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Guest Message by DevFuse

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HR24-200 Sibilance

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55 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   TomCat


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Posted 17 October 2012 - 11:27 AM

inline_phil does have a point about TV sound.

In general, it is very compressed and with poor response at the frequency extremes.


Well, Carl, since it is no longer 1998, and speaking as a long-time broadcasting Engineer I would have a very hard time agreeing with this generalization. It may apply to some lower-rated channels with low budgets or to SD-only channels that have not upgraded to digital audio chains, but I think the tendency even there is that things have improved greatly over the last few years.

For medium-to-large market broadcast and for 95% of cable networks audio is sent as AC-3 and is likely processed through an all-digital chain prior to that. If not, it is likely processed in a high-quality analog equipment at certain stages. In either case, frequency response is characteristically flat between about 50 to 15K, and in most cases well beyond that.

Also, one of the benefits of digital delivery is that the dynamic range is much greater, and that there is not the need for the conventional level-compression that we saw with analog TV or cable. For most stations and networks, final processing is done very intelligently and effectively, and much, much better than it was just a decade ago.

Digital also allows us to not use compression as a tool to keep levels constant, which was the poorly-implemented goal during the analog era. New equipment uses sophisticated techniques such as BS.1770-2, which aims to keep dialog at the same level, and is exceptionally effective at doing just that. The implementation of the CALM act this year coupled with this technology will very-quickly make uneven audio levels a distant memory, while preserving full dynamic range at the same time.

(And if you were actually speaking about digital compression rather than dynamic range compression, AC-3/DD is far less compressed than MP3 and has a far better quality than MP3; about the only thing that can beat it, and not by much, is DTS. If you want to hear badly-compressed audio, go to satellite radio or Pandora).

Not all sources live up to these new standards just yet, but the vast majority do. Had you made your statement pre 911, I would have to agree with you. But its 2012, and things have changed greatly, at least for the most part.
It's usually safe to talk honestly and openly with people because they typically are not really listening anyway.

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#52 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 03:24 PM

^ I stand corrected. Nice to know the situation has improved that much. :)

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inline_phil, have I got the deal for you!

(You know how many stereo salesmen it takes to screw in a lightbulb? Three, but that's today only.)

I got an email from Music Direct this afternoon and they have a great selection of the Pro-Ject Box Design units on close-out. One of them has your name on it.

I assume you are familiar with Pro-Ject, the Austrian audiophile turntable manufacturer. They also make the Box Design line, with a bunch of cool, very inexpensive, application specific, problem solving boxes for sale. I just bought the USB D/A to upgrade my computer sound. It's only $119. Unfortunately, not on sale is the Pro-Ject D/A which I recommended upthread. I'd buy one of those, too.

But for you, inline_phil, they have two very inexpensive remote controlled preamps on sale. Here's your opportunity to banish the TV's volume control from your system. I can guarantee either one of these puppies will make your video system sound a lot better. And if it doesn't, Music Direct has a 30 day return policy.

One is just $199 (reg. $350). It has only two inputs but does have a motorized volume control for the remote. The other has four inputs and an electronic volume control. It's only $249 (reg. $500). If you wanted more inputs, go with this one.

Do it, Phil. Buy one of these. The smaller one probably has an Alps volume control in it. It will sonically stomp all over the preamp/volume control built into your TV.

Edited by Carl Spock, 17 October 2012 - 04:22 PM.

hangin' with the bros at 40 Eridani A

#53 OFFLINE   Carl Spock

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Posted 20 October 2012 - 06:10 AM

Bump for inline_phil: act now or forever hold your piece...

...of plastic remote for your TV to adjust your volume.

The better preamp is now sold out. I was looking at it yesterday to replace a NAD 1300 preamp that's stopped exciting electrons in one channel. I bought the NAD used 15 years ago for $130 so I can't complain. The less expensive preamp is still available.

I got in my USB D/A box. It's about as basic as it gets: a USB port and audio jacks. Not a switch on its metal case. I do like the aluminum faceplate. This piece has heft.

The USB D/A sold out in less than a day. BTW, mine is new. There is a model change going on. It seems the difference between the piece I bought and the new one is purely cosmetic.

I'll let you know how it sounds.
hangin' with the bros at 40 Eridani A

#54 OFFLINE   inline_phil


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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:56 AM


The old DVR was swapped today and it fixed the problem. Regarding the replacement preamps, the Dared I have is a bit nicer than the gear you suggested and it does have an RF (not an IR) remote volume control. Line level from the Samsung goes into this preamp, not the variable. At one time, I owned a Pro-Ject turntable and yes I am familiar with the gear. Nice to know that they are still making strides in the high end.

This technician (another one) was amazed at the difference the new unit made also being able to hear exactly what my complaint was.

I've only been watching/listening for a little over an hour and it sounds pretty decent, MUCH better than the old DVR.

Thanks for all of the suggestions and jabs. I am finally happy and that is what matters.


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and my blog at http://audiophile-mu...s.blogspot.com/

#55 OFFLINE   jimmie57


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Posted 01 November 2012 - 08:04 AM

Thanks for the update. Glad changing the receiver fixed your problem. You certainly went thru a lot of trials to find the problem and it was just what you thought in the beginning.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM, HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD

#56 OFFLINE   CCarncross


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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:21 AM

I dont remember, but was that the only D* receiver you had at your place, seems like just swapping it out would have been something you could have done on day 1...I dont know what your history was before this thread, upgraded from another model, or were a brand new D* customer etc...I have 3 receivers at my place, so it would be very easy to swap one out if I suspected the problem might be a particular unit and not system-wide.

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