Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

HR24-200 Sibilance


  • Please log in to reply
55 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   inline_phil

inline_phil

    Cool Member

  • Registered
  • 12 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2012

Posted 22 September 2012 - 10:49 AM

I am a fringe high-end audiophile cursed with really sensitive ears. Let's not stoop to the cheap shots and focus instead on solving an issue.

I have a new HR24-200 with a severe sibilance issue. Connecting the HR24-200 to the Samsung 650 series TV via a BetterCables HDMI cable.

Swapping the BetterCables with a Monster Cable 1.3a compatible improved but did not eliminate this issue.

This is the only signal source with this problem (BluRay, streaming audio, analog sources are all perfect).

Has anyone else noticed this extreme exaggeration of SSSSSS sounds regardless of channel from the HR24-200? If so, what did you do to eliminate it?

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#2 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,073 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 22 September 2012 - 11:11 AM

If you are using the TV speakers, try adjusting your EQ since there are no adjustments in the HR receivers.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#3 OFFLINE   inline_phil

inline_phil

    Cool Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 12 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2012

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:07 PM

Thanks for the thought but my system is not connected in this manner.

Here's the scheme:

HR24-200>HDMI>Samsung 650>RCA>Preamp>RCA>Power Amp>Speakers

I do not have a digital optical input on the Samsung TV or the Preamp.

#4 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,073 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:25 PM

My Samsung LN46A650 has an Equalizer.
Menu, Sound, Equalizer

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#5 OFFLINE   inline_phil

inline_phil

    Cool Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 12 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2012

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:48 PM

When running the outputs through the RCA jacks, the EQ in the 650 series is defeated. EQ works with the built-in speakers only.

Tested absolute electrical phase of the receiver and outboard LNB power supply just now. Receiver was fine but the outboard PS was wrong. After correcting it, there was no audible improvement.

#6 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,073 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:49 PM

Thanks for the thought but my system is not connected in this manner.

Here's the scheme:

HR24-200>HDMI>Samsung 650>RCA>Preamp>RCA>Power Amp>Speakers

I do not have a digital optical input on the Samsung TV or the Preamp.


We run both our systems by running video direct to the TV and an Optical or Digital coax from the receiver to the Yamaha AV receiver.
The sound is way better than using the red and white connectors.

Have you tried bypassing the TV and run the red and white cables directly to the Preamp from the HR24 ?
All outputs are live all the time on the HR24.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#7 OFFLINE   inline_phil

inline_phil

    Cool Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 12 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2012

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:57 PM

Not yet, but I plan to. Watcing thw WV game now and my wife is a huge fan. I'd risk...well you get the iedea. Stay tuned.

#8 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,073 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 22 September 2012 - 12:59 PM

I hear that !
LOL

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#9 OFFLINE   inline_phil

inline_phil

    Cool Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 12 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2012

Posted 23 September 2012 - 04:49 AM

Tried swapping the audio cables and comparing the two. Results were this: sibilance persisted in both cases.

This I presume is the last ghasp at rectifying this issue from an external approach.

Any chances of someone having a schematic for this beast?

#10 OFFLINE   The Merg

The Merg

    1*

  • Registered
  • 10,227 posts
  • LocationNorthern VA
Joined: Jun 24, 2007

Posted 23 September 2012 - 07:42 AM

When running the outputs through the RCA jacks, the EQ in the 650 series is defeated. EQ works with the built-in speakers only.

Tested absolute electrical phase of the receiver and outboard LNB power supply just now. Receiver was fine but the outboard PS was wrong. After correcting it, there was no audible improvement.


Just as a point of reference, what happens if you use the TV's built-in speakers and adjust the EQ then? Does that resolve the issue?

- Merg

Today's problems don't worry me, I haven't solved yesterday's yet.

SlimLine-3 Dish w/ SWM16 (HD Service / WHDVR) / Full Setup
HR34-700 / Panasonic TC-P50G25 HDTV / HDMI / Networked - DECA / Family Room
HR44-700 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom

HR24-100 / Samsung HCM5525W HDTV / Component / Networked - DECA / Bedroom


#11 OFFLINE   studechip

studechip

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 925 posts
Joined: Apr 16, 2012

Posted 23 September 2012 - 08:08 AM

Are you hearing the hissing only from the tv or through your amp also? I'm confused as to why you have your connections as they are. I'm assuming you are not running the rest of your audio connections through your tv, so why are you using the Samsung to route the audio for the HR24? Try going directly to the pre/power amp from the HR24 and see if that helps.

#12 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 3,073 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 23 September 2012 - 09:45 AM

phil

Have you gone into Menu, Settings, Audio and turned Dolby Digital to OFF and see how that sounds ?

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM,   HR24-100 HDMI to 32" Sharp LED,
HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#13 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

Carl Spock

    Superfly

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 4,567 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2004

Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:16 AM

Thanks for the thought but my system is not connected in this manner.

Here's the scheme:

HR24-200>HDMI>Samsung 650>RCA>Preamp>RCA>Power Amp>Speakers

I do not have a digital optical input on the Samsung TV or the Preamp.


As another audiofool, why are you going through your TV? Is it just for the volume control? Do you have a remote controlled volume control on the preamp you could use instead?

I think jimmie57 is onto some things.

1) If you can, go digital out from your receiver to the preamp. Bypass the television and stay in the digital realm. You probably won't have as many lip sync issues this way, too. This would be a lot simpler signal path with less chance of problems.

2) If you can't stay digital from the DVR to the preamp, at least bypass the television if you can, that is, if you don't need its volume control.

3) Make sure your receiver is switched out of Dolby Digital to PCM. You aren't getting Dolby Digital out, anyway, going with your analog feed.

Televisions are notorious for having terrible audio stages. I've got to think your problem lies there. Do what you have to do to get it out of the system. Even if your preamp isn't remote controllable (many high end ones aren't), you can at least test this theory by temporarily running an RCA from the DVR into the preamp and see if your sibilance issues go away.

Until then, you have my sympathy.

Posted Image
hangin' with the bros at 40 Eridani A

#14 OFFLINE   spartanstew

spartanstew

    Dry as a bone

  • Registered
  • 12,427 posts
  • LocationWylie, Texas
Joined: Nov 16, 2005

Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:49 AM

I am a fringe high-end audiophile


HR24-200>HDMI>Samsung 650>RCA>Preamp>RCA>Power Amp>Speakers


FAIL

I'm sure Directv can't wait to get their hands on your unit.

 
Directv customer since 2000

#15 OFFLINE   P Smith

P Smith

    Mr. FixAnything

  • Registered
  • 19,697 posts
  • LocationBay Area
Joined: Jul 25, 2002

Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:17 PM

FAIL

Yeah, that's looks against OP self characterization:
HR24-200>HDMI>Samsung 650>RCA>Preamp>RCA>Power Amp>Speakers

It would be good to know what is "Preamp" and what is "Power Amp". Perhaps what is used on far end: "Speakers" ?

#16 OFFLINE   JerryMeeker

JerryMeeker

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 145 posts
Joined: Sep 20, 2007

Posted 23 September 2012 - 09:51 PM

I would bet that not many HR24 users are using the analog outputs from the DVR. Most of use use a digital output, either HDMI or optical. It is entirely possible that there is something wrong with the analog output, either in general, or on his specific unit. The obvious recommendation, as several have pointed out, is to switch to a digital connection directly to the preamp. We need to have more information from the OP with regards to the capabilities of the preamp--it may not have an available digital input.

#17 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,675 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 23 September 2012 - 11:24 PM

I am a fringe high-end audiophile cursed with really sensitive ears.


If so why use analog audio?

Since you don't say what preamp and power amp you use none of us know if it supports digital. If it does, which I would think a "high-end audiophile" would have a digital AVR, you should run your HDMI to your AVR then to your TV.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#18 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

Carl Spock

    Superfly

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 4,567 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2004

Posted 24 September 2012 - 01:16 AM

I wish the OP would return to answer some of our questions but I can think of a situation where an audiophile would need the analog out of his DVR. He might be using some old gear for the audio system.

I have a bunch of old audio electronics lying around, including three analog preamps from the 1980s: a Frank Van Alstine modified Dynaco PAS2, a NAD 1300 and a Mark Levinson ML-7. I am an audio pack rat but there are other folks like me. This old gear comes out of my basement storage room every now and then, usually because something breaks in my two channel, vinyl playback system. I could make up an outstanding two channel system for video use with analog equipment I own that rarely gets used. If television is not a big thing for the OP, and for some audiophiles it isn't, he might well use discarded electronics for his TV sound.

None of those 1980s preamps I own have digital inputs or remote controls. That's why he might be running his analog audio through his TV for a remote volume control, and why I asked the questions I did in my post upthread.

Hey, inline_phil, come back and tell us what's going on with your system.
hangin' with the bros at 40 Eridani A

#19 OFFLINE   spacemanrocks

spacemanrocks

    New Member

  • Registered
  • 3 posts
Joined: Sep 11, 2012

Posted 26 September 2012 - 07:52 AM

My first post yay!

I just had direct hooked up at my apartment yesterday and love it beyond words. I too noticed this issue on my HR24-200 once the installer left. Currently using a Sony A/V 7.1 receiver and have the HR24, a PS3 and a WDTV Live Hub all hooked up via HDMI. The PS3 and WDTV didn't show the same symptoms, so I went in and switched Dolby Digital off (as was suggested above). Lowered the treble a few points on the A/V receiver for that source and now it sounds beautiful :)

#20 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 20,067 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 26 September 2012 - 09:12 AM

My first post yay!

I just had direct hooked up at my apartment yesterday and love it beyond words. I too noticed this issue on my HR24-200 once the installer left. Currently using a Sony A/V 7.1 receiver and have the HR24, a PS3 and a WDTV Live Hub all hooked up via HDMI. The PS3 and WDTV didn't show the same symptoms, so I went in and switched Dolby Digital off (as was suggested above). Lowered the treble a few points on the A/V receiver for that source and now it sounds beautiful :)


A few yearsssss ago we had a "Sssssibilance" thread. We had a lot of fun with that. Don't remember what it wasssss all about, but if you ssssssearch for it, you may find help there. Persssssonlally, I've never has a sssssibilance problem with my 24-200ssssss, both gone now, but the sssssound was perfect running thru one of my ssssssound sssssystems.

To quote Harsh, "My precioussssssss."

Rich




spam firewall