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Guest Message by DevFuse

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audio doesn't match video when using receiver with surround sound..


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10 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   bjlc

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 06:14 PM

I have an older pioneer receiver that I use for surround sound.. I have never had a problem with audio not matching video until I hooked up my h23 with an hdmi cable to my new tv..

my tv is close when using just the tv speakers.. but when I used the surround sound, which is using rca cables to the receiver, it seems like the sound is ahead of the mouth movement..

how do I fix this.. ? thanks for your help.

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#2 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 06:33 PM

Take a look at the settings in the Pioneer. Most of them have a place to set the timing of the audio. My Yamaha is set for a 30 milisecond delay.

Sometimes, it is just the movie or program you are watching that is really off.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#3 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 06:36 PM

^ Since bjlc is going into his Pioneer receiver in the analog mode, I doubt this would work. Most delays like this are in the digital side of home theater receivers.

Your not going to like the answer, bjlc, but there is little you can do about this.

Syncing the audio and video together with HD is tough under the best of circumstances - just do a search using "sync" and you'll see this has been a running problem ever since HD came out - but is especially problematic when you are using two different outputs. The audio is coming from the analog output with the video staying in the digital realm. As you have discovered, this lack of sync is especially annoying when the audio precedes the video. Since sound travels slower than light, we are used to seeing something happening and hearing it later. When the opposite happens, it can be disconcerting.

As I mentioned, this can happen under all circumstances with HD and I bought a Felston DD540, now a Felston DD740, a while ago to solve my lip sync problems while staying digital. At $249 it's not cheap and doesn't do anything for analog problems.

You need an analog delay. In doing some basic searching for this post, I came across a pro audio Behringer piece, the DSP110, that would do what you want for around $100. It has a ton of features you wouldn't use and isn't remote controllable but would do the job.
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#4 OFFLINE   MysteryMan

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 06:55 PM

I have an older pioneer receiver that I use for surround sound.. I have never had a problem with audio not matching video until I hooked up my h23 with an hdmi cable to my new tv..

my tv is close when using just the tv speakers.. but when I used the surround sound, which is using rca cables to the receiver, it seems like the sound is ahead of the mouth movement..

how do I fix this.. ? thanks for your help.


Why not upgrade to a new A/V receiver. That way you'll have the latest technology and features with less cabling demands. For $224.99 you can get Pioneer's VSX-522K A/V receiver.

DIRECTV customer since 1995.


#5 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 07:05 PM

Have you tried using the audio out from your TV to the Pioneer ?
This might synch it together. Most of the HD TVs have audio out ports.

If that does not work A new receiver that uses the HDMI connections would be my next choice for resolving the problem.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#6 OFFLINE   texasbrit

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 07:42 AM

Audio out for most TVs does NOT carry DD 5.1 surround sound so it isn't a solution. Going to HDMI cables is normally not a solution either.

The problem is caused by the TV taking longer to process the digital video than it takes to process the audio. The TV compensates for this by delaying the audio slightly, but of course this compensation only applies to the TV outputs (speakers and audio out), the A/V receiver does not know about the required delay.

The only way to solve this problem is for the A/V receiver to delay the audio. Most newer A/V receivers have an adjustable delay so you can set the delay to compensate for the video processing. Some high-end A/V receiver and TV combinations have a feature introduced with the HDMI 1.3 spec, where the TV tells the A/V receiver what the delay should be. Note: this feature has to be specifically engineered into the A/V receiver and TV. Just using an HDMI 1.3 cable, or using devices which say they are HDMI 1.3 compliant, will have absolutely NO effect.

#7 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:03 AM

Audio out for most TVs does NOT carry DD 5.1 surround sound so it isn't a solution. Going to HDMI cables is normally not a solution either.

The problem is caused by the TV taking longer to process the digital video than it takes to process the audio. The TV compensates for this by delaying the audio slightly, but of course this compensation only applies to the TV outputs (speakers and audio out), the A/V receiver does not know about the required delay.

The only way to solve this problem is for the A/V receiver to delay the audio. Most newer A/V receivers have an adjustable delay so you can set the delay to compensate for the video processing. Some high-end A/V receiver and TV combinations have a feature introduced with the HDMI 1.3 spec, where the TV tells the A/V receiver what the delay should be. Note: this feature has to be specifically engineered into the A/V receiver and TV. Just using an HDMI 1.3 cable, or using devices which say they are HDMI 1.3 compliant, will have absolutely NO effect.


Since the TS is using the red and white connection from his receiver, wouldn't the output from his TV be the same ?

Thanks

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#8 OFFLINE   texasbrit

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:32 AM

Since the TS is using the red and white connection from his receiver, wouldn't the output from his TV be the same ?

Thanks


Yes, you are correct, I missed that one. If he is connected via RCA cables, the output from the TV will be the same, and should also have the correct delay.
But for most people, who use optical/digital coax connection from the DirecTv box to the A/V receiver so they can get DD 5.1, the TV output will be a poor substitute.

A question for the OP - why are you NOT using the digital output from the DirecTv box to the A/V receiver?

#9 OFFLINE   bjlc

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 06:20 AM

one.. I don't even know if my older receiver gets that digital optical output, and two, I don't even know what type of wire to use to connect it. I am one of the first guys to have surround sound, but after that, I am not an audio phile .. I had surround sound for close to 20 years.. ( for local info, before best buy moved into their new store) I bought my speakers and system from Sears, because at the time, they had ultra special deals of over 25% off their systems.. in fact I bought my receiver on the last hour of the last day, from a girl who was a part timer on Sunday, right before Sears closed for the day.. and she had to order it special.. I got discounts at that time, that were not available at other stores.. ( sorry Carl, but the Denon wasn't enough of a better unit for the price that I got..but I did check.. trust me I did.. and then there was the Sears charge account )

some one tell me about the digital optical output, because I thought those were just there to look liked they worked but no one ever used them..

#10 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 07:00 AM

one.. I don't even know if my older receiver gets that digital optical output, and two, I don't even know what type of wire to use to connect it. I am one of the first guys to have surround sound, but after that, I am not an audio phile .. I had surround sound for close to 20 years.. ( for local info, before best buy moved into their new store) I bought my speakers and system from Sears, because at the time, they had ultra special deals of over 25% off their systems.. in fact I bought my receiver on the last hour of the last day, from a girl who was a part timer on Sunday, right before Sears closed for the day.. and she had to order it special.. I got discounts at that time, that were not available at other stores.. ( sorry Carl, but the Denon wasn't enough of a better unit for the price that I got..but I did check.. trust me I did.. and then there was the Sears charge account )

some one tell me about the digital optical output, because I thought those were just there to look liked they worked but no one ever used them..


If it is 20 years old it might not have an optical or digital coax connection on it.
What is the model number of your Pioneer ? We will try to find the manual for it and see what it has for connections.

Did you try the RCA cables from the TV to the Pioneer ?
What is the brand and model number of your TV ?

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#11 OFFLINE   Beerstalker

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 11:35 AM

Digital optical works fine. In the very early days not many used them because the cable prices were pretty expensive, but now days you can get them pretty cheap, especially at Monoprice. If your receiver has a digital optical input, or a digital coaxial input (uses an RCA plug), then I would definitely try using one of them.

If not, then using the RCA stereo outputs from your TV will probably be your best bet like the others mentioned.
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