without looking it up, can you tell me who won the national chanpionship in 2003?

Only the rabid fan would know much less care, and there are a lot fewer of those than they think.

I know people who pay thousands of dollars for season tickets, that's OK, but they think everyone else should feel the same way they do, and 99% of everyone else doesn't.

It's wonderful that you want to watch college football 24/7/365, more power to you, just don't be a bandwidth hog and let the rest of us see the sports we like too.

If PAC12 or whatever gets 6 or 7 full time HD channels, how many other more deserving channels (full time RSN's) will have to wait until 8PSK is fully implemented.

If the Big 10 puts 1,000,000 people in the stands on a weekend, that is about 0.3% of the US population, multiply that by 10 and you are still at only 3%.

Edited by Jim5506, 03 September 2012 - 11:01 AM.

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#47 OFFLINE   sloop30

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 05:24 AM

But, you see, I AM a sports fan and without looking it up, can you tell me who won the national chanpionship in 2003?

Only the rabid fan would know much less care, and there are a lot fewer of those than they think.

I know people who pay thousands of dollars for season tickets, that's OK, but they think everyone else should feel the same way they do, and 99% of everyone else doesn't.

It's wonderful that you want to watch college football 24/7/365, more power to you, just don't be a bandwidth hog and let the rest of us see the sports we like too.

If PAC12 or whatever gets 6 or 7 full time HD channels, how many other more deserving channels (full time RSN's) will have to wait until 8PSK is fully implemented.

If the Big 10 puts 1,000,000 people in the stands on a weekend, that is about 0.3% of the US population, multiply that by 10 and you are still at only 3%.


Yeah they are asking for quite a bit in my opinion, having a network is just the tip of the iceberg.

#48 OFFLINE   John W

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 03:21 PM

Received from Big Ten Network last night---

I Want My BTN! Don't let DISH Network Drop the Big Ten Network
Attention DISH Network Customers,

The Big Ten Network still does not have a long-term agreement with DISH.

Last Friday, we thought an agreement with DISH was close so we entered into a short-term arrangement to allow BTN fans to see their teams for the kickoff of college football. Unfortunately, negotiations have stalled and we do not anticipate another short-term arrangement will be reached. This all means starting Saturday, September 8, DISH plans to drop BTN and DISH customers may miss over 35 BTN football games, including the Iowa Corn Cy-Hawk series.

Act Now. BTN has long-term agreements with many other TV providers that carry the network. To find another BTN provider, visit IWantBTN.com or CALL 1-855-WANT-B10 for more information.

Thank you for your support.

#49 OFFLINE   fudpucker

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 05:17 PM

Received from Big Ten Network last night---

I Want My BTN! Don't let DISH Network Drop the Big Ten Network
Attention DISH Network Customers,

The Big Ten Network still does not have a long-term agreement with DISH.

Last Friday, we thought an agreement with DISH was close so we entered into a short-term arrangement to allow BTN fans to see their teams for the kickoff of college football. Unfortunately, negotiations have stalled and we do not anticipate another short-term arrangement will be reached. This all means starting Saturday, September 8, DISH plans to drop BTN and DISH customers may miss over 35 BTN football games, including the Iowa Corn Cy-Hawk series.

Act Now. BTN has long-term agreements with many other TV providers that carry the network. To find another BTN provider, visit IWantBTN.com or CALL 1-855-WANT-B10 for more information.

Thank you for your support.


Here we go again.....

#50 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 07:53 PM

I will say this... it doesn't make Big Ten look good when the message fluctuates...

Dish is going to drop us, run!
Nevermind, we have another week...
Crickets chirp...
AAAAHHHH! The sky is falling, for real this time, panic!

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